LPN versus CMA

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I was thinking at first of going for my Medical Assistant degree, since I want to work in a clinic so badly. I heard so much about how LPN's are getting phased out and only CMA's are getting jobs at clinics, and CMA's are higher up than LPN's. This of course coming from recruters from CMA programs. It would seem that the only difference between CMA's and LPN's are the fact that Med Asst's. get training in lab and x-ray. Well, I already am a certified Phlebotomist, and so I have that going. Any of you guys and gals work alongside Med Assts? Anyone work in clinics? :balloons:

Specializes in Med-Surg.
I am a CMA and I can do exactly what you can........

If this were true, the states would license you as an LPN by offering you the exam should you want to take it.

Let's be fair here. I certainly would flunk your boards if I took them. But there's surely things in your program that aren't covered that are covered in nursing such as pharm. complications and interactions, patho., post-op management, geriatrics, on and on.

On the surface an LPN can say MA's really don't do much and have an easy job and visa versa. Niether presumption is fair.

I do know this: MA's are not nurses, can not call themselves nurses and should be proud of their own profession.

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Specializes in ICU, PICC Nurse, Nursing Supervisor.

where did this post come from? this is the kind of post that a cma writes and then re-reads years later after they have become a nurse ..shaking their head mumbling... i wish i had not wrote that. i find it amusing that you can say that you can do the same job as me when you do not have the education and knowledge that a lvn does. sure you can head to the nurses station and bill it...however, your talking about a office situation. what you don't realize that when we get down to it i can replace you in a job setting, but if they are looking for a licensed person then you cannot replace me. i have taken the national certification to be a cma and it is nothing compared to the nclex-vn , so i challenge you to take my test and then we will see where we stand. one thing about cma training is it is without 75% of what nursing has to learn. medical assistant training does not include med-surg courses or the intense numerous hours of clincal... another issue is the pharmacology knowledge that comes with being a nurse vs a cma...this is a situation that cannot be commented on unless you have a nursing license and been through the agony of learning every drug known to man in and out....everyone has their place in health care but by no means can you compare these two professions. they are just not the same....

. i am a cma and i can do exactly what you can, but when you go back to your nurses station, i can go transcribe it, code it, and bill it.
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Specializes in Med/Surg, LTC/Geriatric.
Just wanted to throw my hat in the ring for a sec... CMA's are Certified Medical Assistants. We carry a NATIONAL certification. We can move to any state and be legal to work. LPN is a 1 year program who's focus is on care of the patient - workable ONLY IN THE STATE OF LICENSURE. CMA's have the same studies, however, we continue on for another year to obtain a 2 year degree (Associates of Science - Allied Health) which includes the administration aspect of the business. After our completion of our AA degree, we are qualified to not only care of patients, but we can also work in the front office - which without onsite training, LPN's are not able to do.

The CMA position is a relatively new position when compared to LPN's. Healthcare providers have figured out that there is no reason to hire two people, to do the job that one CMA can do. In some of the previous posts, people say that they know a CMA that doesn't appear to know even simple things which we deal with in an office everyday. Well, to be completely honest, I believe you have to take a step back and look at the individual in which you are talking about. I know PA's and nurses, that can barely walk and chew gum. So, to post a statement implying CMA's are ignorant of medical conditions and/or procedures, would be completely asinine. The American Association of Medical Assistants (http://www.aama-ntl.org/) website may help offer you a much more complete view of who and what we are.

Another fact which I think should be taken into account, is anyone can be hired into a Medical Assistant position. While I think this is a totally ignorant practice, I didn't make the rules on that. HOWEVER, when a Medical Assistant gets serious about what he/she is doing, and decides to get Certified, that's a different ballgame completely. Being certified means that you have completed a national exam. Very much like what RN's have to complete (although, I'm not comparing CMA's to Nurses). The certification is not handed out lightly, and I would challenge any LPN who thinks CMA's are beneath them, to sit for the exam. You'll find out very quickly there's alot of the test you've never heard of or seen. The

Where I live in the east US, LPN's are being phased out or forced to go back to school for more training. Now, based on the fact that they have to go "back to school" to get a degree, coupled with the fact that I am both qualified and certified to do anything that an LPN can do... please tell me what possible reasoning can you have to try to justify that LPN's are above CMA's on the rungs of the medical ladder.

Please understand... I don't dislike LPN's - most of you are wonderful people and are very good at what you do, but.. just because we have a different title and a degree, please don't try to put us down when you don't understand exactly who we are, and what we can do. I am a CMA and I can do exactly what you can, but when you go back to your nurses station, I can go transcribe it, code it, and bill it.

My bolds (since I don't know how to multi-quote :chuckle )

CMA's do not have the same studies. LPN's have in-depth A + P, med-surg, pathophysiology, pharmacology, assessments, etc.

