Other Side of Coin---Less than Humble New Grads

Nurses General Nursing

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We hear a lot about 'eating our young', something which I personally experienced myself, btw, but what about the other side of the coin? How do we handle 'know it all' new grads who overstep their bounds? I've also run into this.

What about the new grad who is so full of her/him self, and who shows a lack of understanding and/or respect for the established members of the unit? Any thoughts???

Specializes in Med/Surg, Ortho.

LOL,, we have some who like to toot a bit also. Usually they are tooting to the patients in order to get personal comments on the satisfation survey sent to the patient after discharge. Gets them a free meal,, LOL,, whoopeee. Its not that they really do all that much better than anyone else, they just blow it up to the patient. Just wish they could hear how rediculous they sound.

Specializes in NICU.

A direct quote from my nursing school handbook received yesterday:

"Avoid conflicts with staff and clients . . . Always defer to staff in difficult situations."

Maybe if more schools inculcated this in their students there wouldn't be such a problem with new grads. They also printed out an interesting chart of the four stages of nursing students, somewhat like Kubler Ross' five stages of grieving:

The Honeymoon; The Shock/Crisis; The Recovery; The Resolution. Pretty self-explanatory, but the Shock/Crisis phase may account for the attitudes of some students and new grads. This stage includes: shock sets in when needs and goals are not met; experiences outrage; rejects school and work values; preoccupied with the past; globally negative.

I'm not saying this in ANY WAY excuses snotty behavior by ANYONE, but it's just an interesting way to look at it: hopefully they'll get to Recovery and Resolution as quickly as possible! My driver's training instructor told me the most dangerous time is just after you get your license: you think you know it all, you're overconfident, and that's when people get hurt.

Sorry this is so long and didactic - three solid days of orientation make me sound like my professors!

Dear Eliza,

You sound like you have a lot of insight. Nice post...

Specializes in Me Surge.
Oh yeah. Just the other day in clinicals myself and another student were discussing something about school when a "nurse" (that graduated just last Aug.) was standing next to us and all of a sudden said "shut up" and then proceeded to pretend to listen to something over the intercom. I kept my cool and kept my mouth shut but gave her "the look". Needless to say she had this look of shame on her face then and started talking to someone else. Don't know what her problem was. Could it be that she wanted to be superior to us? Or did she want us to say something so she could get us in trouble? What is it with people like that?? Sorry didn't mean to hijack the thread.

lilgirl if a staff nurse told you to shut so see could listen to the intercom. Just Shut Up. Important things are announced over the intercom like CODES. And you're darn lucky the said staff nurse did not report you to your professor for "The Look." In another post you said if you give respect you get respect. Giving the staff nurse the Look is not giving respect. Granted the staff nurse could have said it nicely but your response would have earned you a ticket off the floor.

Specializes in ER (new), Respitory/Med Surg floor.

I'm still relatively new. I was definitely not cocky I was nervous but allways asked questions. I did feel the phrase "nurses eat their young" when one day the other staff members were almost yelling arguing who was going to precept me because no one wanted to do it!!! Then an older nurse said "now lets not eat our young" it made me laugh then and now! What I find with totally brand new nurses is stuff not clicking with everyday care and policys that I allways have to play catch up on. I don't know if it's lack of orientation or maybe things just not clicking or not relating what you learned in school to practice. Makes me feel better at least that I'm able to differenctiate you have to know your stuff to practice because I thought I would miss some things which I have but nothing drastic that I am aware of. BUT it freaks me out because some people do not get certain things. For ex one new grad (i've only been working 2 years as an rn myself) a pt's resp rate was 33 all day she said. She told the NEUROLOGIST, not the primary about the rate and of course that md brushed it off and said the pt did not appear in any distress. And I said 33 all day? She said yeah and acted as if nothing was wrong. I'm bad at confronting someone but learning pretty darn fast because it's hurting pt's and makes the job so much harder that you turn catty but I try to be respectful and tell her to watch out for stuff like that. I assessed the pt and at first glance did not seem in distress but a min looking at her closely it was so obvious any movement and and she looked as if she may keel over. Well it wasnt' that bad but regaurdless that was really high. So I called md, stat cxr showed chf FULL of fluid not mild or mod full blown chf and gave lasix. I told her next time any vs rate very high tell the md (oh and the primary md wrote in his not no sob for that day). She was appreciative b/c she wants to do it right. It's just what else may happen. She forgot also to get an order for tpn not realizing you need an order everyday. So what i'm finding is maybe it's also short orientation or just not many experiences to realize what needs to be done. However that vs thing was a nasty one reguardless of orientation. She also didn't realize coumadin needed to be ordered everyday. Jeepers. I'm not perfect but all the people i'm working with are missing key things. We're short staff maybe that's a huge factor.

We all have flaws - at least I know I do. Unfortunately, some of them flare up during the most stressful of situations. Beginning a new job in a new field is one of them. I do believe there are a few downright arrogant people in this world and when mixed with inexperience it does spell disaster, but I also believe some orientees pose as confident workers to overshadow their fears & anxiety and in a vain attempt gain their peers' acceptance.

We are not only co-workers but mentors to our new grads & employees. When this behavior crops up I believe we must take a step back & look and listen closely. We must ask ourselves, what's missing in this equation? It's a GIANT red flag waving before us - yes, if we ignore it, more than likely it will come back & slap the new grad in the face but is it worth it to the patient, those who assist in the aftermath or the unaware oncoming nurse ?? That rope is plenty long enough to hang us all.

