I can't stop crying... need encouragement...

rn/writer, RN · Nov 23, 2005

You said: Quote:

Originally Posted by rn/writer

Employers can and do look at an individual's computer habits. If they see problematic usage, they can certainly take the person to task. For this reason as well as out of general respect, employees would do well to abide by any limits set by the facility/unit manager and be grateful for whatever opportunities they have to improve their skills and their knowledge.

You said:You now mention limits and general respect. That wasn't part of your earlier posts.

One reason it wasn't part of my earlier posts is because that wasn't the focus of my attention. I came to Lori's overall defense because I felt you had already judged her actions and scolded her harshly without waiting to hear the answers to the questions you had asked. There was no indication that Lori's use of this forum was problematic to her employer or that it crossed any lines drawn by her facility so my response didn't relate to her at all.

I was responding to another post that said it's just flat out wrong to use the Internet during work hours.

In the portions you highlighted I meant that it's not for any of us to make a blanket statement that Internet use is always wrong during work hours. It should be up to the facility and/or the unit to decide what and when extracurricular computer use is acceptable.

We have no information on what the official policy is at Lori's faclilty, so I wasn't making even a veiled reference to her. She may be violating your standards without crossing any of the lines where she works.

When I said that employers can and do look at employee usage, I was saying that we should all keep that in mind. I'd like to add that if you stay within the official boundaries (which will, of necessity, vary from one facility to another), you shouldn't have anything to fear.

I don't know what standards, if any, Lori's workplace has set, so I'm not going to sit in judgement on that part of her communication with us. I still think your demeanor with her left much to be desired (your use of loaded phrases, your statement that the dressing down you'd give her would leave her embarrassed). I'm guessing we'll have to agree to disagree on that.

Despite our differences, I hope you have a wonderful Thanksgiving.

warrior woman · Nov 24, 2005

Somehow, I doubt very much that the boss would approve of what is going on regarding the Internet. There are lots of things to be done during quiet periods. Refrigerators need cleaning, cupboards need cleaning and rearranging, med cart drawers can almost always use a washing and straightening up. Somewhere pages are falling out of charts that could use hole reinforcements. People can go from room to room looking in on the patients just to make sure they are OK. How many patients could have been taken to the BR instead of left to pee in a diaper? Did all the MARs and TARs get checked for missing signatures? For all the time spent here on the forum, the facility might as well get rid of it's supervisor. Doesn't seem like there is anything for her to do for the facility.
By my count there were 27 posts generated since about 12am (that's the time showing on my computer, but I'm in a Pacific time zone) and there is at least one post every single hour up to now. That's more than just looking for advice--that's goofing off on the job. Someone doing this deserves to be fired.

Nice to know that there are some still perfect "company nurses" out there to show us poor saps the light. God help us all.

catlady, BSN, RN · Nov 24, 2005

If I could add up all the lunch breaks I never took and get paid for them now, I could retire. Many of those shifts were in long-term care, where you are often the only RN and legally can't even step off your floor or outside the building. Many of those shifts were in critical care, where the night supervisor told us that we weren't entitled to take a break (in a 12-hr shift!!) because we worked a straight shift without being docked for a break. So much for labor laws, eh? I am so indoctrinated to the idea that I am not entitled to a break that even now, working as a supervisor in an 8-5 setting, I feel like a wimp or a wuss if I take some time for myself. I constantly remind my staff to take their breaks but almost never do it myself.

If this nurse was so stressed out that she took a few minutes for herself and reached out for some support, so be it! Perhaps her manager should look into whether she is abusing her internet privileges, but nothing she posted deserved her being raked over the coals the way she was, by a total stranger.

If I randomly caught one of my nurses flipping through a magazine at their desk or looking up their travel plans on Expedia, I probably wouldn't say anything right away. If I came back 20 minutes later and they were still doing it, or if I saw they weren't getting their work done, then I would.