I don't think any CMA is beneath me at all. Just different jobs and duties.

You are not qualified to do anything an LPN can do. You are not able to assess a patient and then perform a nursing intervention based on the assessment. Urinary catheterization? Administer sliding scale insulin based on blood sugar? D/C IV's? Change a running IV into a saline lok? Assess for pain and then decide on an appropriate dose of prn narcotics? Work on a med/surg ward/ER ect in a hospital? And many, many more tasks.

And once again, you cannot do exactly what an LPN can do. THere are many, many things that CMAs do and do well. THere are some things that CMAs know how to do that LPNs don't. But the two jobs ARE NOT interchangeable.

It sounds like you are proud of your education and title and that is great, but don't equate yourself to a nurse because you don't have the same education, qualifications and licensure.

I live in an area that LPN's are fully utilized and not being phased out in the least. So don't assume that all LPN's have to go back to school to get more education. I will never be without a job as an LPN.

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Specializes in medical assistant.
just wanted to throw my hat in the ring for a sec... cma's are certified medical assistants. we carry a national certification. we can move to any state and be legal to work. lpn is a 1 year program who's focus is on care of the patient - workable only in the state of licensure. cma's have the same studies, however, we continue on for another year to obtain a 2 year degree (associates of science - allied health) which includes the administration aspect of the business. after our completion of our aa degree, we are qualified to not only care of patients, but we can also work in the front office - which without onsite training, lpn's are not able to do.

the cma position is a relatively new position when compared to lpn's. healthcare providers have figured out that there is no reason to hire two people, to do the job that one cma can do. in some of the previous posts, people say that they know a cma that doesn't appear to know even simple things which we deal with in an office everyday. well, to be completely honest, i believe you have to take a step back and look at the individual in which you are talking about. i know pa's and nurses, that can barely walk and chew gum. so, to post a statement implying cma's are ignorant of medical conditions and/or procedures, would be completely asinine. the american association of medical assistants (http://www.aama-ntl.org/) website may help offer you a much more complete view of who and what we are.

another fact which i think should be taken into account, is anyone can be hired into a medical assistant position. while i think this is a totally ignorant practice, i didn't make the rules on that. however, when a medical assistant gets serious about what he/she is doing, and decides to get certified, that's a different ballgame completely. being certified means that you have completed a national exam. very much like what rn's have to complete (although, i'm not comparing cma's to nurses). the certification is not handed out lightly, and i would challenge any lpn who thinks cma's are beneath them, to sit for the exam. you'll find out very quickly there's alot of the test you've never heard of or seen. the

where i live in the east us, lpn's are being phased out or forced to go back to school for more training. now, based on the fact that they have to go "back to school" to get a degree, coupled with the fact that i am both qualified and certified to do anything that an lpn can do... please tell me what possible reasoning can you have to try to justify that lpn's are above cma's on the rungs of the medical ladder.

please understand... i don't dislike lpn's - most of you are wonderful people and are very good at what you do, but.. just because we have a different title and a degree, please don't try to put us down when you don't understand exactly who we are, and what we can do. i am a cma and i can do exactly what you can, but when you go back to your nurses station, i can go transcribe it, code it, and bill it.

saltwaterfishing,

i guess someone really got your goat huh?:confused: how long have you worked as a medical assistant?:confused: quite frankly, i don't think it's been very long, or you wouldn't say that ma's (cma, rma, or plain ma) are more qualified than lpn's. as a medical assistant, try calling in a med for a pt and the pharmacist has a dosing question or a drug interaction question (by the way, this is a normal occurrence in practices where the population is older); if the dr isn't in the office right then to answer the question (this too can happen when the dr sees nh pts & hv pts in addition to office pts) , you'll have to try & page him/her & hope they feel like returning your call. meanwhile, your patient suffers thru an uneccessary delay, because you (national certification, a.s. degree, or not) don't have the authority/license to answer the needed questions. also, try reading the previous posts that date all the way back to 2005, you'll see that you're beating a dead horse. while many of us empathize with your position, there's no accounting for the fact that nowhere in your title is the word "nurse":nurse:, but the word "assistant" (i. e. "assist") is quite prominent. oh yeah, i feel as though i can speak on this because i've worked as a rma for 20 yrs & had my hands tied more times than i can remember because i don't have a professional license- well thank god that's about to change, 'cause i'll be starting a lpn program january 2009 (then i'll be legally able to answer questions when asked-and won't have to be worried about my actions jeopardizing any one's license but my own. but i think i'll watch out for ma's who think their certification means they know more than my license though. lol :D

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Specializes in Community Health, Med-Surg, Home Health.
Just wanted to throw my hat in the ring for a sec... CMA's are Certified Medical Assistants. We carry a NATIONAL certification. We can move to any state and be legal to work. LPN is a 1 year program who's focus is on care of the patient - workable ONLY IN THE STATE OF LICENSURE. CMA's have the same studies, however, we continue on for another year to obtain a 2 year degree (Associates of Science - Allied Health) which includes the administration aspect of the business. After our completion of our AA degree, we are qualified to not only care of patients, but we can also work in the front office - which without onsite training, LPN's are not able to do.

