I was cruising the hospital websites as I do everyday as a new grad and came across this:
The Department of Nursing at Massachusetts General Hospital is running a New Graduate RN ICU Residency Program for six months from April 2011 to September 2011. RN residents will be hired and trained to work successfully in an intensive care setting.
Qualified applicants MUST have:
- a Baccalaureate of Science Degree in Nursing
- a current MA RN license
- less than 10 months of professional RN experience in a healthcare setting
- completed a clinical practicum in an ICU or experience in a patient assistive role in an ICU.
RN Residents will be eligible for benefits and paid a salary of $11.44 per hour. The schedule will be 40 hours per week with five 8-hour shifts. Day/Night rotation with weekends and holidays required.
11.44 an hour? They can't be serious...can they? They pay their CNAs more!
I'm sry you think i fit the stereotype of being a "flake." However if you were in my shoe im pretty sure you would be contemplating the same thing. I started this new grad program along with 10 other new grads and there are now 5 of us left. That should speak for itself that the program is not working that new grads in a market like this is not satisfied and wants to leave. I am sorry, actually im not but I am not one to sit in an unhappy setting for the sake of money. I feel no obligation to anyone. I went to school for 4 yrs to get my BSN and when hired despite thinking i may be compentent and doing my best, IF AN EMPLOYER THINKS OTHERWISE whether one day, 6 months or a yr on the job they have no obligation to keep me. I told that to one of my fellow cohort in the program who was not happy and the next day they called her told she has two weeks left after 4 months of training her. And thats the problem with some nurses. They are so unhappy with their jobs but won't take a stand and do something and so they stay and make their lives, the pts and their coworkers lives hell with their negative energy.
And I needed someone from my current job to use as a reference for the MGH position and the Assistant Nursing Manager gave me not only a great recommendation letter but told me to use her as a reference anytime. I think i give more credit to someone who knows this is not for them and walk away and go in search of their dream than someone who sits around just because.
And furthermore (to add to the post I just wrote above to CCLRN), yes, I agree with you, it's not my place to judge.
It does look odd to leave a place after they have trained you.
HOWEVER, this is an employer's market, meaning people can get rid of you at any time for WHATEVER reason; employers have the upper hand in hiring, firing and retention, not to mention the unprecedented assault we are seeing on unions. I don't take issue with people leaving their jobs if they are miserable places to be. I've contemplated finding other employment in my first year as a nurse because I was getting downstaffed all the time (like once a week). That doesn't work when you have bills to pay.
So yeah, I agree with many of your points. The whole staying-vs-not-staying is a really subjective issue. If you are being abused or taken advantage of in your position, then of course it makes no sense to stay at that place of employment. Personally, I want to give a year or two out of personal commitment, but that's just me and my situation. I also didn't say that anyone should stay somewhere 20 years just to pay back the opportunity to have a job right out of school. Those days are long gone for all sects of the economy, not just nursing.
No, I'm not. I'm telling you how it is. You can choose to ignore it if you want...
You telling me like it is includes the following quote from you: "new grads bring nothing to the table but liability and debt."
I take issue with this because I see a lot of people who have experience in nursing who really seem to have many personal issues with new grads. At one point in time you were also a new grad.
Ultimately it's really disheartening to see individuals such as yourself have such an overwhelmingly negative attitude towards the new generation of nurses.
Yes. I was a new grad once. And I brought nothing to the table but liability and debt! What do think? That a new grad brings vast nursing judgement and experience? If you think otherwise, then you are naive, at best.
As for calling this utterly obvious statement of truth "overwhelming negative attitude towards new grads" I just say yawn. Yawn. Seriously, if nurses have anything realistic to say about new grads, then it's attitude, negative, eating their young, mean, crusty, etc, etc. Again, yawn.
At some point, people need to leave the comfort of the defense mechanism, take a step back, and look realistically at their situation...
I am a new grad, and while I bring inexperience to the table, I think I also bring an enthusiasm for nursing. Each nurse who works at the bedside brings a unique perspective on what nursing is to them to the unit they work in. In addition, I bring academic excellence and clinical experience in an academic medical center and Level One trauma center. While I may not be as experienced as a seasoned RN, I am a valuable part of the nursing profession. I refuse to go into nursing thinking I bring nothing to the table, because then I have nothing to offer and shouldn't be there in the first place.
Who said you shouldn't be there? This is another example of people reading, and wanting to hear what they want to hear.
To be blunt, your clinical experiences mean nothing. I am not saying that new grads cant be good nurses, that absurd. And anyone who thinks that's what I said is just trying to find an excuse to disregard what my point was about.
As a new grad, FROM THE HOSPITALS POINT OF VIEW, you bring liability and debt. You cost a lot. I read 60k! You make lots of mistakes. You have no nursing judgement. Not yet. And if you think you do, then that's scary,
Many new grads, across all disciplines, leave quickly after orientation. That's 60k lost.
After 6 months, you start to become a functional part of the team. That is what this internship is about. Seeing who is willing to stay after orientation.
But hey, if you choose to see this attitude as new grad hating, then so be it. That is all your choice. It says a lot about how you see this world if thats the case...
This thread has been fascinating, on so many different levels. It brings into sharp relief a difference in maturity levels of posters that is often not immediately apparent.