Long-term care is so much harder than anyone who's never done it could possibly realize. I was a fairly mobile supervisor myself, but there are some tasks that cry to be done alone, in a quiet office, where you can hear yourself think. She shouldn't have been flamed for that, either. I hope the OP is able to get some support from her manager. Management is so much more than being able to rule your employees.

rn/writer, RN · Nov 24, 2005

If I could add up all the lunch breaks I never took and get paid for them now, I could retire. Many of those shifts were in long-term care, where you are often the only RN and legally can't even step off your floor or outside the building. Many of those shifts were in critical care, where the night supervisor told us that we weren't entitled to take a break (in a 12-hr shift!!) because we worked a straight shift without being docked for a break. So much for labor laws, eh? I am so indoctrinated to the idea that I am not entitled to a break that even now, working as a supervisor in an 8-5 setting, I feel like a wimp or a wuss if I take some time for myself. I constantly remind my staff to take their breaks but almost never do it myself.
If this nurse was so stressed out that she took a few minutes for herself and reached out for some support, so be it! Perhaps her manager should look into whether she is abusing her internet privileges, but nothing she posted deserved her being raked over the coals the way she was, by a total stranger.
If I randomly caught one of my nurses flipping through a magazine at their desk or looking up their travel plans on Expedia, I probably wouldn't say anything right away. If I came back 20 minutes later and they were still doing it, or if I saw they weren't getting their work done, then I would.
Long-term care is so much harder than anyone who's never done it could possibly realize. I was a fairly mobile supervisor myself, but there are some tasks that cry to be done alone, in a quiet office, where you can hear yourself think. She shouldn't have been flamed for that, either. I hope the OP is able to get some support from her manager. Management is so much more than being able to rule your employees.

Amen to that!

LoriAlabamaRN · Nov 24, 2005

I'm sorry I wasn't able to get back on yesterday morning, I had been working on an inservice and decided to stay late and include the 7-3 CNAs as well. Let me see if I can clear some things up.

First of all, I want to thank again everyone who has been supportive of me. I wasn't trying to be a baby or beg for undeserved sympathy. I was honestly overwhelmed. And in the midst of that to find one of my favorite ladies hemmorhaging from the mouth... it broke my heart. I do connect with my staff, they always know they can come to me.

My job description is Clinical Nurse Manager. At my LTC facility, we have recently opened up a rehab wing. State laws require that an RN be present on that wing since it is orthopedic and cardiac rehab. That is why my office is on this wing. I am required to spend the majority of my time on this wing, and it is also the most highly staffed. Whenever there are callouts that I cannot cover, I function as a floor nurse or a CNA, and have done both many, many times. My main job is to be available for emergency situations. In the meantime I do have many duties, most of which are done within about six hours of steady work. So I voluntarily take other duties that would usually fall on the day shift managers (during the day, there are 8 RNs in the building compared to just one at night, but they help me out when they can also.) Not only do I keep up the rehab paperwork, but I also make rounds of the entire building several times a night. I wore a pedometer a few weeks ago, in one night I walked 3.4 miles. There are slow periods when the residents are sleeping. My staff is allowed to read, surf the net (except anything obscene, we have a firewall and an information systems man who reviews internet usage), watch television on low volume, or chat with eachother during slow times. I conduct random call bell audits, so I know that they are not neglecting their residents, and I place cards beneath total care residents and monitor when they are returned. I do keep a good watch over the facility.

It was mentioned by someone extremely judgemental that I get paid for 8 hours of work and need to do that. Well, I do get paid for 8 hours of work but end up doing 10 or 11 most nights. Our day shift RNs don't come in until 9am (except for the DON) and sometimes I am not comfortable with the status of a resident or with the staffing situation and I will wait for them to arrive before I leave. Payday was yesterday, and I had 21.5 hours of overtime, at a pay rate of $0.00. I can guarantee you that I did not spend 21.5 hours on the internet.

