I was totally dissed last night

Nursing Students Online Learning

Published

During my shift at the hospital I work at, I was talking to several nurses who know I'm an Excelsior student. This is a unit I very much want to work in when i graduate. To make a long story short, the charge nurse walks up in the middle of the convo, and asks about the program. She asked, "what about clinicals?". When I explained how the program worked, she replied "Well I hope they don't hire you for this unit, I don't see how that sort of program can produce a competent nurse." Ouch! I know she doesn't do the hiring, and when the person that does do the hiring sees my qualifications, I'll be hired on the spot. I also knew this sort of discrimination exists, but had never experienced it first hand. Very disheartening.

I couldn't care less what the rest of the profession embraces, but don't call me, or anyone else for that matter, something we are not - incompetent. Especially when the claim cannot be qualified.

When did I call you incompetent? I did no such thing. I've been debating education standards and the state BON's issues with EC. I never once called you incompetent or, anything else for that matter.

:confused:

Up Vote Up Vote ×
I've been debating education standards and the state BON's issues with EC

Then you're in the wrong thread. Read the title of the thread. Sheesh, I'm outa here.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

For many people who are LPNs the traditional route is not a possibility. You have no idea how much self dicipline it takes to be successful in ECs program. Each person must find their own way, their own motivation. There are no instructors hanging over your shoulder, you set your own test dates which can easily be changed. Why would an experienced hospital LPN need to spend 4 hours a day communting...will this make those ladies you know better RNs? Will it make you a better RN?

Just because something is more stressful and time consuming due to travel doesn't mean it is a better program...it's just a different program. Some people need some one to impose deadlines and rules, others don't.

For the record I spent many, many hours writting care plans and sending them off to EC staff for review while prearing for the CPNE. I often used patient scenerios from work, minus the name, of course. I also spent many hours reviewing and practicing the labs and 21 assessments--on patients at work and on my own kids--all of these things are required to be done to perfection at the CPNE, it takes MONTHS to prepare for this regardless of of how many years of experience the person has if they want to be successful. At the CPNE you can be failed for something as easy to do as entering a med room with out washing your hands.

I think the part you are missing is that EC isn't just theory classes. It's care plans and labs and a clinical test. All of this is very time consuming to prpare for, but it's done at home--at midnight when the kids are asleep, during nap time or while the kids are playing. And it's done in between and during shifts at work. It takes over your life and every waking thought--just like traditional school--it just doesn't require hours of driving.

Most people do not complete the program in less then a year. It took me a year and I already had all the gen ed completed. A year is actaully longer then a traditional prgram would have been. LPN bridges here start mid June and are completed by mid May.

Of course, this is just my experience..other's ecperiences may vay:wink2:

Missy ... with all due respect ... it is easier. There is an LVN in my class who also has 10 years experience. You don't think it would be easier for her if she could skip all the clinicials and just focus on the theory classes?

Of course it's easier. Here's why: Not only does she have to attend a 12 hour clinical day in the hospital every week, which often includes commuting for another two hours just to get there, but she also has to attend lab an additional six hours each week. Add to that care plans, other clinical assignments, and lab practicals that are due each and every week, and it's a ton of work. Care plans alone can take a day out of your schedule because they're so time consuming.

If she only had to focus on theory classes, it would save her a hellava lot of time, especially since the theory classes are only six hours a week. Granted, you have to study a lot for those theory classes, but it would be luxury to only have to worry about theory alone without all the clinical assignments.

There are five LVN's in my class. Some are fresh out of school, others have worked as LVN's for years. Regardless of their experience, or lack thereof, EC would have been a hellava lot easier for all them than what they're going through now.

:coollook:

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Med-Surg, Trauma, Ortho, Neuro, Cardiac.
How many traditional nursing students do you know of that finished there LPN to RN program in less than a year. There are numerous EC grads that have done just that.

