kicked out of school- failed professionalism!

LPN1974, LPN · Apr 17, 2006

This is just MHO, but I think that the OP wanted the patients to think that he was an instructor and got caught up in his "role". Some people don't like to be in a subservient role and will go to great lengths to make themselves look better than they are. This type of man will never make it in the nursing world because their egos are just too big for a menial nursing role.

Then an LPN job won't fill the bill.

If a person is having problems submitting to others, in a student position, LPN won't cut it either.

I've been an LPN for over 30 years, and right now I have an RN supervisor half my age.

She instructs me and the other LPNs on things she wants done....no biggie in my book, it's just doing the job, getting the work done.

LaNorteBellaRN · Apr 17, 2006

Now I know why there are so many nurses in the profession who have unsafe practices --- because there are so many colleagues/students/'newbies" who feel they have NO RIGHT to question. So they continue on with their incorrect or unsafe practices and then TEACH others the same....so you have this generation of nurses who were always taught the incorrect way because no one ever questions. I may sound a bit extreme here, but it makes sense doesn't it?

I agree, there is indeed a way to ask someone a question without sounding disrespectful or demeaning, but as nurses, nursing students, intern, doctors or whoever, we have an obligation to the PATIENT to ensure that things are being done correctly and most importantly, safely! How are students supposed to learn if asking questions inconveniences or 'angers' their preceptors? If I were a student nurse or someone considering entering the nursing profession I would be appalled at some of the responses in this thread. (I apologize if I am repeating something someone else has said, quite frankly I stopped reading the responses after 3 pages, it was too disheartening).

Whether someone has been a nurse for 34 years or 34 days, mistakes can be made. No one ever knows everything, and we as nurses should always be learning. I think it's a step backward for the profession to hold such attitudes about questioning a colleague or a verteran nurse etc....

I've been a registered nurse for 11 years. I've practiced in the United States and Canada. It's been my personal experience that when someone becomes angry or overly defensive after being asked a question (physician, nurse, manager, administrator etc) it's probably because they realize they were wrong OR didn't know the answer.

It's much easier to say "I've been a nurse XX amount of years and I won't have some student questioning my practice...." than to just say "You know I'm not sure, but I'll find out."

What's the big deal? Even if it is some arrogant wanna be hot shot student who thinks they know it all and is trying to show up the nurse....... just answer the question, and move one........... like any professional should.

It's not hard to see where the saying comes from........"nurses eat their young".

We shouldn't.

t2000JC · Apr 17, 2006

I would consider writing a letter to the school you were in acknowledging what you did wrong (remember, you are trying to get on their good side!) with a game plan to how you will make an effort to improve (in the areas they have pointed out) in the future. This may help. T.

gr8rnpjt, RN · Apr 17, 2006

Now I know why there are so many nurses in the profession who have unsafe practices --- because there are so many colleagues/students/'newbies" who feel they have NO RIGHT to (I apologize if I am repeating something someone else has said, quite frankly I stopped reading the responses after 3 pages, it was too disheartening).
You probably should have read more of the posts. I think everyone is in agreement there is a time and a place to question... and a student should not be "stopping" a nurse mid procedure in front of the patient in order to have his questions answered.
The OP has a lot more problems than just asking questions, he had an attitude that got him kicked out of 2 schools of nursing, a big red flag in my book, and not a person I would want "questioning" me in front of my pateints.