That is all the justifying I intend to do regarding my internet time. Some people are just cold-natured, and nothing will change that. The people whose opinions matter to me have been incredibly supportive, and I can't tell you how much I needed that. Someone mentioned that it was a problem for me to identify with my residents more than with my staff. I don't know where you got the idea that I wasn't identifying with my staff. I was a CNA until I was out of nursing school and then a floor nurse for years. I identify with them. As for the residents, I took care of my great-grandmother until she died of Alzheimers, and the residents do have a special place in my heart. I think that makes me a better nurse.

I do love my job. Usually, things do not happen all at once like that (thank goodness.) It may not have been as dramatic as back-to-back codes, but does that negate my reaction? Daytonite, you must be one of those annoying people who always has to "one-up" everyone. Your personality really comes through in your posts. I can just imagine... a patient tells you they have a headache, you say "That's nothing, I had a migraine, and I didn't whine and ask for Tylenol like a big ole baby!" As for embarrassing me with a dressing down, don't flatter yourself.

Again, thank you for the support I received... I'm not gonna "throw out the baby with the bathwater" as my Grandma says. I am still glad that I came here for help and would do it again despite the closemindedness of some. I'm proud to be a member.

Lori

LoriAlabamaRN · Nov 24, 2005

If I could add up all the lunch breaks I never took and get paid for them now, I could retire. Many of those shifts were in long-term care, where you are often the only RN and legally can't even step off your floor or outside the building. Many of those shifts were in critical care, where the night supervisor told us that we weren't entitled to take a break (in a 12-hr shift!!) because we worked a straight shift without being docked for a break. So much for labor laws, eh? I am so indoctrinated to the idea that I am not entitled to a break that even now, working as a supervisor in an 8-5 setting, I feel like a wimp or a wuss if I take some time for myself. I constantly remind my staff to take their breaks but almost never do it myself.
If this nurse was so stressed out that she took a few minutes for herself and reached out for some support, so be it! Perhaps her manager should look into whether she is abusing her internet privileges, but nothing she posted deserved her being raked over the coals the way she was, by a total stranger.
If I randomly caught one of my nurses flipping through a magazine at their desk or looking up their travel plans on Expedia, I probably wouldn't say anything right away. If I came back 20 minutes later and they were still doing it, or if I saw they weren't getting their work done, then I would.
Long-term care is so much harder than anyone who's never done it could possibly realize. I was a fairly mobile supervisor myself, but there are some tasks that cry to be done alone, in a quiet office, where you can hear yourself think. She shouldn't have been flamed for that, either. I hope the OP is able to get some support from her manager. Management is so much more than being able to rule your employees.

You said it extremely well, better than I could. Thank you! It's tough having to go from floor nurse to this much responsibility, and this site has been a godsend.

LoriAlabamaRN · Nov 24, 2005

Lori, I have not read all of the posts but I just want to say how sorry I am for the awful night you've had! What a responsibility! And, God Bless You for the work you do. I truly think it takes a special person to work LTC, it is so good to know there are such caring people like yourself. Thank you!
I hope you are feeling better when you get back online.
P.S. OK, Lori, I have just read through the other posts and I still stand by what I posted above. It is difficult to get people, especially people who give a c*rp to work in LTC. There are always cynical management types who forget what it's like to be "in the trenches"....just keep on keepin' on!

Your kind words mean a lot to me, thank you! I hope I never become cynical.... I always want to have an open mind and open heart. If I catch myself doing otherwise, it will probably be time for a career change. My staff and my residents deserve someone who truly cares.

LoriAlabamaRN · Nov 24, 2005

:smackingf :smackingf
, HOW ON EARTH CAN YOU EFFECTIVELY TEND TO PATIENTS AND OFFER SUPERVISION TO YOUR SUBORDINATES WHEN YOU'RE THAT UPSET?!!
People AT ALL LEVELS need encouragement at some point or another. No one is on top of things 100% of the time.
Good grief.
:smackingf

I think you hit the nail on the head. I wanted to be the support for my staff, not supported BY them. That's why I came into my office to try to pull myself together, and then after about 15 minutes of trying to stop crying, I came here. Thank you for understanding.