Our new grads need orientation, education, observation & constructive criticism. We know this investment far outweighs the cost. It benefits everyone in the long run. On the other hand, if the new grad is a danger to their patients then this behavior definitely needs to be addressed & reported to the BON.

Specializes in LTC/Peds/ICU/PACU/CDI.
well i too am a student. know it all......not. self assured maybe but not to the point that i would "question" a seasoned nurse. if i didn't agree w/something i would look it up or ask someone else w/out pointing out who i disagreed with. and i am sure there has been another thread about the pushy floor nurses. i find that if you give respect you usually get it in return.
sometimes there's a fine line between questioning a seasoned nsg for clarification because they're season & them perceiving the questions as the newbie *testing* their knowledge & dare i say authority!

i've been a nurse for ten years now (10 as a lpn & eight months as a rn). i've worked both in the military & civilian sector...acute & sub-acute/ltc/alf...etc & i can tell you it all depends on perception. before returning to uni for my rn...i'd would ask my rn colleagues for the reasons why for certain things....things that wasn't taught in "lpn" courses...things that were suppose to be out of our scope of practice. i'd ask for clarification because i wanted to learn the rationale of why some things had to be done one way for some patient & sooooo very differently for others. some of those nsgs would get their backs-up & huff 'n puff to the point of me wanting to just return to school so that i didn't have to *bother* them. then i ran into a few who were delighted that i was interested & encouraged me to further my quest for education. i remember one of my former rn colleague orienting me to a place i used to work at...anyhoo...she was explaining something to me pertaining to the unit & cut herself off by saying something like: "...oh...but you *know* this being you're an experienced lpn..." i remember telling her: "...i may be experience...but i always have room to learn!" i never got a warmer reception form a colleague as i got from this nsg because in her 25 years of precepting "new nsg"...she has never heard a new employee with years of experience so willing to admit to their strengths/weaknesses before & she found that refreshing.

so it's all in how questions are phrased & once the answers are given....may be the *know-it-all* new nsgs are just comparing their notes of the *perfect world* of nsg to the *real world* ones. we all know what *by-the-book* means & what *fly-by-the-pants* means too. sometimes newbies just need to know the *quick 'n the dirty* of what needs to be done...especially in areas of critical care. can't give them too much rope to hang as they may not survive the nsg field period. too me...deliberately letting someone hang themselves (with patient safety in mind) *is* still "eating your young." there's no two ways about it. as the expert nsg...it is contingent upon you to bestow your knowledge, experience, & yes...common sense upon the novice nsgs. to do otherwise is just plain mean.

cheers,

moe

Specializes in LTC/Peds/ICU/PACU/CDI.
we all have flaws - at least i know i do. unfortunately, some of them flare up during the most stressful of situations. beginning a new job in a new field is one of them. i do believe there are a few downright arrogant people in this world and when mixed with inexperience it does spell disaster, but i also believe some orientees pose as confident workers to overshadow their fears & anxiety and in a vain attempt gain their peers' acceptance.

we are not only co-workers but mentors to our new grads & employees. when this behavior crops up i believe we must take a step back & look and listen closely. we must ask ourselves, what's missing in this equation? it's a giant red flag waving before us - yes, if we ignore it, more than likely it will come back & slap the new grad in the face but is it worth it to the patient, those who assist in the aftermath or the unaware oncoming nurse ?? that rope is plenty long enough to hang us all.

our new grads need orientation, education, observation & constructive criticism. we know this investment far outweighs the cost. it benefits everyone in the long run. on the other hand, if the new grad is a danger to their patients then this behavior definitely needs to be addressed & reported to the bon.

exactly what i wanted to say in my previous post...but said more eloquently & effectively!

cheers,

moe

i never had any of that "eat your new" crap where i work, i worked there as a CNA so they took me in when i graduated and were all very helpfull. the best thing i done for myself in nursing school was work as a CNA. thats the most important advice i could give someone. i just makes you more confident on how to interact with patients and how to deal with somethimes rude family members. i dont think i could have made it through with out that, just watching the RNs start ivs and how they would handle situations taught me alot.

Specializes in Med-Surg, Trauma, Ortho, Neuro, Cardiac.

Oh yeah I've had a few of those. They know it all, tell you "I'm really just waiting to get into the ER or ICU". And are never around for cleaning up poop.

I agree that as experienced persons we much learn the difference between confidence and unsafe arrogance and ego.

Fortunately, they are few and far between. I do my best to make them listen to what I'm teaching and know what my expectations are. And if a patient needs cleaning they are right there with that wash cloth. They can sigh, roll their eyes, whine while we're cleaning up poop all they want. I have my job to do as a preceptor and I will not let the new grad or myself down.

Fortunately the new grad I'm precepting now is a sponge, always asking questions, and eager to work with the enthusiasm that only a new grad has. :)

Specializes in Specializes in L/D, newborn, GYN, LTC, Dialysis.

It's been rare for me to run into these types. Thank GOOD NESS! Most new grads are terrific!

Specializes in Neuro, Critical Care.
Oh yeah I've had a few of those. They know it all, tell you "I'm really just waiting to get into the ER or ICU". And are never around for cleaning up poop.

I agree that as experienced persons we much learn the difference between confidence and unsafe arrogance and ego.

Fortunately, they are few and far between. I do my best to make them listen to what I'm teaching and know what my expectations are. And if a patient needs cleaning they are right there with that wash cloth. They can sigh, roll their eyes, whine while we're cleaning up poop all they want. I have my job to do as a preceptor and I will not let the new grad or myself down.

Fortunately the new grad I'm precepting now is a sponge, always asking questions, and eager to work with the enthusiasm that only a new grad has. :)

I wish you were my preceptor Tweety:)

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