MGH has simply realized that they are hiring, for the most part, late-stage adolescents who probably have never held a "real" job, much less something as demanding as nursing. They are hiring employees who are still going through a rapid sequence of life changes, and have yet to adjust to the long-term grind of the working world. Many will leave, taking with them MGH's time and investment. At $11.44/hr, at least the investment loss is somewhat mitigated. Is this "flaky" behavior? That's probably a little strong. But is it normal 22 year old behavior? Sure.
On a subtle perverse level, $11.44/hr may even attract better candidates than $30/hr. The candidates are more likely to "get it" (it's a training position, not a job) than those hired with an indignant "$11.44/hr? That's insulting!" sense of entitlement.
And therein lies the point of this whole thread. In a nutshell. This is why THIS internship was born, and why more internships will begin to sprout....Hospitals a paying out the ying to train new nurses, and they are lucky if many of them even stay the year.... And so, $11.44/hr is the result.
It can go both ways too. I'm sure that there are some senior level nurses working who should probably retire because they are now ineffective. New grads may be viewed as a liability, but they are the future of nursing. And when the economy was good, only a few short years ago, new grads were welcomed.
It's doubtful that MGH will attract the "mature" candidates they may want. The mature candidates have previous work experience and bills to pay. So, for the most part, it will be those nurses just entering the workforce. And if they are not able to be mentored properly by enough senior level nurses, that may become a problem. But they need to keep costs low...
Well I am sure this could be debated for years..but I for one and happy that Kartia911 and CaringRN made a decision for their lives. As a new grad many many moons ago I benefited greatly from an opportunity at Johns Hopkins. They did not call it an internship but in essence it was..it was an very intensive High Risk L&D position, first yr they accepted new grads, and I was one of 4 chosen.. It was so successful they hired 17 the next yr. I never ran into the problem many of you seem concerned about that these nurses will have no guidance once done with the 6 mos and neither did the 17 hired the following yr. I try to think back but it just never was an issue.. perhaps some of you will be right and this internship will not give them enough support but big teaching hospitals usually have their ducks in a row. It will still cost MGH a fortune in training even without the level of pay that many feel they should pay but obviously can get away without doing it.
Many fields such as business, engineering.. offer summer internships to students unpaid at all to help them learn and gain experience.
I guess some are upset that these ladies have already graduated and are licensed but many fields do not even have licensure.
I for one think we should wish these girls the best of luck and may it all come out like they hope. I am sorry but I just can not see what they are losing if they want to do this.. No one is making them so why judge them. I applaud them for having the guts to go for it. Healthcare is changing and those who can handle change tend to succeed much better than those who fear or avoid it.
I remember when I graduated and I had an internship I was paid, but not that low. It did guarantee me a job after completion.
But, you know things aren't the greatest here and they are going to do what they are going to do. Which obviously is doing what they do best and not do any favors for nurses.
I can't even get a job in anything, let alone nursing, so I would do it that is how desperate I am.
Soon to be new grad here (December)....2nd degree BSN, nearly a 4.0 gpa, Sigma Theta, great recommendations..........I'd take this residency @ MGH in a heartbeat, with a big fat smile on my face ($11.44 an hour or not!).
At the interviews, I asked how the RNs who went through the program in the past transitioned into their role as ICU nurses, and the two interviewers chuckled and said, "The ones who have stayed have done really well." They have had a number of people complete the 6 month residency only to relocate to be closer to boyfriends, etc. I can see how the hospital cannot afford to spend $30,000+ ($30/hr x 40hrs/wk x 26 wks) on 6 months of training for a nurse only to lose them within the first year. Something had to give.
Another possible option for the hospital would be to require the RN residents to sign a 2 yr commitment, but honestly, do they want an unhappy employee who is only there to finish out the time on their contract? Personally, I would never take a position that required a time commitment on the other end, not because I am a job hopper (in my previous career I stayed with both my employers 7+ yrs), but because I know that life can throw curve balls at you without warning--husbands can lose jobs, aging parents can get sick--things happen that are beyond your control.
I am currently working permanent nights in a LTAC an hour away from my house where I was only given 4 wks of training before being set on my own with 6-8 pts (most of whom are trached/vented). Yes, the money is good (about $30/hr with differentials), but compared to a position in the residency program? Six months of training at the #3 hospital in the country is a dream come true for me. I know there are kinks in the program that need to be worked out, but with MGH's strong reputation for education, training and support of its nurses, I am confident they will iron them out and give us the tools we need to be great ICU nurses.
CranberryMuffin
135 Posts
And furthermore (to add to the post I just wrote above to CCLRN), yes, I agree with you, it's not my place to judge.
It does look odd to leave a place after they have trained you.
HOWEVER, this is an employer's market, meaning people can get rid of you at any time for WHATEVER reason; employers have the upper hand in hiring, firing and retention, not to mention the unprecedented assault we are seeing on unions. I don't take issue with people leaving their jobs if they are miserable places to be. I've contemplated finding other employment in my first year as a nurse because I was getting downstaffed all the time (like once a week). That doesn't work when you have bills to pay.
So yeah, I agree with many of your points. The whole staying-vs-not-staying is a really subjective issue. If you are being abused or taken advantage of in your position, then of course it makes no sense to stay at that place of employment. Personally, I want to give a year or two out of personal commitment, but that's just me and my situation. I also didn't say that anyone should stay somewhere 20 years just to pay back the opportunity to have a job right out of school. Those days are long gone for all sects of the economy, not just nursing.
Sorry if my post caused consternation or offense.