Seasoned nurses eat their young?!

Tweety, BSN, RN · Aug 4, 2003

I do hope it's not all that one sided. That there one or two good attitudes that are being overshadowed by the bad. But we are stressed, busy, and to be brutally frank students can be a nuisance and a burden. Having to take care of our patients, plus watch over the student, and pick up where the student left off. Sometimes we think the student is doing more than we actually find done when they leave.

Also to be brutally honest your predessors didn't set a good example, coming in with their superior attitudes, whispering amongst themselves "did you see what he just did????"

That said, we all were students once and deserve to learn in environment where we are treated with respect and where we learn.

I always, always try to be good to students and to new grads. Don't see them much on night shift anymore.

teeituptom, BSN, RN · Aug 4, 2003

Yes we eat some and some of them are pretty damn tasty also. yyaahhoooooooo

llg, PhD, RN · Aug 4, 2003

This is an interesting thread. Part of my job is to be the liaison between my hospital and the local schools of nursing, coordinating the schedules, solving problems, etc. We have 8 of them who do clinical rotations here.

I am the one everyone comes to when there are problems: so, I hear the complaints from both sides. It seems to me to be 50-50 situation in that both "sides" are in the wrong half of the time. Yes, some of the staff needs to become more tolerant of the students and accommodating of their needs. But the schools also are the source of the problem on many occasions. And it's not just the students themselves. Often the school administration or faculty has ignored guidelines or put some other stress on the system that makes it difficult for their students to get a good experience. They may insist on putting more students in an area that it can comfortably handle, insist on times that are inconvenient, send faculty who are unprepared to supervise care in that setting, etc. It can be a mess.

Unfortunately, there has been very little research into these issues. However, I have had contact with someone in Canada who is beginning a research project investigating the burden that having students on the unit places on the staff. I was very happy to see that someone was interested in this topic.

llg

MishlB · Aug 4, 2003

Originally posted by fab4fan
1. It is rarely all that one-sided; I find it hard to believe that not one nurse on that floor is helpful to the students.

2. You are seeing this from the perspective of a student...think about it as a staff nurse for a minute. You have an unmanageable pt. load and now are being asked to be a resource for a student. While you appreciate that students have questions and need to learn, you know that having the student will slow you down, which will mean things get done late, you will get out late, possibly be reprimanded for not getting done on time, etc.

3. Some students show up for clinical poorly prepared and with equally poor attitudes.

4. Staff nurses get no compensation for being resources for students.

5. I can tell you that I enjoy working with students/new grads, but in the last few years I have noticed that there is an increasing lack of appreciation for what you do for them; it's like they just expect you to download all your knowledge to them.

Try to have a little understanding for the staff nurses; things are pretty rough out there, and while you have exp. as a student, you do not have exp. as a staff nurse, so don't be so quick to
judge.

Hmmm...you need to also think of the student, who only wants to learn the correct way of doing things, and become that charge nurse one day. I realize it gets busy, but maybe if time was taken for the student, they would consider employment in your facility and help you out one day. Remember, you are looked up to by the students, they want to be where you are...keep acting crabby and you will continue to be short staffed, because no one will work with you.

redshiloh · Aug 4, 2003

I am so sorry you are being treated like garbage. The nursing students we have are wonderful. Just remember what comes around goes around...if they treat students like this, how many of them will want to come back and work for that facility after graduation?

Tink RN · Aug 4, 2003

I've been on both sides of the fence. As a student, on some rotations I was treated kindly and allowed to freely ask questions and observe various procedures etc and walked away feeling as if I had gained something from the experience. On others ofcourse, I was treated rudely and as a burden or abused as an extra CNA and the only knowledge I would gain is what type of adult pampers that particular facility utilized. I vowed to myself at that time I would never treat others the way I was treated.

