I saw the post earlier about the nurse getting confused as a CNA and the way she was treated, and I just had to say something about it. I'm a CNA, in a nursing home, and I get that kinda stuff all the time. I get treated with disrespect like I don't know anything, even though I know the residents better than most anyone else. There are some nurses who help and try not to disrespect me, but every now and then I get the feeling of distaste even from them. The truth is I do more actual care for these patients then anyone else in the field. Alot of nurses say they got into nursing because they wanted to take care of people, but the fact is they spend more time passing meds, and doing paperwork, and getting paid alot more for it, then the people who actually do the care. I'm sorry untill you wiped up someones BM, or vomit, or urine, can you really say you take care of those people. So if you want to do actual care every now and then try helping out a CNA.
Sorry but I get really bitter about the disrespect I receive constantly from the nurses. Heres an example. I have one nurse I work with and our personalities constantly conflict, shes from another country and has a very rude and arrogant attitude. One night I was having to stay late and work a shift I wasn't scheduled for, nurse K asked me if I had got urine output on one of our residents. I said no I was going to due it on rounds in a half hour, mind you I am quite busy at this time. She says well you need to go get it now because I need it before I go home in 10 min. Mind you she is quite not busy at this time, sitting and reading a magazine. Tell me why she couldn't get off her butt and get herself if it was important for her.
This same nurse has nearly killed a resident who was having a heart attack. She didn't care that I said the resident was having chest pains, trouble breathing, and high blood pressure. Her response was that the resident doesn't take her medication so this is whats going to happen. I didn't know this but I later found out that the resident had a prescription for nitro and ativan in cases like this. It took her at least an hour before she delivered the nitro and she never delivered the ativan. When I asked her how I could make the resident more comfortable, she again changed subject and said how this will happen because she doesn't take her medication. I responded that just because she doesn't take her medication doesn't mean we have to be cruel to her. I reported her behavior but shes still working here.
She also does stuff that makes it perfectly clear she doesn't get her hands dirty. She'll go out of her way to have me clean up something that she could have done herself. I get this from all the nurses but shes the worst. The fact is though that I'm not an idiot I have two bachelors degrees, and I'm going onto PA school. Sometimes I know what a resident needs better than the nurse does, and they should know that. And even the aides that only have a high school diploma or GED, most of them have enough common sense and are with a patient long enough to see things nurses can't.
I'm sorry you are having a rough time. I am a tech at the hospital but I have also been a CNA in LTC. I find the nurses treat you differently working at the hospital. Don't get me wrong..there are still the ones who walk out of a pts room and call me to empty the urinal, but I have found that they are more apt to help out and change a pt when they find the bed wet. I am in my 4th of 5 semesters of the ADN program. I can see both sides of the coin now. Nurses do not have an easy job. In clinicals I have had only one pt thus far and it took me all morning to do what I had to get done. There is a ton of documentation you need to do and it seems you do not only do it once but the same thing gets documented in a few different places. Then you have to follow up on the orders, give meds, call the doc with lab results, make sure the pt is not in pain, make sure they have what they need...the list goes on and on...granted most of us go into nursing because we like the pt contact but sometimes it seems there just is not enough time in the day to give the pt care that needs to be given and this is when we depend on the CNAs. I made a promise to myself when I started NS and today my psych professor made us promise the same thing in clinicals. I promised to always treat my CNA and Unit secretary with the respect they deserve and to always help them out. I promised myself I would always remember where I came from. Both jobs are difficult. Each has its good side and its bad. But we all have to work together. It has to be teamwork or it is not going to work and we are going to do no good by our pts.
Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
I'm sorry you feel disgruntled and will keep my fingers crossed for you.
However, I know of LTC nurses who are required to pass meds, chart, and perform treatments on up to 70 patients within a very narrow time frame. 70 patients is an enormous load to deal with, so I can see why some nurses might not have the spare time to help you out.
Hi, I am currently a full time LPN student and a part time CNA (I was full time for yrs, until I started school). I understand that sometimes there's not enough respect givin to the CNA's. But that is a 2 way street. Some times there is not enough respect given to the LPN's and RN's. It so crazy how some people tend to think the grass is greener on the other side. The only thing greener is the pay that's all.
