IS THIS TRUE???

macawake, MSN · Jun 5, 2015

I don't see why anyone would have a problem with any of that. If the thought of seeing your classmates in tanks and shorts, or basic touching is frightening, you have some issues to work out before becoming a nurse.

It's not that I find basic touching frightening, it's just that I never had the desire or see a rationale to touch my classmates or be touched by them. Why on earth would I want to have a classmate perform a bed bath on me when I've already taken a shower that day? No need. And as someone said earlier in this thread, it's not rocket science.

Personally, I basically have two reasons to touch or be touched apart from the everyday handshake as a greeting or hug between family or friends.

1) Touching a lover/intimate partner due to mutual attraction.

2) As a medical professional touching a patient for the reason of a medically necessary assessment/procedure or the opposite; as a patient being touched by a medical professional for a medically necessary and by the patient approved assessment/procedure.

I guess that I feel that autonomy and integrity applies to all individuals, including both patients and students. Performing medical assessments requires physical closeness and the person who performs the assessment will gain knowledge about the other person. Who a person shares that knowledge with should be up to them. You can choose your healthcare provider but you can't really choose your classmates and teachers in the same sense.

I also feel that you learn a lot more in a clinical setting with actual patients than you do by prodding and probing your classmates, but that's just my personal opinion.

Anyway, this has never been an issue for me since my schools have never required that we practice on each other.

By the way OP, have you disappeared? You've gotten close to fifty replies to your "QUESTION?????" :) What do you think about all this?

xoemmylouox, ASN, RN · Jun 5, 2015

Though once you have squeezed your co-worker's nipples it does put a new spin on team building.

I just spit my water out.. :roflmao:

Libby1987 · Jun 5, 2015

I don't recall bed baths but we didn't practice any assessments or procedures on each other. We also didn't have a skills lab. This was the 80's and we had ample opportunity in our clinicals which was reinforced in our extern jobs.

I do recall being shocked when I was hanging out with an Intern friend and one of his old classmates, she was the lone female in her group and her male co med students practiced pelvics on her. I vividly recall her saying that she knew where her ovaries were at the end of that session. I was already a 2nd year RN by then and was still bug eyed about it.

NICUmiiki, DNP, NP · Jun 5, 2015

We practiced on mannequins. Sometimes a group would take it upon themselves to hop in a bed to practice turning or something on a real person, but it was never encouraged/required by the school.

...And we were require to wear our complete uniform at all times in the lab, so... no one was taking off their clothes.

nurse2211 · Jun 5, 2015

I don't recall bed baths but we didn't practice any assessments or procedures on each other. We also didn't have a skills lab. This was the 80's and we had ample opportunity in our clinicals which was reinforced in our extern jobs.
I do recall being shocked when I was hanging out with an Intern friend and one of his old classmates, she was the lone female in her group and her male co med students practiced pelvics on her. I vividly recall her saying that she knew where her ovaries were at the end of that session. I was already a 2nd year RN by then and was still bug eyed about it.

WHOA! HOLD IT! TIME OUT, REF! Seriously? I thought med students practiced pelvic exams, pap smears, rectal exams, etc., on paid "professional patients."

Classmate for a pelvic exam? I'm not questioning the veracity of your comment. No doubt that's what she told you. It just seems too incredible.

Now I've heard everything!

Not_A_Hat_Person, RN · Jun 5, 2015

When I was in school (2005-2008), nursing students practiced bed baths and occupied bedmaking in class, with a fellow student in bed. No one disrobed, but we wore gowns over our clothes.

allnurses Guide · Jun 5, 2015

In the other thread about this, many people stated "if you are not willing to experience what it feels like to be a patient, you have no business being a nurse". Some of them said the bed bath practice was great because they were nervous at first but then we were all giggling and cracking up and it was "a bonding experience".

Maybe, but for anyone not agreeing with it, it's an ostracizing experience, which was basically the reason the two ultrasound tech students sued Valencia College in the story linked earlier in this thread.

Some related they were actually tied to a chair and fed or had their teeth brushed by a classmate so they could "feel what it's like to be a patient". I thought much of the rationale verged into unqualified psychology.

One of my friends has a sister with muscular dystrophy. A few years ago I decided to ask what her thoughts were on this method of training nurses "to feel what it's like to be the patient". I was surprised at what she said, and I realize it is anecdotal, but she was outraged by it. She felt it trivialized the reality of a situation like hers and likened it to a parlor game.

I think it's fine to stay clothed and be the patient for purposes of occupied-bed making, or practice on classmates provided it's made clear in the beginning this will occur instead of sprung on someone already involved in the program.

missnurse89 · Jun 5, 2015

Oh my word! I have never heard of that either. We never did that.

EaglesWings21, ASN, RN · Jun 6, 2015

We wore tank tops and shorts during our assessments. I can't even comment on how some student are made to do pelvic exams. That is just so intimate it is completely inappropriate.

missnurse89 · Jun 6, 2015

I agree. There are demonstration tools for this. I do realize that nursing programs are limited on funding, but there are also grants for these things. These intimate type assessments seem to be leaning towards unethical practices.

Elle23 · Jun 6, 2015

True, but I guess our definitions of what's modest or immodest must differ.

Probably!

I wouldn't wear a tank top and shorts to check the mail, so I sure wouldn't be wearing it at school!

When I said the "issues to work out" bit, I wasn't being snarky. I really think that if one's situation is such that they can't bear the thought of a classmate performing basic (non-intimate) hands-on assessments on them, or vice-versa, then one might not be comfortable performing the duties of a nurse.

I function just fine as a nurse (and a patient when need be).

I admit I have very different standards than most people. But it has never affected my ability to perform my job.

I think to assume that everyone should be fine with the situations addressed in the thread is a bit short-sighted. We all come from different backgrounds with different life experiences and different beliefs.

missnurse89 · Jun 6, 2015

Not in my program. We were encouraged to wear shorts and sports bras, but were not required to do so.
At least the students disrobing to their undergarments for lab practice didn't have to go through what the students at Valencia College had to do... practice lady partsl ultrasound exams on each other! Yup, you read that right. Here's a link to the story: Valencia College Won't Make Students Perform lady partsl Probes On Each Other Anymore

Holy crap! I can't even...That's ridiculous!

1. Teaching the students that consent isn't important

2. Violating someone's body, UNECESSARILY I might add

3. Injuries? Damages? Complications? I can not believe that this actually happened and was condoned by nurse educators!! I am truly at a loss for words.