Let me be clear there is NO nursing shortage!!!!!!!!! and now THIS????

Nurses General Nursing

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Let me be clear: THERE IS NO NURSING SHORTAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am so ****** OFF right now. There are literally thousands of new grads, like myself, who are struggling ALL OVER THE U.S. who can't find jobs for the life of them. This is absurd!!

I have applied to over 30 jobs and cannot get a single call back. I have spent numerous nights sobbing in my bed because I can't afford my loans starting in December and might have to consider filing bankruptcy. :crying2::bluecry1::crying2::bluecry1:

And now, to hear that a Florida congressman wants to "import" foreign nursing to "combat the current nursing shortage" is more than I can take (http://www.washingtonwatch.com/bills/show/111_HR_2536.html). Are you serious? Pleas tell me you're JOKING!!!

Why did I foolishly even consider becoming a nurse in the first place (besides it being my childhood dream)? What a waste of time. :banghead:

I just can't take this anymore.................

Don't get me wrong, I totally agree people need to understand the risks. Some states like North Carolina's BON state you get hired but you must still work to the scope you are trained/licensed at. Other states BON, like Washington, state you can get hired and work at the lower scope of practice UNLESS you yourself step above that scope, then you must continue at that level. It could be very tricky in any case, but if you had to put food on the table, it might be an option.

I would be more comfortable doing this in a state where I know the BON supports it in case it does go to court. And I would be more likely to do it as a RN working as a LPN. As a matter of fact I will keep my LPN once I get my RN - just in case.

I would not be comfortable depending on the BON to defend me in court in any state -- the BON exists and promulgates policies to protect the public, not nurses ... How are you going to argue in court that you knew how/what to do to save somebody from a bad outcome but you didn't do it? Sounds like a losing argument to me -- hope you carry plenty of insurance! :)

I would be interested in seeing where the Washington state BON states that what you describe about practicing below your level of licensure. That's not something I've ever heard before (in 25 years of nursing). Can you provide a source?

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I would not be comfortable depending on the BON to defend me in court in any state -- the BON exists and promulgates policies to protect the public, not nurses ... How are you going to argue in court that you knew how/what to do to save somebody from a bad outcome but you didn't do it? Sounds like a losing argument to me -- hope you carry plenty of insurance! :)

I would be interested in seeing where the Washington state BON states that what you describe about practicing below your level of licensure. That's not something I've ever heard before (in 25 years of nursing). Can you provide a source?

Give me a sec..I'll find it. I posted it before on another thread.

As far as not doing something. I think that would probably not be likely if working in long term care - where I work now. Even in the hospital I'm really trying to think of a situation where you couldn't act in a way to save someone as a LPN vs a RN. And really I think most people would "act" . Now it would be a different story working as a CNA and having a RN license. I think that would open up a whole can of worms with regards to "not acting".

Side note..in my facility, many times nurses have to do patient care assignments 1-2/week when we are short CNAs. It galls me to no end to hear from a nurse "Oh I'm a CNA, not an LPN today, so I don't have to do anything except patient care". Yeah, ok, let's see how that holds up in a court of law. ;)

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Congressman did what?? What about the new grad? Can we get an e-mail or an address so Jobless new grad can flood with applications:(

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Ok.. here it is. Although it isn't Washington, its Wisconsin. So much for my memory skills. ;) I think this policy is good. Because it does allow you to take action or require you to take action if not doing so would cause harm and if your employer does not prohibit it.

http://drl.wi.gov/boards/nur/pap/pap07.pdf

Nurses who practice at a level below that of their licensure are expected to function according to the position description for which they are employed. For example, a licensed practical nurse (LPN) who is employed as a home health care aide or certified nursing assistant (CNA) should not exceed the scope of the duties of that position, although the nurse may have education and/or training beyond that required for the position. Similarly, a registered nurse (RN) who accepts a position as an LPN or an emergency medical technician (EMT) should limit their practice to the job description and not act beyond the scope of those duties. However, in the event that the nurse voluntarily acts beyond the scope of the position description, the nurse may be held to the highest standard of care for which they are licensed.

A nurse who practices at a level below that of their licensure may also be held accountable to a higher standard of care if they knew or should have known, based on their education, training or licensure, that the failure to act would cause harm to a patient, unless the employer has clearly prohibited the nurse from taking any action.

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I am thinking that if a Tech becomes an RN and wants to get a BSN but remains a Tech, this may not be a good idea. I know a Nurse that worked as a Tech untill she finished her BSN but had a RN license. She wasn't a nurse Tech. She waited till she finished her BSN and then applied to become a nurse. She had her RN license through the associates degree. Someone please explain how this could happen. Maybe I am confusing myself on this.

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I am thinking that if a Tech becomes an RN and wants to get a BSN but remains a Tech, this may not be a good idea. I know a Nurse that worked as a Tech untill she finished her BSN but had a RN license. She wasn't a nurse Tech. She waited till she finished her BSN and then applied to become a nurse. She had her RN license through the associates degree. Someone please explain how this could happen. Maybe I am confusing myself on this.