UM Review RN, ASN, RN · Nov 24, 2005

I'm sorry I wasn't able to get back on yesterday morning, I had been working on an inservice and decided to stay late and include the 7-3 CNAs as well. Let me see if I can clear some things up.
First of all, I want to thank again everyone who has been supportive of me. I wasn't trying to be a baby or beg for undeserved sympathy. I was honestly overwhelmed. And in the midst of that to find one of my favorite ladies hemmorhaging from the mouth... it broke my heart. I do connect with my staff, they always know they can come to me.
My job description is Clinical Nurse Manager. At my LTC facility, we have recently opened up a rehab wing. State laws require that an RN be present on that wing since it is orthopedic and cardiac rehab. That is why my office is on this wing. I am required to spend the majority of my time on this wing, and it is also the most highly staffed. Whenever there are callouts that I cannot cover, I function as a floor nurse or a CNA, and have done both many, many times. My main job is to be available for emergency situations. In the meantime I do have many duties, most of which are done within about six hours of steady work. So I voluntarily take other duties that would usually fall on the day shift managers (during the day, there are 8 RNs in the building compared to just one at night, but they help me out when they can also.) Not only do I keep up the rehab paperwork, but I also make rounds of the entire building several times a night. I wore a pedometer a few weeks ago, in one night I walked 3.4 miles. There are slow periods when the residents are sleeping. My staff is allowed to read, surf the net (except anything obscene, we have a firewall and an information systems man who reviews internet usage), watch television on low volume, or chat with eachother during slow times. I conduct random call bell audits, so I know that they are not neglecting their residents, and I place cards beneath total care residents and monitor when they are returned. I do keep a good watch over the facility.
It was mentioned by someone extremely judgemental that I get paid for 8 hours of work and need to do that. Well, I do get paid for 8 hours of work but end up doing 10 or 11 most nights. Our day shift RNs don't come in until 9am (except for the DON) and sometimes I am not comfortable with the status of a resident or with the staffing situation and I will wait for them to arrive before I leave. Payday was yesterday, and I had 21.5 hours of overtime, at a pay rate of $0.00. I can guarantee you that I did not spend 21.5 hours on the internet.
That is all the justifying I intend to do regarding my internet time. Some people are just cold-natured, and nothing will change that. The people whose opinions matter to me have been incredibly supportive, and I can't tell you how much I needed that. Someone mentioned that it was a problem for me to identify with my residents more than with my staff. I don't know where you got the idea that I wasn't identifying with my staff. I was a CNA until I was out of nursing school and then a floor nurse for years. I identify with them. As for the residents, I took care of my great-grandmother until she died of Alzheimers, and the residents do have a special place in my heart. I think that makes me a better nurse.
I do love my job. Usually, things do not happen all at once like that (thank goodness.) It may not have been as dramatic as back-to-back codes, but does that negate my reaction? Daytonite, you must be one of those annoying people who always has to "one-up" everyone. Your personality really comes through in your posts. I can just imagine... a patient tells you they have a headache, you say "That's nothing, I had a migraine, and I didn't whine and ask for Tylenol like a big ole baby!" As for embarrassing me with a dressing down, don't flatter yourself.
Again, thank you for the support I received... I'm not gonna "throw out the baby with the bathwater" as my Grandma says. I am still glad that I came here for help and would do it again despite the closemindedness of some. I'm proud to be a member.
Lori

My Dad's in a nursing home too far away for me to visit regularly. I thank God every day for dedicated, caring staff like yourself who slog through the mountains of work each day and do such a great job with so little thanks!

May you, your residents and your staff have a wonderful, peaceful Thanksgiving, Lori! :icon_hug:

dinkymouse · Nov 24, 2005

I'd love to know how the people the OP supervises would feel knowing she was in an office messing around on a computer. How busy could it have been if someone can see through their tears and sniffling well enough to type out a fairly long message on a computer? I've been a night supervisor in LTC and I'm not persuaded to provide encouragement where I don't think it's been earned. Sorry. Wonder what a boss would say to the request for help knowing that the person was finding time to go online for personal reasons? Go to an internet cafe or the library after getting off duty.

