Remember when MLK jr said, "To further the cause of social justice go down the street and rob and loot your neighbors." Me neither, because it didn't happen.
I fully sympathize with the situation in Minneapolis and the death of George Floyd. I believe in due process, but after seeing the video I was sickened by the police officer's actions. He did not need to have his knee of the neck of a man who was handcuffed and held down by two other officers. His excessive force caused the death of Floyd. He was fired and he will be arrested and charged. There will be a court case and evidence will be presented and a verdict delivered.
That's how our system works. It does not work by robbing your neighbors and destroying their livelihoods. There is no cause that is furthered by the looter's actions. There is no traction gained. Their actions haven't changed policy and ensured that justice was done. It was simply a group of people who took the opportunity to steal and destroy for personal gain. The looters are selfish because they took some of the spotlight away from George Floyd and now the nation sees another example people run amok without furthering their agenda or making any positive strides.
If the looters actually cared about Floyd or the social cause they speak of they would take civil action. It worked in the past and it would work again. The Montgomery bus boycott changed policy. But it wasn't easy, it was certainly harder than breaking glass and stealing a tv. And therein lies the problem. It's easy to riot, it's easy to steal and claim "XYZ caused me to loot." It's hard to organize like-minded people and bring about change. It takes time, grit and determination. Think how much better things would be if the thousands of people who looted and rioted got together and voted for change. They could elect someone who could enact policies to prevent something like this from happening again. That's how our system works, not by destroying your own neighborhood.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
22 minutes ago, TomPaine said:
Toomuchbaloney, you seem to be missing my point and conflating several issues. Everyone with a working brain is appalled by what happened to George Floyd and people want to see the cop arrested and charged. I believe that will happen very soon. That's how our system works. And it's going to work in this case.
Imagine if every time something happened we didn't like politically we burned down our neighborhood and looted from businesses. It would be anarchy. There is no excuse for the looting. The riot police were only brought in when the looting and destruction began. The armed protestors at the capitol is a separate issue. I don't recall seeing the armed capitol protestors looting, destroying cop cars or businesses. If you have some video or anything showing that please share.
What do you want to happen in Minneapolis? Should the police let looters continue to steal and burn down businesses? Are you really advocating for more chaos? Or are you just upset that peaceful protestors at a capitol in another state weren't met with riot police as well?
Gosh...we would never expect an off duty policemen or police sympathizer to initiate and escalate violence and vandalism at a peaceful protest. Police would never lie to the public or misrepresent their intentions or actions.
And no, not everyone is appalled. That's a choice to believe as much, when it's not true. All lives don't matter. Stores, property, and business really really matter much more than black men, look how vigorously they are protected while the people are murdered.
We can see, with the open murder of black men in the middle of our streets, that reasoned discussion. Peaceful protest hasn't made black men safer or decreased the incidents of inhumane treatment or brutality toward non whites in this country. In fact, KKK membership is up and racists are empowered by the POTUS in 2020.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
What do I expect? I expect that police will take complaints against officers seriously. I expect that actual meaningful investigations be done. I expect that criminal cops shouldn't be able to simply transfer their dangerous attitudes to a different jurisdiction because police hiring practices are a JOKE. I expect that police be trained to de-escalate rather than precipitate violence.
The list is exhausting, it's added to every year. Clearly not enough people ever care enough to read and champion the concerns of the oppressed.
Specializes in Critical care, tele, Medical-Surgical.
3 hours ago, toomuchbaloney said:
What do I expect? I expect that police will take complaints against officers seriously. I expect that actual meaningful investigations be done. I expect that criminal cops shouldn't be able to simply transfer their dangerous attitudes to a different jurisdiction because police hiring practices are a JOKE. I expect that police be trained to de-escalate rather than precipitate violence.
The list is exhausting, it's added to every year. Clearly not enough people ever care enough to read and champion the concerns of the oppressed.
And so they remain oppressed.
And abused.
And victimized by the institutional racism.
I agree.
I took non violence training with the SCLC in 1963. My FBI file consists on one photo of me, my Grandma, and then boyfriend protesting in front of a real estate sign that read "FOR SALE TO WHITE CHRISTIANS ONLY". That was 1964. In 1969 I read in the paper about the first Negro to buy a house in that neighborhood. He was a young lawyer named Johnny Cochran.
As the wife, mother, and stepmother of five Black men who I love very much I do not think looting, rioting, and throwing rocks helps at all.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
8 minutes ago, herring_RN said:
I agree.