Now the flip side. As a RN in the ER, I have been asked to allow students to work with me. I always ask what they are comfortable with doing (with my supervision) and make sure to explain that patient care comes first and being a fast paced environment, I will only be able to teach as time allows and if things get busy, please do not think I am ignoring you, but hang with me and I hope you will gain a feel for what ER nursing is all about. Well ... some students have been outstanding - eager to learn, interested in what I was showing and telling them and hanging to my coat tail through the chaotic moments (traumas, etc). Those impressed me and were worth my effort so to speak. Unfortunately, I have also had the experience of having students assigned to me that showed up with a bad attitude and had no interest in anything I attempted to teach them. One girl I will never forget was actually filing her nails as she sat at the nurses station while I was trying to stabilize an acute MI after I told her , "This is one of those moments I need you to stand by and watch and we will discuss it later."

Even though I have never allowed a negative experience to effect my attitude with the next, I have a better understanding of some of the attitudes I encountered as a student. I am by no means excusing staff being rude to students but I have wondered if they encountered some of the same bad experiences I have. Try to be a little more understanding. I agree with the "kill them with kindness" post because some people are just rude by nature. Also you will be in the "other shoes" one day. It is stressful to accept the responsibility of having a student with you and knowing you will be held accountable for them as well.

Keep a positive attitude. You will take something with you from every clinical experience - good or bad - keep it in your memory bank and reflect upon it when you are in the reversed role to keep your attitude in check.

2muchfun · Aug 4, 2003

Originally posted by ainz

It does not matter how stressed, frustrated, tired, etc., etc., no excuse for a nurse, an "angel of mercy," to be rude!!!

I ain't no angel!! Hope I am never accused of it either. Nurses are "people" like everyone else, some good, bad indifferent, none perfect. I am sick to death of the high idealistic standards having nothing to do with the real world that ppl set for nurses.

That said, I do believe good manners should be expected of ANYONE. If a lawyer or bank teller is rude, we get miffed. When a nurse is rude ppl act like the pope spit in public or something.

ainz · Aug 4, 2003

High idealistic standards set a target for people to reach for. Without high, idealistic standards, nursing will not make it. Nurses are in position to help or harm people when they are at some of their most vulnerable times---sick and in the hospital.

You better believe we need high, idealistic standards for nurses. To think otherwise is a major problem. There is enough erosion of the professional image of nursing, and yes, the image is extremely important.

As for research, please llg, not another nursing study where nurses are studying themselves, again. How much study do we need to do on ourselves and our behavior and all of that. How about some studies that translate into real world issues that demonstrate the effectiveness and the value of nursing to patient outcomes and financial performance for the organization and the healthcare system as a whole. And no, I do not do research, I am a consumer of research.

2muchfun · Aug 4, 2003

Originally posted by ainz
High idealistic standards set a target for people to reach for. Without high, idealistic standards, nursing will not make it. Nurses are in position to help or harm people when they are at some of their most vulnerable times---sick and in the hospital.

You better believe we need high, idealistic standards for nurses. To think otherwise is a major problem. There is enough erosion of the professional image of nursing, and yes, the image is extremely important.

As for research, please llg, not another nursing study where nurses are studying themselves, again. How much study do we need to do on ourselves and our behavior and all of that. How about some studies that translate into real world issues that demonstrate the effectiveness and the value of nursing to patient outcomes and financial performance for the organization and the healthcare system as a whole. And no, I do not do research, I am a consumer of research.

Personally, those "high idealistic standards" should be applied to nursing practice, not improving personalities. The image of angelic nurses is the problem to begin with. Personally, I could deal with the national nursing slogan becomming, "Nurses, here to save your ass, not kiss it." I give as much respect as I get, to pts and co-workers alike. Period.

cindylouwho · Aug 4, 2003

2 much fun...I agree...if we are swamped and just trying to catch a breath....maybe a little short tempered...people get all bent out of shape.......esp. managent....come do my work I tell them....ha.....and cdarn2004.....you will encounter rude people your whole career...esp doctors so just ignore and do your best...I personally love teaching students so I can warn them ahead of time what they are in for...they thank me for letting them know because most of them are clueless as I was as a student....if I can make 25 years later...so can you.....keep on truckin!

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Aug 4, 2003

Give respect, give respect, and so on and so forth. Bottom line.

cindylouwho · Aug 4, 2003

2muchfun.....one more comment...I love yours....I'm here to save your ass not kiss it.......I feel that way everyday......I'd love to say something similar to doctors.......perhaps like..."I'm sick of covering your ass..now do your job!"