Mr. Harry the Excessive Hair Patient

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Yup you guess it, this post is all about pubic hair. I've been in the game for almost 10 years and I have no idea why CNA's or nurses ignore pubic hair or excessive hair in general! I had a nurse ask me to get an IV on a patient once who literally resembled Chewbacca. Fortunately I had success in his hand which is frowned upon at my institution but heck what else was I going to do? Oh but thats not the half.... What about when I have a patient whose on golytely or diarrhea??? The last thing I'm tryna do is fidget with 7 inch longs hair. I'm wondering if its OK to provide lil snip snip?

Specializes in ICU.

I will add - so I seem like less of a total jerk - the way the patient said that if she'd wanted to be shaved, she would have done it herself, was with some laughter. She was genuinely puzzled about why her pubic hair was shaved, and it was a frequent topic of conversation the rest of the night (more so than her surgical pain), but I didn't get the vibe that she felt assaulted or violated in any way. I imagine I wouldn't have had the same amused reaction if the patient had been truly upset.

I have never trimmed hair around the front part of the genitals, but I will say I have gotten a clipper for almost two inch long blond perirectal hairs on a c. diff patient before, where the cleanup of the rectal hairs was adding a good 3-4 minutes to the cleanup each time and cleanups were happening at least once per hour. Patient was vented/unresponsive, no consent was given, at least 30 minutes per shift was saved for the rest of the week.

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Specializes in Cardicac Neuro Telemetry.
Sexual violence survivor here, so don't tell me I'm trivializing myself by advocating for someone else's right to not have their genitals handled and altered without consent. You cannot put sexual violations on a hierarchy of who's allowed to be hurt and how much.

Whether it is sexual assault to handle someone's genitals and shave them, legally, depends on the motive of the person who did it. The motive in this case was clearly not to provide medical care, and the patient was unconscious and unable to consent/refuse, discuss, or even observe the procedure. If you have touched a patients genitals with no valid reason, it IS valid to ask what the motive actually was.

Even if you don't view it as sexual assault, there is no reason to laugh at a patient who has had their intimate body parts handled and altered without consent. Even if you don't believe it's sexual, it's deeply personal. It should never have happened, and dismissing a patient who had that experience and was horrified by it is just plain wrong.

Edited to add: I'd also like to note that to a survivor, having your bodily autonomy violated in nonsexual ways still evokes the fear and helplessness that "real" sexual assault created. Hearing other people tell you "It's not a big deal" is damaging. Hearing that healthcare professionals think it's funny turns my stomach.

I am truly sorry for what you have gone through. I think this has gone on enough. All joking aside, I seriously cannot believe I have argued about pubic hair the last few posts on an anonymous nursing forum.

Edited to add: While I don't view this as sexual assault, she still should have been asked. I even said that in one of my prior posts.

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calivianya said:
I will add - so I seem like less of a total jerk - the way the patient said that if she'd wanted to be shaved, she would have done it herself, was with some laughter. She was genuinely puzzled about why her pubic hair was shaved, and it was a frequent topic of conversation the rest of the night (more so than her surgical pain), but I didn't get the vibe that she felt assaulted or violated in any way. I imagine I wouldn't have had the same amused reaction if the patient had been truly upset.

I have never trimmed hair around the front part of the genitals, but I will say I have gotten a clipper for almost two inch long blond perirectal hairs on a c. diff patient before, where the cleanup of the rectal hairs was adding a good 3-4 minutes to the cleanup each time and cleanups were happening at least once per hour. Patient was vented/unresponsive, no consent was given, at least 30 minutes per shift was saved for the rest of the week.

Thanks for the clarification, Calivianya. The fact that it happened skeeves me out (no. medical. necessity.), but I'm glad the patient wasn't terribly upset.

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WOW! Sexual assault?!?!? Thats extreme. But lets say we took it that far, am I sexually assaulting a female patient when Im changing her diaper because I obviously have to wipe her lady parts? How about when I put a condom cath on (I hope I'm allowed to do that as CNA and all lol) That mean's I have to touch the patient's member, right? What about shaving a patient in general? I have shaven plenty of beards with and without permission just to make the the patient appear well kempt. For now on my patients will look like Santa claus before I ever pick up a razor lol

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humblebrag about how's she's an unlicensed personnel who runs circles around licensed nurses when it comes to IV insertion.

I don't care what a state ALLOWS, I would never allow someone without NURSING background to start an IV on me or a loved one![

QUOTE=itiswell;9053710]This is probably my favorite post yet on AN. Thank you Barbie for asking the hard hitting questions!

we all have choices buckybadger and for some reason (instead of clicking on a another post that fit your standards) you have decided to click on this and other posts by me to come to a false conclusion. I've never said I ran circles around any NURSE. This was simply a post about hair sorry you took it so serious sorry that you wasted your time doing research on me give. Give me hug hun:cheeky:

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WOW! Sexual assault?!?!? Thats extreme. But lets say we took it that far, am I sexually assaulting a female patient when Im changing her diaper because I obviously have to wipe her lady parts? How about when I put a condom cath on (I hope I'm allowed to do that as CNA and all lol) That mean's I have to touch the patient's member, right? What about shaving a patient in general? I have shaven plenty of beards with and without permission just to make the the patient appear well kempt. For now on my patients will look like Santa claus before I ever pick up a razor lol

I'm sure you can tell the difference between touching a patient's vulva to clean off excrement (the lady parts is the internal canal, and should not be penetrated for peri care) vs touching a patient's vulva when you were supposed to be checking their tele leads.

