M.Div. considering BSN

Ruas61, BSN, RN · Jul 20, 2014

OK, first becoming a nurse is not going to guarantee one an automatic job and great income like people have been led to believe.

There is not a nursing shortage.

In some areas it is near impossible to find a job as a new graduate.

I have a co-worker who is an ordained minister in a major protestant religion and it makes no difference in his job from my observation. I have never thought to ask him. Our facility is secular and for profit.

In general, I don't think you're going to get any preferential treatment or added value per se because you have a religious degree. I could only see it being more desirable in a religious community sponsoring healthcare.

Not to say that it is without value, education and life experience always brings some unique component to being a nurse.

Good luck

SummerGarden, BSN, MSN, RN · Jul 21, 2014

Nope, no 100% guarantees in nursing for anyone. In fact, I know of a nurse who had an MS in Theology prior to nursing. She did not get any preferential treatment and had a hard time (like everyone) finding a first job. When she finally landed her first job (this was in '07 back when some new grads could find a job within a few months of graduation... this is not the case today in most parts of the country) she realized she made a mistake in choosing a nursing career and pursued other interests.

She found, as you will soon figure out, that nursing is not a field of saints or martyrs or good hearted people... Yes, some people are good, but our numbers are not greater than any other profession in America... In fact, we work for health care agencies that are customer service/profit driven. Even the non-profits worry about making money to expand facilities or to give out extravagant bonuses to executives!

Thus, I highly suggest you continue to do research. Better yet, become a tech and work with nurses. You will get a wakeup call sooner rather than after you graduate and realize that you may have made a mistake.

OOOPss... I almost forgot to mention... FYI, no one will care about past degrees or experience... You will be paid according to your nursing and/or nursing specialty experience.

Speaking of nursing specialties, every time you change you will be paid and treated like the newbie. So, some hiring managers may be desprite to hire and train a nurse not of that specialty, but most won't. At this time, even experienced nurses have a hard time changing specialties or growing his/her careers (being flexible) because there is no shortage of nurses with experience in most specialties.

I think teaching at private schools is more fulfilling for a spiritually driven person... but I could be wrong... I love private school teachers, so I am bias. :)

Good luck.

HappyWife77, BSN, RN · Jul 21, 2014

I think that would be a great combination.

It sounds like you may already have connections from your post...Which is great! A lot of nurses make no networks while in school and have hard time finding employement.

God can use you however he sees fit. Not everyone has the same beliefs so your gonna hear different opinions. Follow your heart and I am sure it work out. God bless.?

Kellymp · Jul 21, 2014

I appreciate the feedback. My question really had nothing to do with whether or not I'd get preferential treatment. I wouldn't expect that. And I am realistic, not expecting that a degree of any sort, in any field, guarantees success. My question was whether or not a degree in theology might be beneficial in the nursing field and how -- if at all -- it might expand career options down the road....i.e. teaching, opportunities to serve on ethics boards.

It is helpful to hear the perspective of nurses who are "in the trenches" and can speak from experience that there is not in fact a nursing shortage, that new graduate jobs are difficult to find, that there is politics and greed and misplaced priorities even in helping professions. As a minister in a large mainline denomination I can certainly relate to that.

One thing that does sadden me, however, is the level of jadedness that comes through on many of the posts on this website. I think we all start out in a field of work with grand, romantic notions of how it will be, and then are disappointed when reality is a whole lot different. But, I would hope that your chosen profession brings you some joy. And if it does, it would be really nice to hear about THAT too. What are the rewards of choosing nursing as a profession? Laying aside the junk that you have do deal with, what brings you JOY in nursing?

elkpark · Jul 21, 2014

I appreciate the feedback. My question really had nothing to do with whether or not I'd get preferential treatment. I wouldn't expect that. And I am realistic, not expecting that a degree of any sort, in any field, guarantees success. My question was whether or not a degree in theology might be beneficial in the nursing field and how -- if at all -- it might expand career options down the road....i.e. teaching, opportunities to serve on ethics boards.

I find it helpful, when considering this type of question, to turn it around. OP, how helpful, professionally, would a prior degree in nursing be for an ordained minister?

I've never encountered (in 30 years of nursing, in 5 different states, in a kazillion different facilities and settings) any kind of position that combined nursing and theology. People tend to be working as nurses, or members of the pastoral care service, but not both. There is such a thing as "parish nursing," in which nurses work with members of a particular parish/faith in an outpatient setting, but those positions are often volunteer positions (little or no pay). I'm assuming you want/need to earn a living, but, it that's not your top priority, you might want to look into that.

