2nd Entry Nursing Applications for Sept. 2013 - U of T, York, McMaster

[cmkeenan]

Hello all, Just starting a thread here for any applicants to the 2nd Entry Nursing Program for U of T, York, and Mac.

People can:

-ask questions and/or post when they have received an offer of admission or rejection

-share their marks/volunteer experience

-support each other during the super stressful waiting game

-discuss application issues, essay questions, prerequisites, etc.

There was one last year and I found it super helpful to see what others were doing, when offers were going out, and which candidates were selected. It's also a good reference for next year's potential applicants.

For myself, I have applied to U of T, Mac, York, and Dalhousie, with an A- or 3.66 GPA overall and 3.63 in my last 30 credits (10 half courses or 5 whole courses). I do not hold a Bachelor degree, but am in 3rd year at York's Honours BA Psychology, and hold an Associate of Arts from Langara College in BC. I have several years experience volunteering for an inner-city after-school program, for a crisis intervention phone line, and with fundraising.

Last year I was rejected from U of T with 3.53 in the last 30 credits, and only 2 years post-secondary. I had a C+ in one of my reported pre-requisites.

Hope this helps everyone and best of luck to you all!!

[jules99]

timhortons,

Can you share your avg in % for Western applicants?

Thanks :)

Last year the admission average was about 83% and higher although there were a few limited exceptions for people with extenuating circumstances.

[pixiwoo]

Hey everyone, I was just accepted into McMaster's accelerated program this afternoon :)

[Cole91]

I got accepted to McMaster today! I am going to be declining though because I've accepted U of T's offer:)

[onwards]

I also accepted the offer from UofT. See you there!

[xkrystle]

Hey everyone!

So I have received acceptances from both mac and humber, and I am having the hardest time deciding between the two!

Anyone accepted offers to either of these programs?

I would really love to accept mac however I am slightly terrified of their PBL approach. Anyone else in the same boat?

p.s. good luck to everyone still waiting! I know how stressful it is!

[helm1190]

Hey I posted this on another forum but I think it might help you out!!

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[TD=class: alt2, bgcolor: #E1E4F2]I spoke to recent MAC accelerated nursing graduate on the phone who is currently working full-time as an RN in Ontario. She told me she did not want to completely deter me from the accelerated program at Mac, but she also wanted to give me an honest review of her experience. She told me the Problem Based Learning is a great concept, in theory. However, she told me that they take the PBL learning wayyyy overboard. She said a lot of learning is independent- you have to read and basically teach yourself the entire curriculum. She mentioned that there are 'tutors' available who sit in on each of your problem based tutorials weekly (small groups that students are assigned to at the beginning of program),however, they do not actually do any formal teaching- the tutors are there more to watch over the problem based tutorial session. She mentioned that she did enjoy the group meetings, however, the program would/could be a lot more solid if PBL was mixed in with regular, scheduled lectures. She found that when they would work through problems/the curriculum with her group- they would often split up the work- but if an individual did not do their section, or completed their section of the assignment poorly- that was left up to YOU to do and do their work too! This resulted in extra, unnecessary hours spent making up portions of the curriculum which were not covered properly in her PBL group. Although the student did attain a very high average while attending Mac- she stressed the fact that for the amount of work she had to do (which she said was tremendous)- she actually didn't learn that much content. She did not feel fully prepared when entering the nursing work force. She also mentioned that when entering the workforce, hiring hospitals and health care facilities are often VERY wary of students who come from Mac's PBL program- as the teaching style does not seem to sit well with many institutions and hiring hospitals and does not seem to cover as much important information as traditional nursing schools. She also mentioned to me that she could not truly tell me that she knew one person in her graduating class that actually liked the learning style and curriculum in the accelerated program at McMaster.

At other more traditional nursing schools like Western, there are regular lectures, tests and assignments AND group work. So you still get the connection and time spent learning and working with other nursing students, but also attend lectures to clarify information and topics- like a normal university program usually runs.

For this reason, I am now fully leaning towards Western as my number one school- and the bonus it is the fastest in Canada @ 19 months until completion!

Hopefully this helps!!