Each title has a specific job description. Each title has a full work load. I to did not understand this when I was working full time as a CNA. From what it looked like to me the RN's and LPN's where just passing meds and sitting behind the desk doing paperwork, while barking out orders for me to expedite, concerning pt care. But think again!!! That's not it at all. In no way am I downing the work that we as CNA's do, because yes it's back breaking. But LPN's help out and pt care also. As a student we only have 3 pt a piece in clinics. But we do everything. And passing meds is no walk in the park. You have to know interactions, contraindications, and all. You have to know that if that pt's vital are a certain number higher or lower that you may have to hold or give, certain things. And all the assessments that have to be done, and be done accurately. Plus nurses notes, and procedure's on every one of the pt's. That's a full load, that you are responsible for if anything goes wrong.
As I read aspentree13's post, I sense a lot of frustration. As a CNA, I've worked with some nurses who are disrespectful of the CNA's. However, I've also noticed that sometimes what comes off as disrespect is really exhaustion, frustration with not having more time to spend with patients or even burnout. But the bottom line is, patient care is what should come first. Everyone has a role to play when it comes to patient care and since CNA's can't pass meds, chart, etc..., then we need to do the physical work (not that this is always the fun part).
"The truth is I do more actual care for these patients then anyone else in the field. Alot of nurses say they got into nursing because they wanted to take care of people, but the fact is they spend more time passing meds, and doing paperwork, and getting paid alot more for it, then the people who actually do the care. I'm sorry untill you wiped up someones BM, or vomit, or urine, can you really say you take care of those people. So if you want to do actual care every now and then try helping out a CNA."
I have never worked in a LTC, I work in the hospital setting. Prior to becoming a nurse, I did CNA work. And I ran across a few nurses who would not lift a finger to help a CNA. But I also had nurses who would work just as hard as I.
Since becoming a nurse, I would imagine I have wipe more butts, cleaned up more puke, blood and other body excrements than you could ever phathom. Not only do nurses have to suction mucous from trachs, they have to change foul smelling, infected wounds that would turn even the most "steel" stomach.
Nursing is a team effort. Patient care does not only include "cleaning up patient", or turning patients. It also involves paper work (this is to let other health care workers know what is going on with that patient, as well as getting reimbursement). Medication is a very important part of nursing care, as this is the means to help the patient survive!
I understand your frustration. Been there, done that, bought the Tee Shirt! But, please don't generalized all nurses as lazy, incompetent, and uncaring. If you think nurses just sit around and do paper work and give medications, why don't you become a nurse, and find out. Walk a mile in a nurses shoes for one day and you will then understand.....
Don't mean to flame you for your opinion. I respect your rights. Please respect my right to voice my opinion.
I hope things get better for you. Please don't become bitter and please don't allow bitterness to affect the patient care you do.
My hat is off to all CNA's. I know how hard they work. I also know how hard nurses work!
I feel for your frustration. I know when I worked in LTC I worked till I dropped and a couple key nurses truly harassed me. I have learned since, this is not typical of nurses. I don't mean they are always kind and respectful, but mostly they are reacting to stress. You may just be working with a couple PIAs.
Also, it is important to know that patient care goes way beyond the services we provide, though what we do is baseline and essential. The paper work, the meds: these things are crucial to the well being of the patients. I have seen the best and most compassionate nurses get bogged down in paper work, and at those times, they don't seem to be as available to the patients as I would like them to be. That is a time to approach the nurse and ask her what can you do to help her. In calmer times, address the problems of understaffing and how to get help to give the best care possible. Treat it like a team effort, and you may find that you build a relationship that will really benefit your patients.
The sad thing is that in admistration in alot of LTCs, the management unwittingly sabatoge this team building by bouncing us all around.
All I can say is, I feel for you, and it may be that different circumstance will change this for you. But always, take a look at what the nurse has to do in a day before you judge too much on what appearences seem to convey.
I'm sorry you are not enjoying your job. As a nurse I run my ass off from the time I get to work until the time I pass the med cart keys to the next shift. I do help the CNA's out by toileting, transfering, getting fresh water, answering call lights, etc. Most of my time is spent passing meds, treatments, paperwork, and responding to emergencies. On the very rare occasion I am caught up I will walk the floor to see what I can do to help a CNA or patient. Did I mention responding to critical labs, calling docs, taking of doctor orders, talking to and responding to families' concerns? You will never see me sitting at the nurse station doing non-nursing related functions.
Keep in mind that the nurse has a limited amount of time to get meds passed and paperwork done. You are there to do the work you have described. While they can certainly help you (and most do when they have time) you cannot help them with their duties. You are both there to do a job. I'm sorry you are frustrated, but I was a CNA before I was a nurse so I have seen both sides.
I am an LPN for over 30 years, and I worked as an "aide" before I went to LPN school. We were just called aides back then and I only had "on the job" training, not a class like they do today. I worked my butt off, and I work my butt off now as an LPN and I really resent anyone having the audacity to say that I, as a nurse, do not care about my residents because I'm not out there cleaning up poop.
I work in a facility that cares for 110 residents of mentally and physically challenged conditions of varying degrees. These people can range from anywhere like the baby stage to full grown adults with behaviour problems so difficult that they can knock you to the floor in a second, or pull your glasses off and destroy them, or bite until they draw blood. Alot of days I have only one other LPN working with me to divide up these residents....that gives each of us approximately 55 residents to care for, and sometimes we can be alone in a room with any of these people. We have some very excellent caregivers who work directly with these people, and I have yet to see the attitude from them, that I feel you have conveyed thru your post.
In addition to what has always been my job of administering medications and treatments to these people, now we are going thru some very difficult changes in the way we administer our medications. We had an onsite pharmacist, but due to these changes, that is no longer available to us.
I just left my job at midnight after a very difficult night, and was unable to dig into the 8 very large boxes of medications that were delivered from a local pharmacy in town, that we are to go thru and review for accuracy. EVERY med card, every drug has to be reviewed for accuracy BY THE NURSES.
We have to make sure ALL of EVERY persons' meds are there, and that ALL of
the directions on the labels are correct, if incorrect it has to be written up as incorrect and returned to the pharmacy and reordered with correct instructions. This is an astronomical job for us, as we are essentially taking over many of the duties that did belong to the onsite pharmacist. NOW we don't have her to do these things anymore, and the nurses have to do it.
So ......you tell me.....when I am constantly working from 2:00pm until midnight, giving meds, watching for adverse side effects, giving treatments and doing programs for self administration of medications on 100% of these people, taking care of incidents where these people have fallen and busted their head wide open, have had seizure activity and I'm trying to get in contact with a doctor to get an order for medication, making arragements to send these people out to the emergency room to receive care for whatever ailment has decided to befall any person at any time, and THEN trying to work in time to checking in drugs for the residents...... WHERE do I fit it in to go help a CNA and clean poop for them???
Who is going to help me with my job???
You know, we all have jobs to do............you have a job, and granted, it is a very difficult job, and I know you sound frustrated. Seems like you are not getting some of the help you should be getting. AND I have a job.
But until you come over here and spend ONE SHIFT with me and do what I do, don't say that I don't care about my residents because I'm not wiping their butts.
And just for information, I HAVE wiped plenty of butts. I'm not too good to do it.......it's just that with the amount of work and responsibility that has been placed on me and my co-workers...we don't have time to clean butts. We go look at any skin condition to evaluate it at any time, but we do NOT have time on THIS job to be cleaning butts. It's just not there.
I am sorry for your frustraion and that you feel like you're not getting any support, but I, too, am very frustrated, and very tired. But I have to eat. So back to this job I will go, again, tomorrow.
have always said (and I really SAY it) that CNAs should make more than nurses. They have the hardest job of almost anyone I know and they don't make squat.
That would be fine with me if they were solely accountable and responsible for their actions. I do think they should get paid more, but I don't think they should make more than the nurses.
Alot of nurses say they got into nursing because they wanted to take care of people, but the fact is they spend more time passing meds, and doing paperwork, and getting paid alot more for it, then the people who actually do the care. I'm sorry untill you wiped up someones BM, or vomit, or urine, can you really say you take care of those people. So if you want to do actual care every now and then try helping out a CNA.
The fact is most of did get into the nursing profession because of a strong desire to help people. I work on a med-surg unit and I will put more people on/off bedpans, empty more urinals, provide more water to patient, turn & position, clean more stool/urine d/t incontinence, assist more people ambulating, etc during the first 4 hours on any given shift than the 3 CNAs I work with do for their entire 8 hour shift. All this along with other responsiblities my job entails. The problem with this situation is that I am impeded from doing my job effectively, patients don't receive the care they should all because unfortunately on this unit 8 out of the 11 CNAs I work with have a "too posh to wash" attitude. I know my patients better than the CNAs I work with. I realize that this may sound like I'm painting all CNAs with the same brush, believe me I know there are a lot of CNAs out there that take pride in their job, work hard, go above and beyond, that are kind and compassionate, that are intelligent, and are team players.
I get treated with disrespect like I don't know anything, even though I know the residents better than most anyone else.