QUOTE]

The LPN to RN programs here are just a year long. After all they already have the first year done in LPN school. So I'm not quite understanding you. edit....just realized you might be talking co-reqs here like the A&P and Micro., etc. that they don't need in LPN school. Some people who work full time indeed take those prior to the LPN to RN program, not all but some do.

I will say I work with an LPN who has been an excellent med-surg nurse for many years. She just finished Excelsior, but flunked the clinical aspect. I was shocked because she's such an excellent clinician. So they just don't graduate anyone through their clinical aspect of it. You have to be perfect and competent.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Trauma,ER,CCU/OHU/Nsg Ed/Nsg Research.
Does that mean you're against me, lgflaminni?

No- I'm sure you'll do just fine. :)

And I'm sure you will prove your charge nurse wrong. Do what you think is best for you, and don't let others' assumptions bother you. You may hear more negative comments, but just let that fuel you to strive for being the best RN student you can be. Having gone through the program myself, I do think it made me a better nurse. I learned a lot, and made it a point to retain what I learned. It wasn't faster for me to go through EC, but it was easier in that I didn't have a lot of the hassles mentioned in previous posts r/t trad programs. It isn't for everyone, but most people figure that out once they get started in the program.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Peds stepdown ICU.
Missy ... with all due respect ... it is easier. There is an LVN in my class who also has 10 years experience. You don't think it would be easier for her if she could skip all the clinicials and just focus on the theory classes?

Of course it's easier. Here's why: Not only does she have to attend a 12 hour clinical day in the hospital every week, which often includes commuting for another two hours just to get there, but she also has to attend lab an additional six hours each week. Add to that care plans, other clinical assignments, and lab practicals that are due each and every week, and it's a ton of work. Care plans alone can take a day out of your schedule because they're so time consuming.

If she only had to focus on theory classes, it would save her a hellava lot of time, especially since the theory classes are only six hours a week. Granted, you have to study a lot for those theory classes, but it would be luxury to only have to worry about theory alone without all the clinical assignments.

There are five LVN's in my class. Some are fresh out of school, others have worked as LVN's for years. Regardless of their experience, or lack thereof, EC would have been a hellava lot easier for all them than what they're going through now.

:coollook:

With all due respect LIZZ, I attended LPN school in North Dakota where it takes 2 years to complete not 12 months like most states, so my clinical time is about the same amount of hours supervised. We were also required to have a seperate English, A&P, Lifespan, and math prior to starting the program. I started the actual nusring part in 1992 and graduated early 1995. I had these pre-reqs I named completed prior to my start in 93. I commuted in the ice and snow over 2 hours as well...in sub-below weather with wind chill for 2 years...on top of working 32 hours a week...with a small daughter who had heart surgery 3 months before the program!!!! It is nothing more than sheer ignorance that you insinuate I had it easier than your LVN buds. Ignorance is really what creates hasty judgements of others in many aspects of life. This was 11 years ago when North Dakota only had LPN's and BSN's....I have recently heard that they now allow ADN's as of a year ago. Before you accuse people of having less clinical time or working not as hard as others please know your facts. ADN's 11 years ago in ND were LPN's.

LIZZ--you can't judge what is harder for one person than another. One person may find non-traditional school harder because of the way the program works. It is like pain--different people experience difficulty and stress on different levels. One may find traditional school a breeze and fail on non-trad...and vice versa. Don't reflect your idea of difficult and stressful on others....especially when you have NO clue about their life or life style!

Missy

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.

(Said i wasn't coming back, but it just chaps me when people assume things.)

Every program is different, with varying clinical time, etc.

People should take this into consideration before just assuming that something was "easier"! My LPN program certainly was NOT easy, its expectations were half the reason why i chose it. How many programs do YOU know that want nothing below a 3.0 average (or you're out) ? Or get below a C on a Dose Calc. class and you're out. Grades were not the hardest thing about that program either. My ADN programs seems very la-tee-da compared to the LPN program i was in. Do i assume that all will be? No! :rolleyes:

I certainly would not assume someone had something easier. Be it the program or the person itself, "hard" is an opinion. So is "easier".