I'm sure you can tell the difference between shaving an unconscious patient who cannot express his wishes, and shaving an otherwise a/o x3 patient who is sedated for a procedure.

I doubt that you intend to change your practice based on my position that clipping pubic hair while a patient is unconscious (and you have no medical reason to do) so is inappropriate. It is inappropriate both because altering a patient's hair without consent and necessity is wrong and because touching a patient's genitals without necessity is wrong.

Patients have the right to have their wishes regarding their own body and hair respected. If having the hair on your head cut without permission is an issue (and it is; links and previous discussion here) then having your pubic hair shaved without permission is an issue.

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Specializes in ICU.
I'm sure you can tell the difference between touching a patient's vulva to clean off excrement (the lady parts is the internal canal, and should not be penetrated for peri care) vs touching a patient's vulva when you were supposed to be checking their tele leads.

Just a random related question, because I am honestly curious what everyone thinks...

What happens when poop is in the lady parts? Do you all go digging with a washcloth? Get a toomey syringe and try to wash it out with saline/water? Leave it in, hoping natural secretions will wash it out eventually? We start everybody on the vent on tube feeds unless they had abdominal surgery/pancreatitis, and many of them have constant diarrhea. I've had diarrhea puddles so large it's well up the patient's back, dripping on the floor, and squeezed up through the inner thighs all the way to the anterior thighs... and if it's puddling in the triangle between the pubic areas and the anterior thighs, 99% of the time it's in the lady partsl canal too.

I have some coworkers who will just leave it be but I usually try to go fishing with a washcloth. I don't want anybody getting any nasty lady partsl infections from retaining poop in their lady parts.

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Just a random related question, because I am honestly curious what everyone thinks...

What happens when poop is in the lady parts? Do you all go digging with a washcloth? Get a toomey syringe and try to wash it out with saline/water? Leave it in, hoping natural secretions will wash it out eventually? We start everybody on the vent on tube feeds unless they had abdominal surgery/pancreatitis, and many of them have constant diarrhea. I've had diarrhea puddles so large it's well up the patient's back, dripping on the floor, and squeezed up through the inner thighs all the way to the anterior thighs... and if it's puddling in the triangle between the pubic areas and the anterior thighs, 99% of the time it's in the lady partsl canal too.

I have some coworkers who will just leave it be but I usually try to go fishing with a washcloth. I don't want anybody getting any nasty lady partsl infections from retaining poop in their lady parts.

I like to squeeze a warm wet washcloth using whatever peri-cleanser the hospital carries and let gravity rinse front-to-back, then gently clean with a bit of an inward-curving swipe. I never go IN because it would take a great amount of pressure to get stool very deep on its own, and because if you forge in very deep, I'm not sure you're doing much besides shoving the residual stool around or pushing it deeper.

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Just a random related question, because I am honestly curious what everyone thinks...

What happens when poop is in the lady parts? Do you all go digging with a washcloth? Get a toomey syringe and try to wash it out with saline/water? Leave it in, hoping natural secretions will wash it out eventually? We start everybody on the vent on tube feeds unless they had abdominal surgery/pancreatitis, and many of them have constant diarrhea. I've had diarrhea puddles so large it's well up the patient's back, dripping on the floor, and squeezed up through the inner thighs all the way to the anterior thighs... and if it's puddling in the triangle between the pubic areas and the anterior thighs, 99% of the time it's in the lady partsl canal too.

I have some coworkers who will just leave it be but I usually try to go fishing with a washcloth. I don't want anybody getting any nasty lady partsl infections from retaining poop in their lady parts.

I've been known to go fishing if it's right there. I do keep in mind pushing it in more, a la Q-tips and ear wax, so it really

depends on where it is, yaknowhutimsayin'?

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Several off-topic posts removed.

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Specializes in Geriatrics, Dialysis.
WOW! Sexual assault?!?!? Thats extreme. But lets say we took it that far, am I sexually assaulting a female patient when Im changing her diaper because I obviously have to wipe her lady parts? How about when I put a condom cath on (I hope I'm allowed to do that as CNA and all lol) That mean's I have to touch the patient's member, right? What about shaving a patient in general? I have shaven plenty of beards with and without permission just to make the the patient appear well kempt. For now on my patients will look like Santa claus before I ever pick up a razor lol

This may sound silly but be careful about shaving that beard without consent. One of the CNA's I work with did this to an elderly gentleman to make him look what in her opinion was better. Turns out this man had a full, bushy Santa Claus beard his whole adult life. The family was NOT amused.

On topic with the pubes, while I've never removed any for ease of cleaning the peri area, I do have one elderly lady that requests that hers be trimmed occasionally.

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Specializes in Gerontology.

We had a nurse shave off a man's moustache. For the rest of his stay anytime he saw her, he would shake his fist at her and call her "thief"!

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