Psych NPs that Quit Psych

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Specializes in APRN.

There won't be many here, but what would you do?  What have you done? 

How many of you would leave mental health if you could maintain the same lifestyle? I have peers that wouldn't openly answer that question. 

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Specializes in Psychiatric and Mental Health NP (PMHNP).

I am happy as a PMHNP.  If that is the only certification a provider has, there are numerous programs that offer a post-graduation certification in other specialties, such as FNP.  However, have to pay for that and it is time-consuming because clinical rotations must be completed.

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Why not become a holistic psych NP? Learn about herbs, diet and lifestyle changes that contribute to mental wellness. These practitioners make a lot of money, typically don't accept insurance, and are in high demand as people learn that pharmaceuticals are not where it's at. You could also get certified in psychedelics and become a ketamine prescriber. 

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Specializes in PMHNP.

I am a PMHNP. the pay has been driven down terrible and the market is flooded now with PSYCH NP who never been a nurse even 1 day.  people want high expectation with little training. It's not worth it to me anymore, unless you can get on with a hospital. 

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Specializes in Psychiatric and Mental Health NP (PMHNP).
SN2432 said:

I am a PMHNP. the pay has been driven down terrible and the market is flooded now with PSYCH NP who never been a nurse even 1 day.  people want high expectation with little training. It's not worth it to me anymore, unless you can get on with a hospital. 

According to the evidence, RN experience does not improve NP competency.  I posted a mini evidence review on this.  And I know plenty of PMHNPs who were psych RNs who are incompetent PMHNPs.

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Specializes in Psychiatry.
FullGlass said:

According to the evidence, RN experience does not improve NP competency.  I posted a mini evidence review on this.  And I know plenty of PMHNPs who were psych RNs who are incompetent PMHNPs.

You're correct, but I think the issue is more there needs to be SOME barrier to NP entry. It's not experience, it's not GRE scores, it's not certain weed-out classes (organic chem), it's not even admissions itself (since Walden/Phoenix, etc take 100% of applicants). We all just wish there was SOMETHING giving some selectivity to our profession.

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Specializes in Psychiatric and Mental Health NP (PMHNP).
MentalKlarity said:

You're correct, but I think the issue is more there needs to be SOME barrier to NP entry. It's not experience, it's not GRE scores, it's not certain weed-out classes (organic chem), it's not even admissions itself (since Walden/Phoenix, etc take 100% of applicants). We all just wish there was SOMETHING giving some selectivity to our profession.

I agree with you.  I think the reputable schools do a decent job, as they do not admit everybody.  Those schools look at a variety of factors for admission to NP programs.  Most don't require GRE anymore.  They look at academic performance, work experience, life experience, the admissions essays, and the admissions interview.  I've started precepting and refuse to precept anyone from a for-profit school, even if they are willing to pay.  I just precepted an NP student from Samuel Merritt, a reputable school in CA, and ended up making her a job offer - she was awesome.  There is a nonprofit school in CA and it must be dreadful - every NP I've dealt with who went there is subpar - Charles Drew.  Maybe the medical school is good, but the NP school is not.

NPs should do some policing and not hire NPs from bad schools.  They should get the word out to MDs and other hiring managers about which schools are bad.  Also, refuse to precept students from bad schools.

 

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Specializes in Psychiatry.
FullGlass said:

I agree with you.  I think the reputable schools do a decent job, as they do not admit everybody.  Those schools look at a variety of factors for admission to NP programs.  Most don't require GRE anymore.  They look at academic performance, work experience, life experience, the admissions essays, and the admissions interview.  I've started precepting and refuse to precept anyone from a for-profit school, even if they are willing to pay.  I just precepted an NP student from Samuel Merritt, a reputable school in CA, and ended up making her a job offer - she was awesome.  There is a nonprofit school in CA and it must be dreadful - every NP I've dealt with who went there is subpar - Charles Drew.  Maybe the medical school is good, but the NP school is not.

NPs should do some policing and not hire NPs from bad schools.  They should get the word out to MDs and other hiring managers about which schools are bad.  Also, refuse to precept students from bad schools.

