Should Government Pay?

[Shaggyb2000]

a quick poll for allnurses.com members. reply with a "yes" or "no" please.

does the federal constitution give the american federal government the authority or power to collect money in the form of taxes to pay for the health care for anyone who wants or needs it?

[CHATSDALE]

one post states that as an example of what should not be covered as rhinoplasty or viagra

who is to determine what is or is not covered in universal care

would you want very expensive fertility coverage when you might be able to take care of several sick children for the same amount of money

plastic surgery can be of great help for a burn victim or a birth defect that could be corrected and add quality to a life even if it is not life threatening

would providers have the option to not be involved

would this be called involuntary servitude

would doctors or nurses not go into a field if the financial rewards not be worth amount of studying and expense

can and should are not the same thing

[RainDreamer, BSN, RN]

even in the single payer universal systems it;s only 'free (or there abouts) at the point of delivery ' for eligible residents of the country in question ( be they citiziens of the that country, citiziens of countires with reciprocal health coverage agreements e.g. the 'E111' counties of europe or others deemed eligible by the system)

in the case of the NHS Ambulance and A+E treatment is free unless you are involved in an RTC ( when themotor insurer can be billed) - as a non eligable individual if you get admitted to an nHS hospital you will be billed but and there are sysems to recover the costs - assuming that when you are booked into the hospital the correct data is input over your NHS eligibility...

Then why when illegal immigrants have hundreds of thousands of dollars in hospital bills, they're put on the state plan, and then we pay for it? They're not even paying into the system, yet we'll take care of everything :uhoh21:

[Shaggyb2000]

Just a few of the numerous statements by our founders demonstrate that their vision and the vision of Shadegg's Enumerated Powers Act are one and the same. James Madison, in explaining the Constitution in Federalist Paper No. 45, said, "The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are FEW and DEFINED. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite. The former will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce."

Regarding the "general welfare" clause so often used as a justification for bigger government, Thomas Jefferson said, "Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those SPECIFICALLY ENUMERATED." James Madison said, "If Congress can do whatever in their discretion can be done by money, and will promote the general welfare, the government is no longer a limited one possessing enumerated powers, but an indefinite one subject to particular exceptions."

[jojotoo, RN]

No. Neither the moral or legal right.

[EmmaG, RN]

Well then, I guess he should have been more specific.

[gentle]

No, not at this time. Too many variables to be considered.

[ShyGecko]

No, I don't think so. In order for this to work, the taxes would be so high, there would be no incentive to work b/c the majority of your pay would go to the government.

[MB37]

YES!! Most of Europe provides health care to all, and Guiliani's misquoted statistics aside, they generally have longer life expectancies than we do. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

Our government does many, many things that are not specifically enumerated in the constitution, and the thing was written over 200 years ago. As others have said, the orignial writers could not have possibly foreseen all the advances in technology and health care that have come to pass.

As for people getting off their lazy rears and getting a job, how about the stat I read in yesterday's paper (St. Petersburg Times, business section) that 25% of Florida's UNDER 65 population is without health insurance. I spent several years working full time, making enough money to pay my rent, light bill, and eat, with a little left over, but my employers chose not to offer health insurance. I worked in bars and restaurants, and most of them either choose not to offer insurance, or they juggle your hours enough that you don't qualify (i.e. you must work 29 hours/week for an entire year to qualify - not an average, but every week you must be over that number. Then you have pinkeye and would rather not spread it to every customer in the restaurant. Or they simply start cutting you early and giving you no choice about going home). For all those years, I had consistently high BP readings when I went to planned parenthood to get BC. I couldn't afford to see a doctor to get on meds, and was afraid to even if I saved up the money because I thought I might get eventually denied insurance for preexisting hypertension. So, it went untreated until after the wedding, and now I'm on two different meds and it's still consistently over 120/80. All that time, I made too much to qualify for government assistance but too little to afford private insurance after taxes.

[RainDreamer, BSN, RN]

At some point you have to say "enough's enough, I'm going for something better".

If people didn't put up with employers taking advantage of them and treating them like aboslute crap (not giving them health insurance, messing with their hours so they don't qualify, etc, etc), then how can they stay in business? After a while they'll bottom out. But that won't happen because people put up with it. And since people put up with it, why should they change their ways if they can get away with it?

[ZippyGBR, BSN, RN]

No, I don't think so. In order for this to work, the taxes would be so high, there would be no incentive to work b/c the majority of your pay would go to the government.

23 % income tax with 5000 gbp (or more ,unless you have a company car) tax free allowance

total tax take under a third on income ( ok there are local authority charges and VAT on some goods and services plus fuel duty on petrol and diesel and duty on alcohol and tobacco ) ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_in_the_United_Kingdom

[HM2VikingRN, RN]

Common Defense: Bioterrorism,

General Welfare: healthy children and adults are a broad resource both to themselves, and society at large...

2 instant arguments for Congress having both the right and obligation to institute single payer and assure access to affordable care.