Do you not think nurses have to deal with being disrespected, or treated like they don't know anything? I've been disrespected by housekeeping, CNAs, patients/their families, doctors, other nurses, supervisors, etc. I've been treated like an idiot by them also. Those that treat others disrespectfully aren't usually selective in who they dish it out to. They tend to treat everyone they encounter that way. Respect does work both ways: if you want to be respected, treat others with respect.
One night I was having to stay late and work a shift I wasn't scheduled for, nurse K asked me if I had got urine output on one of our residents. I said no I was going to due it on rounds in a half hour, mind you I am quite busy at this time. She says well you need to go get it now because I need it before I go home in 10 min. Mind you she is quite not busy at this time, sitting and reading a magazine. Tell me why she couldn't get off her butt and get herself if it was important for her.
Now, I can actually understand things like this ticking you off. Right up there with nurses who search 10-15 minutes for a CNA to fetch water. Believe me nurses like this are no picnic to work with for the other nurses. They're the ones others have to do "clean up" on for all that they don't do.
Specializes in med/surg/tele/neuro/rehab/corrections.
My CNA class is now at a SNF so these are observations from a CNA student. The LVN's who work there are usually behind the desk doing paperwork. Look very busy. I have never seen them read or do anything leisurely! I have also seen them pass meds on a cart. And then they run to some emergency down the hall. The CNA's take care of 9 patient's each and do a lot for them. It is wonderful work but I can see that there is stress all around. Everyone is working hard including all the people working for housekeeping. It seems we students have it best because we can take the time to interact with the residents more and the residents really appreciate it too. :)
I say if someone is really bothering you at work then just quietly look for another job. It's funny but most people who are hard to get along with tend to stay with one job so it's best to look elsewhere if you absolutely can't stand said person.
Q: How many nurses does it take to change a light bulb?
A: None, they make a CNA do it.
I'm currently a CNA, but the grass doesn't look much greener on the other side because I have plenty of nurse friends who piss and moan about their jobs as well. I'm very glad that I'm a CNA becase when I am a nurse, I'll appreciate and respect the aides. What it all comes down to is empathy. I wish that at some point in every doctor should be a nurse or MA, every nurse should be a CNA, and every CNA should be a housekeeper. If we walked a day in the shoes of those who we boss around, the world would be a much better place.
I'm currently working at a nursing home, and I make the same amount as my friends who are scooping ice cream. Each aide is responsible for 14-16 residents. I agree that we should be paid more. I'm applying to hospitals that pay better, because lower pay would be worth it if the patient:staff ratio was better, but this is ridiculous.
Aides also get a bad rap because of the Marthas. On a regular basis, I see people neglect to wipe residents down when changing diapers even if the resident is reeking of urine, doing pericare from back to front even if there is BM, or not changing gloves after handling diapers when performing tasks and going to the next residents. I know that the techniques taught in the CNA classes are pure idealism due to time constraints and thrashing residents, but that kind of slacking is disgusting and I will adress it if I see it (without trying to seem like a rat). It's not completely the fault of the aides: they are critically understaffed and have no choice but to take shortcuts. Do nurses take gross shortcuts like that as well, or are their responsibilities much more critical?
AuntieRN
678 Posts
I'm sorry you are having a rough time. I am a tech at the hospital but I have also been a CNA in LTC. I find the nurses treat you differently working at the hospital. Don't get me wrong..there are still the ones who walk out of a pts room and call me to empty the urinal, but I have found that they are more apt to help out and change a pt when they find the bed wet. I am in my 4th of 5 semesters of the ADN program. I can see both sides of the coin now. Nurses do not have an easy job. In clinicals I have had only one pt thus far and it took me all morning to do what I had to get done. There is a ton of documentation you need to do and it seems you do not only do it once but the same thing gets documented in a few different places. Then you have to follow up on the orders, give meds, call the doc with lab results, make sure the pt is not in pain, make sure they have what they need...the list goes on and on...granted most of us go into nursing because we like the pt contact but sometimes it seems there just is not enough time in the day to give the pt care that needs to be given and this is when we depend on the CNAs. I made a promise to myself when I started NS and today my psych professor made us promise the same thing in clinicals. I promised to always treat my CNA and Unit secretary with the respect they deserve and to always help them out. I promised myself I would always remember where I came from. Both jobs are difficult. Each has its good side and its bad. But we all have to work together. It has to be teamwork or it is not going to work and we are going to do no good by our pts.