I am new to allnurses.com and I was wondering how come you don't include Medical Assistants in any of your groupings?? I went to school for 18 months to get my honors degree and I have wanted to be a nurse all my life (eventually I will work my way up to RN). Your website was discovered by while trying to find a college in my area (Indianapolis) that has a LPN course that will accept my transferring credits (still haven't found one).
But if you could answer that question as to why MA's are not included it would be greatly appreciated. Also if anyone knows of a college in the Indianapolis area that accepts credit transfers from Indiana Business College--Medical that would also be appreciated.
Well, I did alot of reading on the Indiana SBON and on the NCSBN web sites.
Altho the sites did not specifically....that I could FIND....define a nurse for sake of licensure......both sites repeatedly talked about .....RN's, APN's, LPN's or LVN's. Nowhere did either site even mention MA's, that I could find.
I live in Arkansas and I know for a fact that the ASBON defines a nurse as an RN, LPN, or APN and I mean it specifically defines nurse..........and it goes on to say that it is ILLEGAL to use any one of these titles in such a way as to make someone think they are an RN, APN or LPN, if the person does not hold the license.
I have read that definition on Arkansas' web site...it's in the Adobe format, so I don't know how to copy and paste it here for your viewing, but it's there.
I just think it is very interesting that the OP is doing things such as seeing his/her "own" patients and writing RX's on a quarter of a year of pharmacology training....that IS 3 months isn't it?, doing physicals, lancing abcesses and that IS a surgical procedure......oh, boy, I was born in Indiana, but I don't think I want to move there. When I give a doctor my hard earned money I want HIS diagnosis/opinion/reccomended/prescribed treatment.
Just went to the doc today......he has an LPN working for him, but in NO WAY does she do more than what her license says she can do. She takes my b/p, temp, writes down my complaint and HE makes the diagnosis.
I am amazed......you are right up there next to the doctor, and look how long it took you vs the physician to study all that medical and pharmacology.
Amazing.
That's akin to me going to the pharmacy to pick up a prescription and asking the girl who hands me the script "Are you a pharmacist?" Unless that person is clearly out of their scope, I have no reason to ask that question.
And in response to this post by Lorraine.......I was at Walmart Pharmacy today to pick up my RX of
Cephalexin.
While I was standing there I observed something very unusual. They have these little counters back there in the pharmacy...there was one on the end of each aisle. I saw one of the workers....and she was NOT a pharmacist.....I've been there many times and I recognize the Pharmacists from the other staff......anyway this staff person was at this little end of aisle counter........she poured a liquid medication out of one bottle into another bottle, slapped a label on it, and turned around and handed it to the Pharmacist.
I was amazed at this. As an LPN I cannot even pour liquid from one bottle into another bottle of the same med.....that is dispensing.
Now to the pharmacy's credit......I did not actually observe the beginning of this sequence of events. MAYBE the Pharmacist got the med off the shelf, computed out the label, and gave it to the staff member to do the actual pouring.
I was feeling too bad to question anyone about this procedure.
That's akin to me going to the pharmacy to pick up a prescription and asking the girl who hands me the script "Are you a pharmacist?" Unless that person is clearly out of their scope, I have no reason to ask that question.
I ask this. Reason? No nametags usually, and how else am i supposed to know who i'm talking to.
Specializes in LTAC, Homehealth, Hospice Case Manager.
(blah blah) my friend went to MA school and paid a couple of 1000 and is only making 8-10 bucks.. she does not even make enough to support her family and plus she has to pay back the loan.. what a waste of time....
Being a fellow MA, I have to agree with LorraineCNA. I find this reference to my title somewhat offensive. Do you, foxyhill21, not agree that it takes everyone of us in the medical field to be a team and make it work? Tell me, if someone's title doesn't state RN or MD, will that person be beneath you? Will you be one of those that doesn't appreciate your tech's and all the hard work they do? "Student nurse" (and I am a student nurse as well)...at this point the only thing that tells me is you can hang in there academically, doesn't tell me you can do the job. Be careful of the toes you step on today...they may be attached the behind you have to kiss tomorrow.
My main point that was when someone comes in to take my BP or hx, I'm assuming that person is either a nurse or a MA. I don't really need to know which one unless they go to perform a procedure that I might consider out of the scope of a MA.
If a person asks, I tell them I'm a MA, my name tag says "Medical Assistant" and my full name. I am certified but I don't even add that to my title at work. I'd get a little annoyed if everyone I roomed asked me "Are you a RN?" as soon as I walked in the room. I just don't think it's relevant unless I'm performing a task that should be performed by a nurse (which I'm not).
MA's are permitted to dispense/administer drugs as per physician's orders and supervision, at least here in PA. As I'd posted elsewhere, most states have a really vague scope of practice for MA's. There are only a handful of states (California being one) that have a specific scope of practice for MA's. In most states, MA's fall under the UAP category which for the most part means if you're trained to do a procedure either by formal schooling or by the physician (he knows you're trained for the task) and it's not a task prohibited by law in your state (if your state, for example, legislates that you must be a RN to start an IV) you can perform it under the docs supervision.
Personally, I wish MA's would go to mandated licensure. I think it would elevate the status (and pay) of the field. I would actually prefer a clear cut scope of practice which we don't have in most states. I also don't like the idea that certification is optional for MA's. I don't like the idea that just graduating a MA program allows you to work in the field, you can "graduate" with one point above a failing grade. Just my 2 cents as a MA.
The first two lines in your last paragraph says it all. That is the answer.
My main point that was when someone comes in to take my BP or hx, I'm assuming that person is either a nurse or a MA. I don't really need to know which one unless they go to perform a procedure that I might consider out of the scope of a MA.
If a person asks, I tell them I'm a MA, my name tag says "Medical Assistant" and my full name. I am certified but I don't even add that to my title at work. I'd get a little annoyed if everyone I roomed asked me "Are you a RN?" as soon as I walked in the room. I just don't think it's relevant unless I'm performing a task that should be performed by a nurse (which I'm not).
MA's are permitted to dispense/administer drugs as per physician's orders and supervision, at least here in PA. As I'd posted elsewhere, most states have a really vague scope of practice for MA's. There are only a handful of states (California being one) that have a specific scope of practice for MA's. In most states, MA's fall under the UAP category which for the most part means if you're trained to do a procedure either by formal schooling or by the physician (he knows you're trained for the task) and it's not a task prohibited by law in your state (if your state, for example, legislates that you must be a RN to start an IV) you can perform it under the docs supervision.
Personally, I wish MA's would go to mandated licensure. I think it would elevate the status (and pay) of the field. I would actually prefer a clear cut scope of practice which we don't have in most states. I also don't like the idea that certification is optional for MA's. I don't like the idea that just graduating a MA program allows you to work in the field, you can "graduate" with one point above a failing grade. Just my 2 cents as a MA.
Being a fellow MA, I have to agree with LorraineCNA. I find this reference to my title somewhat offensive.
I don't think Foxyhill meant being an MA is a waste of time. I think she meant $2000 and a year of school for $8-10 was a waste of time and money.
Oh and if the doctor says the Nurse is coming in, I might also be inclined to ask whether or not he/she is a nurse. This tells me a lot about my Doc's character and whether or not he is trying to give the appearance of having more nurses on staff than is actually so.
Okay, will someone please explain to me WHY RN's and LPN's are so regulated, and taught to NOT do anything outside the scope of their practice, then along comes MA's and they can do everything......
As the OP says, sees her own patients, does physicals, diagnoses and makes decisions on what types of medications they need, and writes out the RX...and to her credit she DID say the doctor signs off on the RX's, and apparently she even does minor surgery......LANCING an abcess is minor surgery.....taking a knife to the skin IS surgery.
I read over on that web site someone posted about MA's and apparently they are even doing IV's and infusions.....some are. Other MA's did say that IV therapy was NOT taught in the schooling they went to.
What do we have RN's and LPN's for..............???
We can't even do the things she has described. I don't even know of an RN who has done suturing or stapling.....I know some who REMOVE it.
I, as an LPN, can Dermabond a laceration, but the patient has to see the physican at next clinic call.
My opinion is this.....Move over fellow nurses!!
The nursing shortage is not so short anymore.......we have a new group of people ready to move in and fill the spots formerly occupied by licensed NURSING personnel. Medical assistants and Certified Medication Aides can do it all, at a much cheaper pay rate, saving Medicare, hospitals, doctors offices, and nursing homes loads of money.
I think it's already been established that the OP was out of her scope of practice as is anything that includes assessment or diagnosis.
IV's can be started by MA's who have received appropriate training and as permitted by law (back to the "as long it's not prohibited by law).
You might find this role delineation chart and article useful.
Lorraine
CMA, CNA
Okay, will someone please explain to me WHY RN's and LPN's are so regulated, and taught to NOT do anything outside the scope of their practice, then along comes MA's and they can do everything......
As the OP says, sees her own patients, does physicals, diagnoses and makes decisions on what types of medications they need, and writes out the RX...and to her credit she DID say the doctor signs off on the RX's, does physicals, and apparently she even does minor surgery......LANCING an abcess is minor surgery.....taking a knife to the skin IS surgery.
I read over on that web site someone posted about MA's and apparently they are even doing IV's and infusions.....some are. Other MA's did say that IV therapy was NOT taught in the schooling they went to.
What do we have RN's and LPN's for..............???
We can't even do the things she has described. I don't even know of an RN who has done suturing or stapling.....I know some who REMOVE it.
I, as an LPN, can Dermabond a laceration, but the patient has to see the physican at next clinic call.