The CMA position is a relatively new position when compared to LPN's. Healthcare providers have figured out that there is no reason to hire two people, to do the job that one CMA can do. In some of the previous posts, people say that they know a CMA that doesn't appear to know even simple things which we deal with in an office everyday. Well, to be completely honest, I believe you have to take a step back and look at the individual in which you are talking about. I know PA's and nurses, that can barely walk and chew gum. So, to post a statement implying CMA's are ignorant of medical conditions and/or procedures, would be completely asinine. The American Association of Medical Assistants (http://www.aama-ntl.org/) website may help offer you a much more complete view of who and what we are.

Another fact which I think should be taken into account, is anyone can be hired into a Medical Assistant position. While I think this is a totally ignorant practice, I didn't make the rules on that. HOWEVER, when a Medical Assistant gets serious about what he/she is doing, and decides to get Certified, that's a different ballgame completely. Being certified means that you have completed a national exam. Very much like what RN's have to complete (although, I'm not comparing CMA's to Nurses). The certification is not handed out lightly, and I would challenge any LPN who thinks CMA's are beneath them, to sit for the exam. You'll find out very quickly there's alot of the test you've never heard of or seen. The

Where I live in the east US, LPN's are being phased out or forced to go back to school for more training. Now, based on the fact that they have to go "back to school" to get a degree, coupled with the fact that I am both qualified and certified to do anything that an LPN can do... please tell me what possible reasoning can you have to try to justify that LPN's are above CMA's on the rungs of the medical ladder.

Please understand... I don't dislike LPN's - most of you are wonderful people and are very good at what you do, but.. just because we have a different title and a degree, please don't try to put us down when you don't understand exactly who we are, and what we can do. I am a CMA and I can do exactly what you can, but when you go back to your nurses station, I can go transcribe it, code it, and bill it.

I have had training as a medical assistant, and believe me, it is FAR different from the LPN program I completed. I can certainly say that a medical assistant that is sharp and dedicated is worth their salt, but they weren't trained in all domains of nursing, and if hired at a hospital or elsewhere, they would be nursing assistants (even though they learned much more than CNAs). MAs are not certified to do all that LPNs do; it's like comparing apples to oranges. And, we can obtain licenses to work anywhere in the United States. It is usually not worth the time unless you are traveling often, and maintaining the fees in 50 states is not economically sound for a person that only migrates to two or three. In addition, many medical assistants can obtain jobs without certification, so, it is not regulated.

I am not disrespecting MAs, either. It is an honorable position. It is the same as LPNs saying that they do the 'same thing' that RNs do...not necessarily true.

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Specializes in Geriatrics.

I know one thing a LPN can do that a CMA can not do!! A LPN can call her or himself NURSE!!! A CMA cannot.

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Specializes in Mother-Baby, Rehab, Hospice, Memory Care.
Just wanted to throw my hat in the ring for a sec... CMA's are Certified Medical Assistants. We carry a NATIONAL certification. We can move to any state and be legal to work. LPN is a 1 year program who's focus is on care of the patient - workable ONLY IN THE STATE OF LICENSURE. CMA's have the same studies, however, we continue on for another year to obtain a 2 year degree (Associates of Science - Allied Health) which includes the administration aspect of the business. After our completion of our AA degree, we are qualified to not only care of patients, but we can also work in the front office - which without onsite training, LPN's are not able to do.

The CMA position is a relatively new position when compared to LPN's. Healthcare providers have figured out that there is no reason to hire two people, to do the job that one CMA can do. In some of the previous posts, people say that they know a CMA that doesn't appear to know even simple things which we deal with in an office everyday. Well, to be completely honest, I believe you have to take a step back and look at the individual in which you are talking about. I know PA's and nurses, that can barely walk and chew gum. So, to post a statement implying CMA's are ignorant of medical conditions and/or procedures, would be completely asinine. The American Association of Medical Assistants (http://www.aama-ntl.org/) website may help offer you a much more complete view of who and what we are.

Another fact which I think should be taken into account, is anyone can be hired into a Medical Assistant position. While I think this is a totally ignorant practice, I didn't make the rules on that. HOWEVER, when a Medical Assistant gets serious about what he/she is doing, and decides to get Certified, that's a different ballgame completely. Being certified means that you have completed a national exam. Very much like what RN's have to complete (although, I'm not comparing CMA's to Nurses). The certification is not handed out lightly, and I would challenge any LPN who thinks CMA's are beneath them, to sit for the exam. You'll find out very quickly there's alot of the test you've never heard of or seen. The

Where I live in the east US, LPN's are being phased out or forced to go back to school for more training. Now, based on the fact that they have to go "back to school" to get a degree, coupled with the fact that I am both qualified and certified to do anything that an LPN can do... please tell me what possible reasoning can you have to try to justify that LPN's are above CMA's on the rungs of the medical ladder.