I took non violence training with the SCLC in 1963. My FBI file consists on one photo of me, my Grandma, and then boyfriend protesting in front of a real estate sign that read "FOR SALE TO WHITE CHRISTIANS ONLY". That was 1964. In 1969 I read in the paper about the first Negro to buy a house in that neighborhood. He was a young lawyer named Johnny Cochran.
As the wife, mother, and stepmother of five Black men who I love very much I do not think looting, rioting, and throwing rocks helps at all.
Rioting effectively changed things in Tulsa, Oklahoma nearly 100 years ago. Of course the people who rioted and burned and broke things were the white people and the police, but it certainly was effective in changing life for the black people who lived there.
Specializes in Critical care, tele, Medical-Surgical.
14 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
Rioting effectively changed things in Tulsa, Oklahoma nearly 100 years ago. Of course the people who rioted and burned and broke things were the white people and the police, but it certainly was effective in changing life for the black people who lived there.
Yes it caused death and destruction. When I said " I do not think looting, rioting, and throwing rocks helps at all." perhaps I should have said violence does no GOOD. My fellow nurses whose memory faded or who never heard the speech below may want to read it:
The Quest for Peace and Justice Martin Luther King Jr. Nobel Lecture -- December 11, 1964
“Violence as a way of achieving racial justice is both impractical and immoral. I am not unmindful of the fact that violence often brings about momentary results. Nations have frequently won their independence in battle. But in spite of temporary victories, violence never brings permanent peace. It solves no social problem: it merely creates new and more complicated ones. Violence is impractical because it is a descending spiral ending in destruction for all. It is immoral because it seeks to humiliate the opponent rather than win his understanding: it seeks to annihilate rather than convert...
Specializes in Education, FP, LNC, Forensics, ED, OB.
Quote
President Donald Trump is threatening to take action to bring the city of Minneapolis under control, calling violent protesters "thugs." He tweeted Friday that "when the looting starts, the shooting starts."
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
17 minutes ago, herring_RN said:
Yes it caused death and destruction. When I said " I do not think looting, rioting, and throwing rocks helps at all." perhaps I should have said violence does no GOOD. My fellow nurses whose memory faded or who never heard the speech below may want to read it:
The Quest for Peace and Justice Martin Luther King Jr. Nobel Lecture -- December 11, 1964
“Violence as a way of achieving racial justice is both impractical and immoral. I am not unmindful of the fact that violence often brings about momentary results. Nations have frequently won their independence in battle. But in spite of temporary victories, violence never brings permanent peace. It solves no social problem: it merely creates new and more complicated ones. Violence is impractical because it is a descending spiral ending in destruction for all. It is immoral because it seeks to humiliate the opponent rather than win his understanding: it seeks to annihilate rather than convert...
I'm not convinced that the people protesting the murder were the people who started the vandalism and violence. They are the people who will be blamed and punished for it by the local police though.
Specializes in Critical care, tele, Medical-Surgical.
1 hour ago, toomuchbaloney said:
I'm not convinced that the people protesting the murder were the people who started the vandalism and violence. They are the people who will be blamed and punished for it by the local police though.
Minneapolis Police Chief Says Violent Protesters Not From the City
Specializes in Critical care, tele, Medical-Surgical.
26 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
I could not access all of the article without paying. Did the Chief indicate where they believed the instigators were from or who they were?
I didn't sign up for that site either. I used a search engine after hearing on the radio that the police chief said they were "outsiders" and that "One of those arrested for looting was from Missouri." I posted it as proof of what I heard because I couldn't find another source.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
41 minutes ago, herring_RN said:
I didn't sign up for that site either. I used a search engine after hearing on the radio that the police chief said they were "outsiders" and that "One of those arrested for looting was from Missouri." I posted it as proof of what I heard because I couldn't find another source.
Thank you. Yes. There are quite a few opportunists and rabble rousers empowered right now.
toomuchbaloney
16,046 Posts
Gosh...we would never expect an off duty policemen or police sympathizer to initiate and escalate violence and vandalism at a peaceful protest. Police would never lie to the public or misrepresent their intentions or actions.
And no, not everyone is appalled. That's a choice to believe as much, when it's not true. All lives don't matter. Stores, property, and business really really matter much more than black men, look how vigorously they are protected while the people are murdered.
We can see, with the open murder of black men in the middle of our streets, that reasoned discussion. Peaceful protest hasn't made black men safer or decreased the incidents of inhumane treatment or brutality toward non whites in this country. In fact, KKK membership is up and racists are empowered by the POTUS in 2020.