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Peds stepdown ICU.
(Said i wasn't coming back, but it just chaps me when people assume things.)

Every program is different, with varying clinical time, etc.

People should take this into consideration before just assuming that something was "easier"! My LPN program certainly was NOT easy, its expectations were half the reason why i chose it. How many programs do YOU know that want nothing below a 3.0 average (or you're out) ?

Mine was the same way. Pre-req's of sciences, english, algebra had to be 2.5 GPA before entering and the program had to be 3.0...and we lost many a student. Many programs vary...in Florida the LPN programs have a small A&P included...not mine full length PRIOR to even starting.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
I think the part you are missing is that EC isn't just theory classes. It's care plans and labs and a clinical test.

That's the operative word. A clinical test. Yes I am familiar with CPNE. As I previously mentioned, in my traditional program, we have to pass four final clinical exams to graduate. We have final clinical exams at the end of each semester.

But, as the California BON pointed out in their decision on EC, the CPNE does not test for all of the clinical nursing skills that students are supposed to be proficient in when they graduate. This was a big issue with the BON because EC was trying to get the board to approve CPNE as a clinical challenge exam.

But CPNE only covers about half of what we cover. And, quite frankly, with only three days to test, there's no way they could. This is why we have four final clinical exams spread out over four semesters. The board requires a lot of clinical testing in various specialties.

This was one of the major reasons EC is no longer accepted in California. I'm sure the CPNE is a tough exam, I won't argue with that. But it doesn't test for all the skills and specialties required in the cirriculum.

Why would an experienced hospital LPN need to spend 4 hours a day communting...will this make those ladies you know better RNs? Will it make you a better RN?

I actually didn't say it would make those LVN's better RN's, although most of them in my class do seem to think it's worth it. For the experienced LVN's who work Med-Surg, the clinical rotations in that area weren't particularly useful. But they do find the clinical rotations in ICU, psych, telemetry and other specialties very useful because they haven't worked those areas before.

:smokin:

Up Vote Up Vote ×
LIZZ--you can't judge what is harder for one person than another. One person may find non-traditional school harder because of the way the program works. It is like pain--different people experience difficulty and stress on different levels. One may find traditional school a breeze and fail on non-trad...and vice versa. Don't reflect your idea of difficult and stressful on others....especially when you have NO clue about their life or life style!

Missy

I wasn't judging people's lifestyles or their individual circumstances. I was simply comparing the requirements of each program. Traditional programs require lots of clinical time in the hospital, EC doesn't. No matter what experience you had as an LVN, or what you went through to graduate from LVN school, the requirement differences in each program doesn't change.

If you went through a traditional program you'd still have to do the clinicals. If you went through EC you didn't. In my opinion that's easier, and I stand by it.

:cool:

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Peds stepdown ICU.
I wasn't judging people's lifestyles or their individual circumstances. I was simply comparing the requirements of each program. Traditional programs require lots of clinical time in the hospital, EC doesn't. No matter what experience you had as an LVN, or what you went through to graduate from LVN school, the requirement differences in each program doesn't change.

If you went through a traditional program you'd still have to do the clinicals. If you went through EC you didn't. In my opinion that's easier, and I stand by it.

:cool:

That very well may be LIZZ but my supervised clinical time was equal to the ADN's here in Cali....ND LPN's are ADN's ....up until about a year ago I guess when things changed. That is what you are ignorant to...requirement issues are indeed different for states BON and schools. ADN's were LPN's in ND 11 years ago. DId you have some issues with EC? You sure seem to love to argue the issue intently? Were you perhaps a jaded student yourself at some point?

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Were you perhaps a jaded student yourself at some point?

If you're asking if I ever was an EC student, I can assure you that I have never enrolled nor attempted to enroll in EC.

:chuckle

Up Vote Up Vote ×
+ Add a Comment