It can happen. At our facility you have to re-apply when you finish school (i.e. LPN, RN), you don't just move up. This could take 2 weeks to 2 months depending on how fast the paperwork moves. Since its the county, it doesn't move too fast. Meanwhile you continue to work at the level you were hired at. Sometimes you just don't get hired. We had a CNA that was an LPN and couldn't get hired as a LPN because of her attendance while she was a CNA. She was fighting it and hesitant to leave because of the benefits. It is highly possible that at the time they might not have a position available and someone might want to wait and see if that changes. Some people prefer not to have to worry about orientation and learning a new job if they are continuing on with their education. And now with the economy the case of not being able to find a job as a nurse is becoming too real for many.

Those are just some of the the reasons that come to mind at this time.

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It can happen. At our facility you have to re-apply when you finish school (i.e. LPN, RN), you don't just move up. This could take 2 weeks to 2 months depending on how fast the paperwork moves. Since its the county, it doesn't move too fast. Meanwhile you continue to work at the level you were hired at. Sometimes you just don't get hired. We had a CNA that was an LPN and couldn't get hired as a LPN because of her attendance while she was a CNA. She was fighting it and hesitant to leave because of the benefits. It is highly possible that at the time they might not have a position available and someone might want to wait and see if that changes. Some people prefer not to have to worry about orientation and learning a new job if they are continuing on with their education. And now with the economy the case of not being able to find a job as a nurse is becoming too real for many.

Those are just some of the the reasons that come to mind at this time.

Makes sense, thanks!

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Ok.. here it is. Although it isn't Washington, its Wisconsin. So much for my memory skills. ;) I think this policy is good. Because it does allow you to take action or require you to take action if not doing so would cause harm and if your employer does not prohibit it.

http://drl.wi.gov/boards/nur/pap/pap07.pdf

Thank you for the source (that does explain why I couldn't find anything about it on the Washington BON website, haha). I still would not be comfortable counting on that to protect me in court, though ...

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Thank you for the source (that does explain why I couldn't find anything about it on the Washington BON website, haha). I still would not be comfortable counting on that to protect me in court, though ...

As I said before I'm keeping my LPN license - just in case. I've seen how cyclical the nursing field is. I guess I would have to look at the circumstances and determine if it is worth the risk. Feeding my family comes first and I do have . I tried to find something for NYS, but can't. I'm going to email them and see if they have any info on it.

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A nurse who practices at a level below that of their licensure may also be held accountable to a higher standard of care if they knew or should have known, based on their education, training or licensure, that the failure to act would cause harm to a patient, unless the employer has clearly prohibited the nurse from taking any action.

To me this is still a bit of a slippery slope, because of that word clearly. If something went wrong you'd better hope your lawyer is better than the facilities in describing if you clearly prohibited to take action. Now I'm basing this primarily on an RN working as a CNA, as you said working as an LPN would be less risky. Considering the state of the job market though, I'm sure some new grads are considering working as CNAs and definitely need to understand the risks. I am still in school and had this discussion with some classmates and told them I will not put my license on the line by taking a CNA position. Not because I feel it is beneath me, because I don't, but because if something goes wrong, then I lose my license and even if the economy improves, I'll never be able to work as a nurse.

In regards to the proposed bill to bring in foreign nurses, this is absurd. I will absolutely be writing my representative about this. Let me add a bit of information to that statement. I'm married to a Filipina woman, and we have family still in the PI who are nurses, and want to come here to be with the rest of the family. I absolutely want nothing more than for them to be able to come here. However, I also 100% support hiring US citizens before foreigners. If the economy improves and there are enough jobs, then by all means, allow and even encourage foreign nurses to come here. Like some others, I believe (legal) immigration is a good thing, when the country can support it, but bringing in people we can't support so corporations can make money is unfair to both sides, the immigrants and US citizens.

Again, I support immigration, when the country can support it. To those who have said "this country was founded on immigration". Yes it was, it was also founded on taking things that didn't belong to us, murder, discrimination, and slavery. Should we continue to practice all of those "founding" ideals and/or practices simply because they are part of our history? Give us your tired, your poor, your hungry, your huddled masses yearning to be free is a great idea, if we can support them. If not, we're convincing them to leave their homes and family to come here for a better life we can't offer. That's not honorable, it's deceitful.

To the OP, I know someone mentioned the Air Force, and that brought up an idea, I have heard that in some areas the military is hiring nurses to work in their hospitals as civilians. I haven't looked into this myself so I don't know how widespread or common this is, but it could be worth looking into. This is especially true if the positions are not only as a civilian nurse, but are considered GS positions, which often come with some nice benefits. Even if they aren't GS positions though, it's still a nursing position.

No matter where or how it is, I really wish you the best in finding a job!!

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Specializes in Cardiology/Internal Medicine..

Now you have ME worried as well. I've recently posted on here my concerns about getting back to school (from MA/CNA/PCT) to LPN in a few weeks 'because of the shortage'. The papers are full of jobs for same; am I being polyanna? I'll have to quit my transcribing job to go full time. I HOPED to walk into something at graduating! More worries!!! Nvr2late

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Specializes in Family Nurse Practitioner.
Now you have ME worried as well. I've recently posted on here my concerns about getting back to school (from MA/CNA/PCT) to LPN in a few weeks 'because of the shortage'. The papers are full of jobs for same; am I being polyanna? I'll have to quit my transcribing job to go full time. I HOPED to walk into something at graduating! More worries!!! Nvr2late

I'm never a big fan of quitting a paying job to "focus on school full-time". Is there any way you can work around it?

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