MA's Calling Themselves Nurses?

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Ok, we've just switched doctors under our medical plan. So I go in for a routine checkup, etc. at this clinic. They tell me the nurse will be with me shortly. Of course, since I'm a student, I always ask nurses how they like their jobs etc. So I ask: You're a nurse, right? She nods. How do you like the job ... blah, blah blah ... Not once did she correct me. Then I ask where she went to school. When she names the school, I'm confused because I've never heard of it.

That's when she says, "Oh ... I'm an MA."

Then the doctor comes in, and tells me "the nurse will be with you shortly." I'm like ... what nurse? Then I find out that everybody at the "Nurses Station" is actually an MA, but everyone, from the receptionist to the doctors, are referring to these MA's as nurses. My husband, who has to go in fairly frequently, says they told him the same thing ... that these MA's were nurses.

Now, I don't know if there's actually anything wrong with this, and maybe this isn't a big deal but, it seemed really weird to me. I've been to other doctor's offices where the staff was very careful to tell me they were MA's, not nurses. Especially when I asked if they were a nurse or not.

Any thoughts? Is this allowed? Why would even doctors refer to MA's as nurses?

:confused:

And, as previously noted, their educational credentials are the same as a lot of nurses.

Well, that's not true in my state at all. Far from it. I'm sure a lot of nurses will argue with you on that point as well.

If you read through this thread, even some former MA's talk about how they were not adequately trained for certain tasks they were asked to perform in doctor's offices. And, they didn't realize how dangerous it was until they studied those issues in nursing school.

I'm sorry, but MA training doesn't come close to nursing. That is, if we're talking about RN's versus MA's.

:rolleyes:

Well, that's not true in my state at all. Far from it. I'm sure a lot of nurses will argue with you on that point as well.

If you read through this thread, even some former MA's talk about how they were not adequately trained for certain tasks they were asked to perform in doctor's offices. And, they didn't realize how dangerous it was until they studied those issues in nursing school.

I'm sorry, but MA training doesn't come close to nursing. That is, if we're talking about RN's versus MA's.

:rolleyes:

I'm always amazed at how virulent some responses can get when we talk about any of our allied health brethren and compare 'them" to "us"...at the least provocation as well. We sometimes sound like the AMA when they're on a tirade against NPs...

I'm always amazed at how virulent some responses can get when we talk about any of our allied health brethren and compare 'them" to "us"...at the least provocation as well. We sometimes sound like the AMA when they're on a tirade against NPs...

Well, you're the one who brought up comparisions. If you're going to claim that MA's have the same training as a lot of RNs, that's going to provoke a response. And, if we're supposed to excuse Doctors for referring to MA's as nurses because they're training is supposedly the same, well, I disgree with that, because the training is not the same. Not to the mention, it's a violation of law in my state.

:coollook:

And, as previously noted, their educational credentials are the same as a lot of nurses.

:eek: Excuse me while I hyperventilate. Lots of people have the same educational degree as a nurse. So hey why not let someone with a BS in gardening call themselves a nurse, while they give you a shot and dispense medical advise. After, all they work in a nursery and "nurse" sick trees. Makes sense to me. Just because a MA is a useful part of the medical team does not make them a nurse. And just because they also hold the same level of degree (i.e., aas, bs) does not make their training the same as that of a nurse. Just like no matter what the training of a nurse (such as CNM, CRNA or NP) does not make them a doctor.

Specializes in LDRP; Education.
:eek: Excuse me while I hyperventilate. Lots of people have the same educational degree as a nurse. So hey why not let someone with a BS in gardening call themselves a nurse, while they give you a shot and dispense medical advise. After, all they work in a nursery and "nurse" sick trees. Makes sense to me. Just because a MA is a useful part of the medical team does not make them a nurse. And just because they also hold the same level of degree (i.e., aas, bs) does not make their training the same as that of a nurse. Just like no matter what the training of a nurse (such as CNM, CRNA or NP) does not make them a doctor.