I have to say that when I am about to lose it and can take no more I sneak away outside to have a cigarette (yes a nurse who smokes) and if I had a pc I would probably I written a short note to a friend and posted it because I needed to vent to someone who really cared about me. This is only after residents are safe and the immediate situation is manageable.

As to the original poster I feel for you and can say I have been there, done that and come home exhausted. Not so much from the physical part but from the trying to mentally deal with all the crisis situations, making sure I charted it all and still deal with the residents needs. I am the only nurse on the 3-11 shift with 75 patients and often have to pass meds for 1/2 of those. I am never out of there on time and have to deal with a 11-7 lpn who can't understand why. So just keep trudging along on nights like that, the dawn does come.

allnurses Guide · Nov 24, 2005

I'm at work and on the computer in my office reading allnurses . . . :eek:

Our facility has given everyone, from CNA's to Ward Clerks to nurses to docs, an online account.

We also are monitored for WHERE we go . . no Media or dating sites, etc. :rolleyes:

It really bothers me that people make using the computer worse than flipping through a magazine, reading the newspaper, gossiping, taking a smoke break, etc. I start my shift at 0245 and we are usually finished with med checks, charts checks and assessments by 05. Alot of times we will have some coffee and catch up with each other's lives. Docs don't start rounds until 6:30 a.m.

We have a couple of nursing students working here and in their "downtime" they are allowed to study.

As long as the work is getting done, and everyone feels supported, I do not see the big deal with posting on allnurses.

My employer obviously doesn't have a problem with it - :)

steph

FranEMTnurse, CNA, LPN, EMT-I · Nov 24, 2005

44 years ago I worked as a nurses aide. (That was before there was a certification program) At that time I loved it. I typed the monthly newspaper when I was told to by the RN, I even contributed to articles myself by posting a section that targeted 4 residents. Its title was' "Life Begins at 80." I also held a monthly meeting for a club I created for the men titled. "The Crackerbarrel Club." On top of all of that, I took care of my residents. That was way back when we used an autoclave to sterilize bedpans, etc. During my downtime, I wrote letters to family members of the residents. I loved every minute of it, and I loved those residents, and I made them smile.

Fast forward to 1996. I was in nursing school. I cared for residents again in an LTC facility. Their smiles were gone. As I glanced at a resident in the TV room as I walked by, there she sat in her wheelchair, looking toward the TV, but she wasn't watching it. Her mind was on the past when she could do things for herself.

The people with dementia and alzheimers are criticized and laughed at many times. The only thing they want is to go home to the past. How very sad that they no longer are able to.

I am currently wearing some of their shoes for I am now disabled and need help getting through my day. Thankfully, I am supported by an LTC agency that pays people to do that for me. The first time I was threatened with being placed in an LTC facility was back in 2001, when I had Steroid Induced Myopathy. The two nurses in my room were discussing my condition, and wondered if they should recommend I be placed in a nursing home. That was when my nightmare began.

If I am forced to go into a nursing home, I will refuse to take the medications that keep me alive. That's how much I dread going into one. Why? Because everything is regulated now. Residents are given laxatives the night before their scheduled showers. A lot of times they are placed into the shower chair and hauled off into the shower where they are unable to hold back their bowels, and they have a BM on the floor anywhere between going to the shower to being in it. The CNAs hate that, and the resident is humiliated. I know that too, because I have had to have my backside wiped.

Those poor people are hauled off to do things at the convenience of the rules that are made by people who have no idea what it's like being in their shoes. Remember, they were once very active, and productive members of their communities too. This tears my heart out. I do not want to have anything to do with nursing homes. Those people are like now enslaved to the rules and time of treatment of the nursing home. How very sad.

Progress? What progress? There was a lot more nurse to resident contact back in the early 60s than there is today. Those poor people now have nothing to say for themselves; when they want to go to bed, what time they want their shower, etc. Their independence is completely gone. :crying2: