Shocked and Floored-Chronic Pain Mgmt

Nurses General Nursing

Published

I received quite an education this week. I have been a nurse for many years but for the first time I am on the patient end of pain management for MS. I find myself still slowly shaking my head over my experience. I guess I just want to share what happened and I don't know a better place to get some thoughts other than here.

I arrive at my 8AM appt about 10 minutes early to find about 10 people waiting. We all had 8AM appts. More people kept showing up to the point that there were no chairs left and people were standing outside. I gave up my chair to an elderly lady that clearly could not tolerate standing. I went outside and waited with a group of people.

They all knew one another, they knew one another's diagnosis, med list, history, the works. One lady mentioned she hadn't seen me before and I must be new. I said I was. She asked my diagnosis.... Really? Okay, I guess I don't mind and I explained that I have MS. A few asked some questions about MS and I responded.

The receptionist came out with a mound of paperwork for me to complete, some of it was... quite frankly, stupid. One was a page where I was supposed to draw a picture of how I perceive my pain. Not a silhouette where you put an "X" where you experience pain (that was another page) but an actual drawing of HOW you perceive pain. I just wrote no, this is stupid.

Then a consent for opioids with an explanation that they can be addictive, etc. I drew a line through the page and wrote "refused" with a note at the bottom "No narcotics please." That little note turned into a ****-storm later.

I turned the completed paperwork in and the receptionist came outside handing me a new consent for opioids and I explained I don't want any narcotics she asked if I was refusing treatment and I told her no, I was refusing narcotics. She said I *had* to sign it, I explained I do not have to sign anything. She rolled her eyes at me and walked back in the office.

The other patients hearing all this started quizzing me, what did I want if I don't want narcotics. I explained there are many options for pain management, not just narcotics. One lady explained to me that people like me make it harder for people who do need narcotics, two others agreed. Seriously??

I stood there for an hour listening to these people. I couldn't believe what I was hearing and seeing. One patient with his arm in a cast was sooo drunk he could hardly stand and he had a beer in his hand. Another guy was walking from person to person offering to sell "weed" and those that didn't have money he would deliver locally for a $5.00 fee. Let me tell you, he was quite the salesman and amazingly pushy.

Then they all started comparing withdrawal stories and laughing about how funny it is. One lady couldn't pay her rent one month so she sold her percocet and went into immediate withdrawal. I asked her what she did, she said she went to ER and they gave her 3 day supply. One man complained that he was being given too many meds and he just stopped cold turkey and spent three weeks vomiting and shaking. However, most complained that they were not getting enough meds.

Then they started talking about EMGs and epidurals. Everyone has had both. I asked, is this common with this doctor? They said yes, he requires everyone get them. I asked why, they said he won't give you narcotics unless you line his wallet and extra diagnostics are just part of the deal. SERIOUSLY?

Finally the medical asst called me back to an exam room and chastised me for not signing the opioid consent form. Again I was asked if I was refusing treatment and again I explained I am merely declining narcotics. Again, she told me I *had* to sign it and again I explained I do not have to sign anything. In comes a 2nd lady and it was a repeat of the above. Then a 3rd lady comes in and she's the office manager and another repeat of the above.

One of the reasons I got out of ER nursing was the constant influx of narcotic seekers, especially on weekends. When the very rare patient declined morphine and requested Toradol I wanted to HUG them and say THANK YOU! I was really surprised at all this.

The office manager went out and told the doctor that I refused to sign the opioid consent form and he asked what my problem was. She said I was refusing narcotics. HE asked,

"So she's refusing treatment?" He asked what was wrong with me, she said she didn't know. He blew up and said he was the doctor, he would decide my treatment options.

Finally the doc comes in the room and I just stopped him dead in his tracks. I was sincerely annoyed at everything I had experienced and I explained, "I heard the comments you made out there along with the rest of the building and I want to make something clear. I can't take NSAIDs anymore due to GI problems, I prefer to not take muscle relaxers anymore, and I flat out refuse narcotics." I went on to explain that with his education and specialty surely he knows of non narcotic options? He said he has a few tricks up his sleeve so yes, there are other options.

Then he said he was going to do an EMG, I asked why. He said he wanted to see if there was nerve damage. I asked if the results would change the treatment plan, he said no. I asked how it would benefit me, he said I would know if I have nerve damage. Again, I asked what value there is to ME? Longer story short, I'm not doing the EMG. Then he said he was going to do an epidural, I asked for what? Where? He looked at my file and said, "Oh yeah, you have MS. Nevermind."

I don't even have words to explain how this whole thing made me feel. If I wasn't anti-narcotic (for me) before, I would have been after seeing all these people and listening to them compare withdrawal stories and their behaviors and laughing about things that just aren't funny.

I just have no words, I am shocked and floored at this MD office. But, I did leave with what I wanted, Pamelor for nerve pain. I work full time, I enjoy my job, I do not want to have to quit so I can sit home and become an addict, you know?

Sorry, I know this is long but I just had to vent a bit. No responses are even necessary, just the vent.

Specializes in ICU.

Any drug can make you go through withdrawal. If I miss a dose of my antidepressant or epilepsy drugs, I get sick. The difference is I'm not thinking about how I can get the drug any way possible. I do not have an addictive personality.

i attended a NA meeting back in March as a requirement for my Mental Health rotation. Some went to AA, I chose NA. My eyes were completely opened into the mind of an addict. Their brains are wired differently. I think you need a little more tolerance with your sister.

I can understand your anger towards addicts with your family history. I do know how hard it is to grow up with an alcoholic. My mom was raised by one. She is 61 now, and the scars it has left her are still evident to this day. His alcoholism set into motion a large group of events that dictated my life. I no longer speak to him.

But in the same breathe you are telling me not to judge you, you are judging me. That is where I have the problem. I was hoping to educate you on someone who does have chronic pain and what we go through. I also wanted you to see the difference in a pill mill compared to a pain management clinic. But I can see your mind is made up.

And yes border towns make a huge difference. The U.S. has stricter standards on the production of pharmaceuticals. It is known that many of these meds produced in Mexico are subpar. So those people come to the U.S. to get the betters medications. That is a fact.

I wish I never had to take medications. I hate having to put all this stuff in my body. It's a pain in the butt having to schedule everything and making sure I don't miss doses. I hate being in pain every day. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy.

Like I said in my PP, I am passionate about this subject. It's great that Pamelor works for you. But I would not be surprised if these drugs end up controlled soon. Like I said, they are now testing for them on drug tests. Any medication can be abused if taken incorrectly. Not just pain meds. But if taken correctly in conjunction with a good overall pain management program, these medications can be lifesavers for people like me. It allows me to live a normal life. A normal life. It was something I could only dream about years ago.

Any drug can make you go through withdrawal. If I miss a dose of my antidepressant or epilepsy drugs, I get sick. The difference is I'm not thinking about how I can get the drug any way possible. I do not have an addictive personality.

i attended a NA meeting back in March as a requirement for my Mental Health rotation. Some went to AA, I chose NA. My eyes were completely opened into the mind of an addict. Their brains are wired differently. I think you need a little more tolerance with your sister.

I can understand your anger towards addicts with your family history. I do know how hard it is to grow up with an alcoholic. My mom was raised by one. She is 61 now, and the scars it has left her are still evident to this day. His alcoholism set into motion a large group of events that dictated my life. I no longer speak to him.

But in the same breathe you are telling me not to judge you, you are judging me. That is where I have the problem. I was hoping to educate you on someone who does have chronic pain and what we go through. I also wanted you to see the difference in a pill mill compared to a pain management clinic. But I can see your mind is made up.

And yes border towns make a huge difference. The U.S. has stricter standards on the production of pharmaceuticals. It is known that many of these meds produced in Mexico are subpar. So those people come to the U.S. to get the betters medications. That is a fact.

I wish I never had to take medications. I hate having to put all this stuff in my body. It's a pain in the butt having to schedule everything and making sure I don't miss doses. I hate being in pain every day. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy.

Like I said in my PP, I am passionate about this subject. It's great that Pamelor works for you. But I would not be surprised if these drugs end up controlled soon. Like I said, they are now testing for them on drug tests. Any medication can be abused if taken incorrectly. Not just pain meds. But if taken correctly in conjunction with a good overall pain management program, these medications can be lifesavers for people like me. It allows me to live a normal life. A normal life. It was something I could only dream about years ago.

Your post is ridiculous, your assumptions about me appear to be projection more than anything. Make no mistake, you are not educating anyone, you are making wild assumptions, projecting your own fears, and really, making a fool of yourself.

ETA: You also might want to get a better understanding of what goes on at the border. I live it daily, do you? Or are you parroting what you read in the media?

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Specializes in Oncology; medical specialty website.
Specializes in Oncology; medical specialty website.

I take back my apology. Heathermaizey wrote a very thoughtful post, and all she got for it was hostility.

I take back my apology. Heathermaizey wrote a very thoughtful post, and all she got for it was hostility.

Just as your post where you made wild accusations and assumed I would perceive a situation as you would (projection) it as not the least bit thoughtful. But I can certainly see why you defend her. It's rather clear.

Wow, this thread went down the tubes pretty quick ...

Specializes in Critical Care and ED.

Quite honestly I think you sound a bit unhinged, histrionic and extremely judgmental. Saying that you want to hug someone because they don't ask for narcotics, and acting like not taking narcotics is virtuous is the most inane thing I've read today. Many people take narcotics safely and responsibly, and those that need them are grateful for them and use them appropriately. Yes, there are some people who abuse them, just as some people drink responsibly and some people drink and drive. Tarring all with the same brush is a bit of an overkill. If you're not going to take narcotics why not sign the disclaimer? It's not going to affect you in the least. It merely states that you are aware of the consequences, just like signing a HIPAA form. Sounds like you caused the drama and now want to get a pat on the back for it. It's people like you that make it so hard for people in genuine pain to get appropriate medication. Say no to meds if you want, but leave other people alone to make their own decisions because it's really none of your business. Don't like the clinic? Go to another one. Lots of options for you.

Quite honestly I think you sound a bit unhinged, histrionic and extremely judgmental. Saying that you want to hug someone because they don't ask for narcotics, and acting like not taking narcotics is virtuous is the most inane thing I've read today. Many people take narcotics safely and responsibly, and those that need them are grateful for them and use them appropriately. Yes, there are some people who abuse them, just as some people drink responsibly and some people drink and drive. Tarring all with the same brush is a bit of an overkill. If you're not going to take narcotics why not sign the disclaimer? It's not going to affect you in the least. It merely states that you are aware of the consequences, just like signing a HIPAA form. Sounds like you caused the drama and now want to get a pat on the back for it. It's people like you that make it so hard for people in genuine pain to get appropriate medication. Say no to meds if you want, but leave other people alone to make their own decisions because it's really none of your business. Don't like the clinic? Go to another one. Lots of options for you.

No, that is not correct. I do not sound unhinged. I have explained and clarified that narcotics are not for me and I even shared very personal reasons for that. After clarifying I explained in detail for the reading challenged. *I* have an addictive personality, (food in excess to the point of wls and exercise are a couple of good examples) and I have a family history of alcohol and drug addiction. For ***ME*** narcotics are not an option today. With that I am told I have a superior attitude. Does that really deserve a response?

Read the thread, I have never downed anyone that needed narcotics. I did mention that in an ED setting I was sick to death of narcotic seekers and I was! That in no way implies people who actually need these drugs. For that I am told I am judgemental. Is anyone here naive enough to believe your standard issue ED doesn't have a great many narcotic seekers?

My issue from the start of this thread is the doctor who is putting these people in this position. He is turning them into addicts and he doesn't care! His own patients are explaining if you line his wallet by submitting to diagnostics and procedures you get your list of narcotics for the month. For sharing that eye opening experience I am again told I am judgemental because I assume all pain management clinics are the same.

I explain why I do not want or need narcotics and I am told I am angry with addicts and others who use opioids properly.

Then I am told who the clientele are at the clinic I went to. I explained that the people were clear that they were on Medicaid, that was to refute the claim they are really folks living in Mexico wanting a better quality drug than they get in their home country. They were medicaid, they are living in the US. I was there, she was not. I am again told I am wrong, they are from border cities wanting good drugs.

Show me my post where I wrote that people who need narcotics or use them wisely are bad people. I'll give you a hint, it does not exist.

~~Say no to meds if you want, but leave other people alone to make their own decisions because it's really none of your business.~~

You made the claim, back it up. Show me the post where I have not left them alone and claimed they should not make their own decisions.

I'll wait.

Signing the authorization for opioids, why would I do that? To appease you? Seriously? It was not a disclaimer, it was a consent form. You are being seriously manipulative, any special reason why?

Honest to goodness, some of you are batcrap crazy.

Wow, this thread went down the tubes pretty quick ...

I know, it's insanity at it's best.

I'm about to request it be closed or deleted completely. I write the sky is blue today and I'm told I am judgemental because sometimes the sky is orange with blue dots.

I have a hunch I know the real problem here, I just hope I am wrong.

Specializes in hospice.
Your post is ridiculous, your assumptions about me appear to be projection more than anything. Make no mistake, you are not educating anyone, you are making wild assumptions, projecting your own fears, and really, making a fool of yourself.

ETA: You also might want to get a better understanding of what goes on at the border. I live it daily, do you? Or are you parroting what you read in the media?

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What the hell is this?! I saw nothing in the post to which you responded that justifies this.

Specializes in Education, FP, LNC, Forensics, ED, OB.

Thread closed for review.

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