Excellent post and I couldn't have said it better myself. :)

excellent post and i couldn't have said it better myself. :)

thank you. i am only a prenursing student but as a consumer it really irks me to think of a non rn or lvn calling themselves a nurse. so i am going to research some of the laws of states not previously mentioned and will update as i find them. here is my state az laws. as you can see in az mas and cnas may not use the term nurse.

http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/32/01636.htm

32-1636. use of title or abbreviation by professional nurse

only a person who holds a valid and current license to practice professional nursing in this state or in a party state pursuant to section 32-1668 may use the title "nurse", "registered nurse", "graduate nurse" or "professional nurse" or the abbreviation "r.n.".

this is interesting.

http://www.fsmaonline.org/officenurse.htm

"office nurse" title for medical assistants is legally dangerous

by donald a. balasa, jd, mba, cae

aama executive director and legal council

in some circles, the term "office nurse" has come to be used interchangeably with "medical assistant." this practice is fraught with legal peril, and should be avoided at all times by medical assistants and employers.

most states license two categories of nurses: registered nurses (rns) and licensed practical (or vocational) nurses (lpns or lvns). state nursing practice acts frequently forbid any person not licensed as a nurse to practice nursing or to use the term "nurse" in reverence to themselves. if these laws are not obeyed, the persons calling themselves nurses may be subject to criminal penalties. furthermore, an employer who calls an unlicensed employee a nurse, or knowingly allows an employee to use the title, may also be courting legal sanctions.

it is unlikely that prefacing the term "nurse" with "office" will provide a safe haven from the legal quagmire. the titles of rn, lpn, lvn and nurse are legally protected; "office nurse" has not gained legislative recognition as a title distinguishable from rn, lpn, or lvn.

malpractice exposure can also be increased by a careless use of the title "nurse" or "office nurse". an allied health worker is held to the standard of care exercised by a reasonably competent practitioner of the profession. if it can be proved that a medical assistant held herself or himself out to the public as some sort of nurse, a civil court could hold the medical assistant to the standard of care of a nurse, which is different than that of a medical assistant.

aside from the ethical and professional considerations, it should be apparent that legal factors strongly militate against medical assistants using the term "office nurse." in addition, employers should be told politely not to refer to medical assistants as nurses take heed, for this is one situation in which ignorance of the law is no excuse!

wonder how many mas would willingly call themselves nurse if they knew by doing so they could be sued because the ma did not provide the same standard of care that would be expected of a nurse.

This is VERY interesting. And it comes from the director of the American Association of Medical Assistants.

The MA's at this particular doctors' office didn't bother to call themselves "office" nurses. They just called themselves nurses.

Thank you for that link.

:clown:

wonder how many mas would willingly call themselves nurse if they knew by doing so they could be sued because the ma did not provide the same standard of care that would be expected of a nurse.

as others have said, many of them do not know just how much they do not know. they have no idea what nursing education entails, nor what most ma programs lack. they may not know that the standard of care expected of a nurse is quite a bit different. they think because they are in an "office nurse" position, and because there are doctors out there that will refer to them as nurses, that they must know as much as a nurse would.

the scary part is, there are online and snail mail medical assistant programs out there with virtual online laboratories or no lab work at all. here is the curriculum for one such program:

medical assistant program online classes:

medical terminology

human body planes

basic human anatomy and physiology

medical office professionalism

introduction to medical assisting

general office equipment

medical records

medical law

scheduling of appointments

medical billing and insurance claims

clinical asepsis and infection control

basic surgical instruments

emergency care in the medical office

clinical equipment

patient history and physicals

ekg and lab testing

specimen collection and lab safety

patient medications

medical assistant virtual online labs:

phlebotomy lab (drawing blood)

injection lab (im injections)

medication injection techniques

basic cpr

measuring a pulse

introduction to ultrasound procedures

that's it - you complete the above classes and virtual online labs :eek:

and whapow you are mailed a medical assistant certificate and you are a medical assistant. by the way - this particular school touts that you can repeat the exams as many times as you need to in order to pass - and at no extra charge.

http://www.medassistant.org/ma.html

anyone else a little afraid to go to the doctor's office? :chair:

In my state they're allowed to give shots but, as far as I know, not meds.

:clown:

What's in the 'shot' if not a 'med'????:confused:

Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.

Wild thought here, but if a lot of MA programs are the same as nursing programs, then why not just call it nursing or vice versa?????? Jeez They're called different thing because they ARE different.

(BTW when i was a CNA, i refered to my job as being "in the healthcare field")

Specializes in Emergency Dept, M/S.
In my state they're allowed to give shots but, as far as I know, not meds.

:clown:

I don't know what the stated policy is in my state (NH), but I have had the MA in my doc's office give me immunizations AND meds in the office. Don't know if that is different than what can be done in a hospital setting, but the MA gave me IM Toradol and DHE (under the direction of my NP) and some other med (can't remember what it was now) during one extended visit for an "extended" migraine.

Althought a doc and NP were there (not in the room, but at the office), it's scary to think that maybe this was against the law.

Think I'll check on that.....

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