 

100% agree. The number one thing we can do is STOP precepting or hiring for profit students and grads until they get the message and this mess ends. 

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Here is my question... what about the really great nurses that choose schools like Walden for the the convenience? I am a high level clinical quality manager with over 15 years of nursing experience, I am very well respected in my organization and profession. I am going back for my DNP in psych mental health and am considering Walden for the convenience and timeline. Otherwise I will have to wait almost a full year to start classes at the local schools and then you have to choose a full time accelerated program or a long and drawn out part time program. Walden offers something in the middle.

Are you saying that the school itself is enough to prevent you from even considering precepting someone? I have hired nurses from all types of schools over the years and you can't judge competency strictly by school. Great nurses will make the most of any program they attend. 

Am I completely off base here?

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Specializes in Psychiatric and Mental Health NP (PMHNP).
unruffled said:

Here is my question... what about the really great nurses that choose schools like Walden for the the convenience? 

Are you saying that the school itself is enough to prevent you from even considering precepting someone? I have hired nurses from all types of schools over the years and you can't judge competency strictly by school.

Yes, I will not consider nurse practitioners from for-profit schools.  Please note there is a big difference between and RN and an NP.  You seem to be referring to your experience with RNs.  NPs are providers and must be held to a much higher standard.

No one is entitled to become an NP.  That is the brutal truth.  It SHOULD be hard to become an NP.  And that means sacrifices may need to be made.  Medical school and PA school are full time.  NP school is nice because students can work PT.  Some even work FT.  There are reputable nonprofit NP schools that offer part-time options.  I went to the Johns Hopkins PMHNP program.  While it is a fast program (about 15-16 mos), students can work while doing the program.  Some of the students worked FT.  There are nonprofit schools like National University that also offer convenience for working adults.  Do the research.  And if you have to wait 1 year to start, then so be it.

I did not have such a harsh attitude previously.  However, seeing the poor quality NPs flooding the healthcare industry recently, I am now fed up.  It is also harder for NP students from these crap programs to find preceptors for exactly this reason.  I won't precept those students and a lot of NPs have told me they do the same thing.

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Touche' FullGlass

I am so glad I was able to come across these posts prior to making any decisions about grad school. I have a friend who graduated from Walden NP Program about 5 years ago and she didn't have any trouble finding work, but she lives in a rural area so qualified NPs are slim pickens.

I can understand now what you are talking about with the quality of NPs. I see it in the quality of RNs lately. If those RNs... the lazy ones that aren't articulate, are emotionally immature and can't critically think their way out of the breakroom... are the same RNs that are applying to these Walden type programs... yikes. Garbage in, garbage out. Luckily they will never get beyond the application process or successfully interview for a job. Sadly, they are still spending time and money on the useless degree.

I've never settled for anything less than excellence in my career and certainly don't plan to start now. I honestly never thought these schools could be permitted to put out unqualified NPs in large numbers. I'm hoping things change with oversight and accountability in the future. Thanks to your honest and critical feedback, I was able to dig further and find a couple of reputable smaller schools that are non-profit and still offer some flexibility. You may have saved me years of embarrassment, time and money. For this I am grateful! 

 

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Specializes in Psychiatric and Mental Health NP (PMHNP).
unruffled said:

You may have saved me years of embarrassment, time and money. For this I am grateful! 

 

Glad to be of help.  You also raised an important point.  Why do so many RNs and NPs have such a low opinion of themselves and their profession?  Can you name any other profession (as opposed to a trade) that just wants a school that is easy, fast, and cheap?  Future doctors work their behinds off their whole lives to get into the best college they can, and then the best med school possible.  Same with future lawyers.  Business people want to get into the best MBA program they can.  PAs care about going to a good school.  And so on.  They are very proud of the school they went to!  Even skilled tradespeople want to get the best training they can.  Why don't RNs and NPs have this attitude!

Go to a school you are proud of!  And no one should be proud they went to Walden or Chamberlain and that ilk.  

I'm beginning to wonder if many RNs and NPs subconsciously believe they don't deserve the best.

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