"Loosing" my license

[Ruby Vee]

i work in a very populous state on the east coast. yet when i look up actions taken against nursing licenses, i get a list of about 50 nurses who have had action taken, some of them going back as far as 2003! there are hospitals near here with over 1000 beds -- how many nurses do you think are employed in just one 1000 bed hospital? how many nurses do you think are employed in just one city like new york, dc, baltimore, philadelphia or boston?

when i lived in wisconsin, i'd get a newsletter quarterly with about 20-25 names of nurses with pending disciplinary action. only a few of those nurses had actually lost their licenses. so where is all this hysteria about "loosing" a nursing license coming from?

we have new grads quitting their jobs after mere months because they're afraid they might "loose" their license -- and by the way, the work is too hard, the hours suck and the other nurses are mean to them. now there's a thread about brutal doctors and calling them -- and someone brings up fear that they might lose their license. what's up with all of this? are nursing schools scaring people silly about the idea of losing your license? or is this just an excuse people are grasping to avoid things they'd rather avoid?

[Tragically Hip]

a dear friend of mine was accused by a former coworker of abuse and subsequently investigated by the bon. her employer terminated her over the situation and she was unable to locate further employment for the next 8 months while the investigation was ongoing. unfortunately, it took 8 months for the bon to assign an investigator who after reading the accounts simply dropped the false and simply silly charges against her.

your friend should have sued her former coworker for 8 months' back wages, plus, possibly, damages.

[sailornurse]

i've read posts from nurses on this board about people (notably family members angry they didn't get their way angry patients who didn't get their way, and even stalkers) who made anonymous complaints to the board of nursing. in one case, the nurse had her license taken away after her stalker made a complaint to the board of nursing because it was seen as a nurse having a relationship with a patient. a lot of things on the internet have to be taken with a grain of salt, .[/quote']

ok. can you actually post supporting documentation of when/where this happened, please provide proof otherwise i would say this falls under the urban legend category/or bs. in new mexico & texas, anonymous complaints are not accepted, all complaints against a nurse must be signed/notarized etc. complaints to the board have to be about things in the nurse practice act and the complaints must be supported with evidence, the entire board reviews the case and it is actually pretty difficult to lose your license. as grn tea pointed out: people lose their licenses for things like substance abuse at work, narcotics diversion, fraud, felony theft, patient abuse, and so forth. this pretty much sums it up as most reasons people lose nursing licenses. also to point out, some licenses are returned to active after the disciplinary action has been completed.

[tothepointeLVN, LVN]

*if anyone else is as obsessed with perusing BON licensure meetings as I am, the CA BoN has an excellent website that is perfectly set up for being able to pull up cases based on keywords. Some of what you read is just amazing.

Not as surprising as what WON'T lose you your license in CA. There was a big LA Times expose several years ago.

[tothepointeLVN, LVN]

Also I don't want to lose my license is synonymous with I don't want to work under these conditions which is fine just say so. Though this was the excuse I used to my husband when I wanted to quite my first nursing job. Which I did but I had lasted a year sooo it really wasn't at all true but the excuse felt good like I was being proactive and not errr someone who just wanted to quit her job LOL.

[NurseBatzy]

I can commiserate. I worked at a job where we were mostly all afraid of losing licenses. We had a doc who loved to call the BON and complain about us. Constantly. It's a harsh, stressful environment to work in, and when one is afraid for one's livelihood, it isn't unreasonable to move to a place where one feels safer, no matter if the threat was real or not. A better excuse might be that one is afraid for their patients, or one is afraid for their job, but in the end, it doesn't matter. Each nurse has his or her own personal license, and therefore the right to protect it as he or she sees fit. It belongs to the individual, not to the managers, more experienced nurses, or the co-workers who disapprove.

[NRSKarenRN, BSN, RN]

over the past 10 years as part of my job, i visit pa's board of nursing and pa, nj and de board of medicine websites for updated information and routinely view disciplinary actions for credentialing of our home care providers. pa state government maintains an online list of disciplinary actions for all professional and business boards.

there is a noticeable increase in disciplinary actions by both boards of medicine and board of nursing in these states: most related to alcohol and drug dependence.

in 2005, the pa disciplinary action list was generated quarterly; now is comes out monthly averaging 25-30 bon actions/month.

pa bon issued 331 bon actions in 2011 to ensure public safety.

the #1 reason for license suspensions (90% board actions) listed over past 5 years is:

unable to practice the profession with reasonable skill and safety to patients by reason of mental or physical illness or condition or physiological or psychological dependence upon alcohol or drugs which tend to impair judgment or coordination

license suspension often turn into license revocations within 1-3 yrs when relapse or treatment not followed.

about 1% involved civil penalties for practicing on lapsed license or failure to complete required 30 hrs of continuing education schedule of civil penalties--nurses.