My opinion is this.....Move over fellow nurses!!
The nursing shortage is not so short anymore.......we have a new group of people ready to move in and fill the spots formerly occupied by licensed NURSING personnel. Medical assistants and Certified Medication Aides can do it all, at a much cheaper pay rate, saving Medicare, hospitals, doctors offices, and nursing homes loads of money.
I meant it was a waste of time for my friend b/e she does alot of work and only gets paid 8-10 dollars and also she could have went to LVN school for 3mts longer and made more money... now she is struggling and having a hard time b/e the pay is so low and plus she has to pay back a loan
Being a fellow MA, I have to agree with LorraineCNA. I find this reference to my title somewhat offensive. Do you, foxyhill21, not agree that it takes everyone of us in the medical field to be a team and make it work? Tell me, if someone's title doesn't state RN or MD, will that person be beneath you? Will you be one of those that doesn't appreciate your tech's and all the hard work they do? "Student nurse" (and I am a student nurse as well)...at this point the only thing that tells me is you can hang in there academically, doesn't tell me you can do the job. Be careful of the toes you step on today...they may be attached the behind you have to kiss tomorrow.
I don't think Foxyhill meant being an MA is a waste of time. I think she meant $2000 and a year of school for $8-10 was a waste of time and money.
Oh and if the doctor says the Nurse is coming in, I might also be inclined to ask whether or not he/she is a nurse. This tells me a lot about my Doc's character and whether or not he is trying to give the appearance of having more nurses on staff than is actually so.
Okay....the only advice I have for the origional poster is this:
If or when you become licensed by your state as an LPN or RN, I would fear that you will want to practice beyond your scope of learning because you had such a vast array of medical experience as a MA.
This is what would land you in a court of law...if you practice as a nurse like you did/do as a MA. Just because a doctor said you can do something....doesn't necessarily means you should !:nono
When and if you do become a nurse...you will then understand:nurse:
Well, you could ask the doc if it will be a nurse or a MA coming in. That would ease your mind and not put whoever comes in into an awkward position. If I were a LPN working the back office in a docs office, I wouldn't appreciate being asked if I were a RN as soon as I walked in the room either.
Lorraine
CMA, CNA
I don't think Foxyhill meant being an MA is a waste of time. I think she meant $2000 and a year of school for $8-10 was a waste of time and money.
Oh and if the doctor says the Nurse is coming in, I might also be inclined to ask whether or not he/she is a nurse. This tells me a lot about my Doc's character and whether or not he is trying to give the appearance of having more nurses on staff than is actually so.
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LPN1974, LPN
879 Posts
Well, I did alot of reading on the Indiana SBON and on the NCSBN web sites.
Altho the sites did not specifically....that I could FIND....define a nurse for sake of licensure......both sites repeatedly talked about .....RN's, APN's, LPN's or LVN's. Nowhere did either site even mention MA's, that I could find.
I live in Arkansas and I know for a fact that the ASBON defines a nurse as an RN, LPN, or APN and I mean it specifically defines nurse..........and it goes on to say that it is ILLEGAL to use any one of these titles in such a way as to make someone think they are an RN, APN or LPN, if the person does not hold the license.
I have read that definition on Arkansas' web site...it's in the Adobe format, so I don't know how to copy and paste it here for your viewing, but it's there.
I just think it is very interesting that the OP is doing things such as seeing his/her "own" patients and writing RX's on a quarter of a year of pharmacology training....that IS 3 months isn't it?, doing physicals, lancing abcesses and that IS a surgical procedure......oh, boy, I was born in Indiana, but I don't think I want to move there. When I give a doctor my hard earned money I want HIS diagnosis/opinion/reccomended/prescribed treatment.
Just went to the doc today......he has an LPN working for him, but in NO WAY does she do more than what her license says she can do. She takes my b/p, temp, writes down my complaint and HE makes the diagnosis.
I am amazed......you are right up there next to the doctor, and look how long it took you vs the physician to study all that medical and pharmacology.
Amazing.
And in response to this post by Lorraine.......I was at Walmart Pharmacy today to pick up my RX ofCephalexin.
While I was standing there I observed something very unusual. They have these little counters back there in the pharmacy...there was one on the end of each aisle. I saw one of the workers....and she was NOT a pharmacist.....I've been there many times and I recognize the Pharmacists from the other staff......anyway this staff person was at this little end of aisle counter........she poured a liquid medication out of one bottle into another bottle, slapped a label on it, and turned around and handed it to the Pharmacist.
I was amazed at this. As an LPN I cannot even pour liquid from one bottle into another bottle of the same med.....that is dispensing.
Now to the pharmacy's credit......I did not actually observe the beginning of this sequence of events. MAYBE the Pharmacist got the med off the shelf, computed out the label, and gave it to the staff member to do the actual pouring.
I was feeling too bad to question anyone about this procedure.