Please understand... I don't dislike LPN's - most of you are wonderful people and are very good at what you do, but.. just because we have a different title and a degree, please don't try to put us down when you don't understand exactly who we are, and what we can do. I am a CMA and I can do exactly what you can, but when you go back to your nurses station, I can go transcribe it, code it, and bill it.

Saltwaterfishing:

Do you even work in the real world? In the real world, CMAs certainly do NOT have the same education as LPN/LVNs nor are they "qualified to do anything an LPN can do". The line between LPN/LVN and CMA may become blurred within an outpatient setting, but trust me CMAs are NOT interchangeable with LPNs in any other setting. I'm not trying to demean you or your profession, but your post comes off to be extremely ignorant, as you can tell by the mass of responses that it generated. Just to inform you, licensed NURSES (as in LPN, LVN, or RN) all pass a national licensing exam called the NCLEX RN or PN to becomed licensed by the state in which they practice. Both RNs and LPN/LVNs may seek licensure in which ever state they choose by endorsement. Answer this: if a CMA such as yourself, was supposedly qualified and had they same education as an LPN, why is the state not allowing you to sit for the NCLEX???

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Specializes in Hospice / Ambulatory Clinic.

I kind of wonder than in the insulated work environment that medical assistants work in (the Dr's office) leads to honestly believe that they do the same and more than what a LVN does.

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Hello.

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where did this post come from? this is the kind of post that a cma writes and then re-reads years later after they have become a nurse ..shaking their head mumbling... i wish i had not wrote that. i find it amusing that you can say that you can do the same job as me when you do not have the education and knowledge that a lvn does. sure you can head to the nurses station and bill it...however, your talking about a office situation. what you don't realize that when we get down to it i can replace you in a job setting, but if they are looking for a licensed person then you cannot replace me. i have taken the national certification to be a cma and it is nothing compared to the nclex-vn , so i challenge you to take my test and then we will see where we stand. one thing about cma training is it is without 75% of what nursing has to learn. medical assistant training does not include med-surg courses or the intense numerous hours of clincal... another issue is the pharmacology knowledge that comes with being a nurse vs a cma...this is a situation that cannot be commented on unless you have a nursing license and been through the agony of learning every drug known to man in and out....everyone has their place in health care but by no means can you compare these two professions. they are just not the same....

my goodness...my goodness.. :banghead: y'all have soooo much more patience than i. the difference between a cma and an lpn? the "n" - nurse. simple. and if it's that easy, try going to school and becoming a lpn. and the difference in skills? higher skills = higher pay. period.

mc3:nurse: and proud of it!

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I'm very proud to state that I'm an MA! There is absolutly nothing wrong with being one. I do plan to further my education to acquire a degree as a PA. Not to say you can't keep the title of an MA and do more with it. All the while I am an MA currently I am proud and happy with my scope of practice. I strongly suggest to those who aren't current on the abilities, skills, & knowledge of an MA's please stop trying to degrade the title.

I reside in the state of Tn. and the pay and scope here is comfortable. I have nothing against LPN's or CNA's, we are all brothers and sisters in this crusade in excellent healthcare practices but I can't continue to read the put downs and let downs by other healthcare professionals. It depends on your STATE WHAT YOUR SCOPE OF PRACTICE INTALES!!

If your state limits an MA's scope then the program can only offer such. MA's receive admin courses, gen ed, (or pre-req's) & clinical ie infection control, pharmacology/admin of med, assist techniques/physical exam, assist minor surgery, basic lab procedure/routine blood & urine testing and CPR CERT. My God does this not count for anything

For the record LPN's are professionals trained in basic nursing techniques and direct pt. care. They also practiceunder the direct supervision of an RN or physician and are employed in similar settings as an RN. Once again your state may call for more or less. As for MA's we function under the supervision of licensed medical professionals and is competent in both admin/office and clinical/lab procedures.

Lets not forget that certifications and liscensure increase your pay scale. We are in this together noone is better than the other (even tho the pay is better ;~&gtwink.gif we just all have our parts to play.

Try an google The AAMA, AMT, CAAHEP,

P.s there are CMA's (certified medical assitant) and RMA (registerd medical assistants we weren't formally recognized untill 1978 but th orginization was founded in 1956.

Does anyone understand my frustration?

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To add to my above post MA's also practice in hospitals, clinics and any other facility that an RN, LPN/LVN, or CNA's do.

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