UM Review RN, ASN, RN · Apr 17, 2006

Now I know why there are so many nurses in the profession who have unsafe practices --- because there are so many colleagues/students/'newbies" who feel they have NO RIGHT to question. So they continue on with their incorrect or unsafe practices and then TEACH others the same....so you have this generation of nurses who were always taught the incorrect way because no one ever questions. I may sound a bit extreme here, but it makes sense doesn't it?
I agree, there is indeed a way to ask someone a question without sounding disrespectful or demeaning, but as nurses, nursing students, intern, doctors or whoever, we have an obligation to the PATIENT to ensure that things are being done correctly and most importantly, safely! How are students supposed to learn if asking questions inconveniences or 'angers' their preceptors? If I were a student nurse or someone considering entering the nursing profession I would be appalled at some of the responses in this thread. (I apologize if I am repeating something someone else has said, quite frankly I stopped reading the responses after 3 pages, it was too disheartening).
Whether someone has been a nurse for 34 years or 34 days, mistakes can be made. No one ever knows everything, and we as nurses should always be learning. I think it's a step backward for the profession to hold such attitudes about questioning a colleague or a verteran nurse etc....
I've been a registered nurse for 11 years. I've practiced in the United States and Canada. It's been my personal experience that when someone becomes angry or overly defensive after being asked a question (physician, nurse, manager, administrator etc) it's probably because they realize they were wrong OR didn't know the answer.
It's much easier to say "I've been a nurse XX amount of years and I won't have some student questioning my practice...." than to just say "You know I'm not sure, but I'll find out."
What's the big deal? Even if it is some arrogant wanna be hot shot student who thinks they know it all and is trying to show up the nurse....... just answer the question, and move one........... like any professional should.
It's not hard to see where the saying comes from........"nurses eat their young".
We shouldn't.

What's the big deal?

I'll be happy to explain. If a patient is having a procedure and someone questions the person performing the procedure, suddenly the patient begins to question the person, and by extension, the procedure, and by extension, loses faith in caregivers assigned to him.

This happened to me a couple of times with a very rude--and WRONG!--colleague. My patients were happy with their care and I did nothing at all wrong with my care of them, yet because Nurse Sally came in and questioned me, the patients were led to believe that I somehow did something to them that was incorrect, and therefore, they lost trust with me.

Students, if you have questions, please ask them outside the patient's room.

I'm happy to answer them then--if I have time. If I don't have time, (the clue is that my face is red and I'm running from one patient to the next )you need to learn how to find the answers by looking them up or asking your instructor.

The fact is, there are many reasons I'm doing what I'm doing the way I'm doing it, and I simply don't have time to explain every single "why" and "wherefore." Our unit makes allowances for the graduate nurse who is being precepted by me, but not for students, because somehow, in the grand scheme of things, students were thought to be "extra help."

In reading this thread, however, I can see how "nurse-eating" can actually begin with the critiquing of our work by students, disguised in the form of "asking questions" by students who believe that they already have all the answers.

If so, then why ask.

squeakykitty · Aug 8, 2007

I also saw nurses (and doctors) do a lot of things I didn't necessarily agree with while I was a student. One incident which I will never forget was witnessing an intern trying to insert a foley catheter into an elderly woman's
bladder. He dropped it into feces-soiled linen, then picked it up and put it in as if nothing had happened. Although I was horrified, I knew better
than to say anything, fearing that I would get kicked out of school....

I would have grabbed it and politely offered to get a new one. People can die from a UTI from septicemia. And talked to my instructor.

treysdaddy08 · Sep 3, 2007

Do you mind if I make a suggestion?

This can be the most powerful phrase you ever say to someone of authority. If you are a NS and jus say "Stop, don't do it that way." even if you mean well, tthe RN is going to immediately go onto the defensive. If you notice them doing something and you say "do you mind if I make a suggestion" or, "This is how we were taught, what do you thin about that?" You're giving them the opportunity to admit they were wrong without LOOKING like they were wrong. If they decide not to accept your critisism, at least you did it in a way that will most likely not come across as abrasive and rude.

deeDawntee, RN · Sep 3, 2007

Where IS your responsibility in the matter? If you can't find that out, you should not go into nursing...because you will alienate yourself out of every job you have as well...

No one can tell you what is missing if you aren't ready or able to hear it. Have you thought of talking to a therapist about your difficulties? A support group can be a great way to find out how you come across to others and receive encouragement to make changes. Perhaps you truly have blind spots (we all do) and there is no way you can change something that you don't recognize. I mean this sincerely without berating you, it may be the most valuable thing you ever do for yourself...to find out how people feel about themselves being around you.