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[eeff]

Accepted into Mac this afternoon! :)

[berty103]

yes I am aware of that. I just wanted to know the averages for the top applicants.

[xkrystle]

Thank you so much for your response. Very helpful! Not what I was hoping to hear, unfortunately...however very informative and I appreciate it tons!

[eeff]

I've heard mixed reviews of PBL. Some negative, some positive. I think what you put into it is what you'll get out of it. I've heard PBL is beneficial in clinicals and after you graduate. But PBL can be frustrating in terms of the amount of time and work that goes into it.

I think if PBL wasn't an effective learning style for Nursing/Medicine.. Mac would have gotten rid of it years ago.

[timhortons]

I asked my friend who graduated from Nursing at Mac and is working as a nurse now about this quote and she thinks it's a pretty exaggerated view from someone in the program who likely had a bad experience. Everyone I know that has graduated from Mac's program has said that employers in fact place high value on Mac grads because of the skills acquired from PBL.

I can speak to the value of PBL personally since I graduated from a PBL based undergrad degree and went into a Masters degree that was very much focused on didactic learning, etc. Let me tell you though, the first few weeks of PBL I thought ***, how is this helping me learn, etc..seems like such a waste of time, etc. etc. PBL is very student focused and puts students at the centre of their learning, which means you are responsible for your learning. This means the onus is on you to figure out what you need to learn and how you'll go about learning it but of course, there is support and feedback along the way which will help you. I often felt tempted to scream "SOMEONE JUST TEACH ME IT AND I WILL MEMORIZE IT AND KNOW IT!!!" Lot of the similar sentiments that people who aren't used to PBL often feel.

However, this sentiment changed over time and changed drastically when I headed into my Masters and became so fed up with the same old boring lecture that no one listens to after the first five minutes, and some of the really terrible groups that I had to work in for group work, when there was any assigned...I really saw how my PBL degree helped me develop some of the skills around how to mitigate for these learning challenges.

Of course PBL takes a lot of work and will require much more effort because you're working with others but I think it's preparing you for a reflection of the real world. In PBL, you're teaching and learning about how you learn best and reflect...and how to work in a group. While these things sound simple and straightforward, I don't think people realize how difficult it is.

It sounds a bit cliche, I know but I think I can truly attest to this having had my foot in both worlds as well as having volunteer and research experience in clinical settings. Throughout grad school, I worked in jobs that were completely different, but while I learned to pick up the knowledge around content in a matter of time, it was always the research skills, the questions I asked, how I facilitated group meetings, my communication skills (both oral and writing) and the self-directed nature I went about my learning (while always looking for support when I felt it was needed), how I interacted with others that I was always complimented on through my evaluations. Everyone, in nursing and not in nursing, has told me that it is really the transferable skills you learn around knowing how to learn, reflect, work/communicate/lead effectively in a group that really helps you out in situations. By working through problems in groups, I retained so much more of the information that I just could have memorized (and probably forgot in less than a week...). I still remember the biochemical pathways of a bacteria causing diarrhea that I had to present an entire symposium on with my group members - a group PBL project that we worked on together for a whole year v. other biochem courses where I just memorized enzymes, etc. I forgot as soon as I set my pencil down following the exam. I was able to navigate and help put some structure and organization into the not so great groups I had to work with so we could accomplish our tasks effectively even though we didn't get along best naturally. I was able to take initiative to tell profs or supervisors when I thought I wasn't getting what I needed out of my learning, being upfront when I was uncomfortable with performing a task or asking them directly for help which I felt they appreciated. I think after talking to many health care professionals, my own experiences in undergrad/grad school/research+volunteer experiences, I felt Mac was the best choice for me because of their PBL learning environment, which I thought would ultimately help me become a better nurse.

However, my nurse friend did say that at her first clinicals, she may have been less prepared than she could have been but it was a matter of time and application of the skill set that she gained. There's always a learning curve in a new environment.

Anyways that's just my 2 cents! (Can you tell I'm going to Mac?! ) Of course, to each their own!

[eeff]

@timhortons - is there a Facebook group made for us attending Mac?