other disciplinary actions include being disciplined by bon in another state; theft: a crime of moral turpitude; felony convictions under the drug act, conviction of a crime of moral turpitude; felony counts of retail theft; convictions under domestic relations code; and third degree murder.

less than 1 % were practice issues:

• making false entries into patients' records, engaging in unprofessional conduct, and failing to document and maintain accurate records
  
• engaged in areas of highly specialized practice without adequate knowledge of and skills in the practice areas involved
  
• has been guilty of immoral or unprofessional conduct for failing to conform to an ethical or quality standard of the profession
  
• committed fraud or deceit in the practice of nursing
  
• has been guilty of immoral or unprofessional conduct
  
• misappropriated equipment, materials, property, drugs or money from an employer or patient
  

example: pa nov 2011 all board disciplinary actions

nj bon were similar disciplinary actions - (may 2011 - june 2012)

looking at texas bon and other states, there were much more practice issues with warnings and stipulations issued.

jan 2012: notice of disciplinary action - texas board of nursing

virginia board of nursing -multi-state privilege discipline

sd nursing board - disciplinary actions

pro republica as an outgrowth of its 2009 investigation along with la times of california bon, had complied a listing of each states bon actions thru 2008, also showing upward trend.

track your state nursing board

[Mukfay]

I would agree that the reason for the paranoia is the message many hear in nursing school. If this is the case, we can treat the concern with compassion and educate (as you have done here).

As to the misspelling of lose, I've noticed that common error (as well as a small set of others). I have to believe that there is some gap in education in certain school systems due to omission of the material, or failure to study it on the part of the students. It's frustrating maybe, but gentle correction is usually enough.

[dirtyhippiegirl, BSN, RN]

Not as surprising as what WON'T lose you your license in CA. There was a big LA Times expose several years ago.

Oh yeah. I was surprised at how many (patient-care) related offenses it takes to just have your licensed placed on probation. Even in flagrant cases of addiction and drug diversion, probation is generally the first line.

I'll link you some of the funny ones I found one of these days.

[xoemmylouox, ASN, RN]

I think discussing this will provide some reassurance to those who worry too often. The important thing is that we continue to help each other whether it be on here or in our place of employment.

[Mom2boysRN]

I will comment as a newer nurse. I graduated in Dec 2010. It was brought up a lot about our license being on the line or the threat of losing our license if we made a mistake. We were made terrified of losing our license long before we had one to lose.

[Zookeeper3]

real life example, prior to computerized md order entry.

long story not so short, two cv surgeons, in a specific small open heart unit. standing orders exist, yet not all circumstances are covered. i call the surgeon on call, doc 1 for a transfusion order, get one, transfuse. pt. with low cardiac index goes into failure, despite 4 hour prolonged transfusion, need lasix, kidneys are crap. call for lasix, get the order, pt. goes into acute renal failure, adjust meds next morning rounds with primary doc. pt. is simply crashing out due to multiple co-morbidities. doc 2 comes in, the primary and is really ticked at the management of orders, doesn't agree with them and demands that he wouldn't approve and i knew that.

i have three pages of phone orders from doc 1, whom after morning rounds and an entire night of updates sees the demise of the patient. he denies ever giving any phone orders to me. almost lost my job and was reported by that doc 1 and 2 to the bon for practicing medicine without a licence. my employer did as well and then withdrew after internal review, thanks so much there. (these two doc's hate each other and play off each other to save their behinds as we have learned). luckily, my employer who through thorough investigation and a long suspension which i was repayed for, believed my peers recollection of hearing my repeating orderson the phone and cleared my name.

as a result, i refused to take any phone orders from either without another rn listening in who co-signed. then it became a standard for that unit, not a policy, but all rn's had another who's ear to the phone listening took phone orders.

so no, you don't have to do anything wrong to be reported to the bon. without good peers, whom stuck their necks out for me in a tight knit relationship driven unit, there was no way to saved me. there is no way the bon would have sided with me without them, nor would have my employer.

this example split the unit, nurse against nurse in one doc's favor over another and we went through hell. nurses didn't trust certain others, the doc's demanded only certain nurses they "trusted" care for their patients... it was pure hell.

it can happen for reasons beyond your control and it does. this is one simple example of the politics of nursing, where it is safer to leave then stay. i was knee deep in quick sand before i learned it first hand, i thought i was one of the "untouchables", until it happened to me. my worry is there of more like me out there in similar situations now, thinking that it can't happen to them.

[Mukfay]

I agree with many of the above posts. I recall an experience as our class attended a Nursing Board meeting. An RN was defending her license. She had been placed in a diversion program. She was required to work without exposure to narcotics and report for drug screening 24 times in two years. She reported for three of the 24 tests, and she acted as charge nurse (and carried keys to the narcotics cabinet) for the entire two years. The board reinstated her license.

However, to suggest that no one (especially a poster with whom one is unfamiliar) has little or nothing to fear with respect to her license doesn't seem reasonable to me.

Regards,

Mukfay