Nursing education positions (is that what you meant by "teaching"?) typically require advanced degrees in nursing. You might have an edge in getting appointed to an organization's ethics board, but that usually comes with advanced clinical experience and tenure at a particular facility (and, in every place I've ever worked, that has been a volunteer responsibility on top of whatever your "day job" is, not a job in itself). If you wanted to pursue a career in biomedical ethics, rather than nursing, specifically, that might be an option for you, but there are not nearly as many jobs for bioethicists are there are for nurses. :)

Obviously, your additional education and experience would benefit you greatly, personally, in your nursing practice, but I would not count on finding some way to combine the education and roles into a professional position. Of course, most anything's possible ... :)

Kellymp · Jul 21, 2014

That is a really helpful response. Nursing is a field I have thought about going into for about 15 years, ever since spending time with Medical Ministries International doing medical mission work in the Dominican Republic. I've gone off and done others things, pursued other goals, but always I seem to come back to nursing and a desire to work in a clinical environment. Who knows....I may get into it and decide it's not for me, but if I don't pursue it I imagine I will always wonder..."what if...".

Thanks for the wisdom!

Columnist · Jul 21, 2014

Parish nursing is a specialized field of nursing recognized by the ANA. It definitely combines nursing and pastoral care. Parish nurses are frequently part of the Pastoral Care of the hospital by which they are employed. The care they provide is not limited to an outpatient basis. In fact, much of their more intense care comes at the bedside as they guide families and patients through difficult emergency and end-of-life decisions and care. While Parish Nurses receive training in ministerial care, you would already have that.

Unfortunately, Parish Nursing is not recommended for a new nurse. As you are called upon to give care to people of all ages, levels of wellness, situations, environments, etc, it is important to have a wealth of nursing knowledge and experience

I wish you the best as you consider your options.

HappyWife77, BSN, RN · Jul 22, 2014

What brings me joy in nursing?

A lot of things, I absolutely love nursing and always have. I love the part that includes interactions of different patients. The interpersonal experiences of patient centered care, the roles of patient advocacy, leadership roles for patient care, able to work in an environment and field that values and expects integrity along with professionalism. Being a referral person and educator to clients and their families, empowering them to have better quality of lives.

Making a difference in someone's day and experience. There's a ton if stuff that we all could complain about ( the junk like you said Kelly). But I choose to lose the bad negative attitude and appreciate everyday and this beautiful chance at life that I have been given.

HouTx, BSN, MSN, EdD · Jul 23, 2014

Oh my gosh! I can see several types of nursing practice where OP's MDiv would be valuable.

Parish Nursing is a clinical nursing specialty. Jobs can be structured differently, but this role is focused on health needs of the parish (or whatever these divisions are called by a particular religion). It's a combo of public health, health teaching, assessment, etc. I'm in a city that has several "jumbo churches"... they have nurses in these roles.

Hospitals must have ethics committees. They are usually led by a clinician that is specially educated in medical ethics - which requires expertise in religious studies as well as ethics. My organization (faith based) actually has an ethics institute that conducts year long courses for staff who are interested in building skills in this area. The instructors are chaplains and ethicists.

Some high-level trauma facilities have specially trained clinicians who can 'bridge the gaps' to provide specialized support for patients and families who are caught up in traumatic situations. One of our hospitals has a SANE nurse who was a chaplain in her former career... she's wonderful.

Endless possibilities . . .

brandy1017, ASN, RN · Jul 24, 2014

I know of a nurse that got a MA ministry after her BSN, she was on the ethics committee (for free) and volunteered in church activities but nursing has been stressful. She's tried several different nursing jobs including home care and hospice which seems like a natural fit, but stress still remains an issue. Home care has it's own type of stress and long hours, paperwork, wear and tear on the car, and being on call at all hours. Also hospice can be controversial at times bordering on euthanasia at times in my experience.

In my experience nursing many times resembles more an assembly line than a job where you can actually talk to patients and make a difference. High staffing ratios, understaffing, overwork, micromanagement, computers, charting doesn't leave you a lot of time to have heart to hearts with your patients!

I think you would be better off using your ministry degree and getting a chaplain job, even if the pay is less. It would probably be more rewarding!

TriciaJ, RN · Jul 27, 2014

The joy comes from each individual patient whose life just got a little bit better from whatever we did or said. It's what keeps us going despite all the administrative and political crap that jades us.

Nursing is generally not a good choice for someone who's just looking for mobility, versatility or money. Most of us do it because we felt drawn to it, despite the drawbacks. Someone gave you some really good advice: start out as a CNA. That's where you'll find out if you're really drawn to it, or it you need a new game plan. What comes through in your post is a genuine need to serve others. That will lead you where you need to go. Good luck.