Did the title catch your attention? Good, I was hoping it would.
I've seen people talk about this attitude on allnurses quite a bit, and I find the reactions fascinating. I'm amazed at the passion, care and professionalism of the nurses on this board and really about every nurse I've ever met.
BUT, everyone-from the most seasoned nurse to the student- knows that nursing is changing and will probably continue to change dramatically over the years to come. There are CNAs and MAs who seem to have an increasing role in the healthcare system and nurses themselves have more responsibility (all the charting etc.) and demanding jobs as new diseases, new medicines and standards of care make their way into our lives.
My question is, do you think their should be a change in what nurses do? Will there come a time when basic hygiene and certain other tasks often done by nurses in the past will be the responsibility of CNAs and others in similar roles? Would this be a good thing for nurses? Is there really anything wrong with nurses who feel that four years of education + all of their other demands and responsibilities should mean that they shouldn't have to do these tasks?
Wow, amazing how different things are. Our CNA's are not allowed to do phlebotomy, in/outs, glucoscans, etc. They do vitals and personal care. steph[/quote
The PCA's at our hospital are trained to do phlebotomy, also do accuchecks, v/s, bath/linen changes. They can't do in/outs or foleys although I do know some PCA's that have worked at other hospitals in the area and were able to do so. They are only allowed to d/c foleys, PICC lines, IV's for post-mortem care. I wish our hospital would train PCA's to do these things when pts are discharged. Others might blast me for saying that, but I don't think these things are rocket science.
I was a PCA for a year while I finished nursing school, and nothing has changed since I became a nurse. Not tooting my own horn, but I try VERY HARD to help the PCA's when it comes to cleaning someone up. Of course, there are times that I am overwhelmed with other things, and they understand that.
Chadash, wish I had you on our staff!!
Not blasting you at all but what will be left for nurses to do if CNA's or PCA's do nursing skills? Paperwork?? Blech.
Can't get my mind around a CNA pulling a PICC line - I realize it isn't "rocket science" but there is a science to watching for signs of a problem.
I must admit, I would like to have more tech skills.
Though, I was offered med tech training once in a LTC I worked, but I refused the training because I strongly believe that medications should only be administered by LPNs and RNs.
Sometimes I think that management overestimates the comprehension level of NAs. For instance, I really enjoy any wound care, yet if I see any changes or problems, I run for the nurse because I lack assessment skills. You can't know what you havent been taught, and though on the job experience is great, having an academic basis prevents the pitfalls inherent in relying on one persons experience.
Specializes in private duty/home health, med/surg.
I will gladly perform ADL/personal hygiene tasks for the pt who needs it if I have time. Unfortunately, I often don't have time for these tasks because of the pt load and charting, charting, charting. I delegate to my aide not because I'm too good but because I have to carve out time for the tasks that I can not delegate.
Yeah that sort of was my point, over stating the obvious I guess. But I have run into Nursing assistants who call themselves nurses, so it must not be so obvious to some.
My point: nurses who take the lead and still show respect to the nursing assistant bring the most to their patients because a team has so much more to offer.
oops sorry i actually did not mean for that to be rude. I was saying that nurses should not always ask them to do everything that they are there to assist them but not do everything for them. I guess I could have said it better.
oops sorry i actually did not mean for that to be rude. I was saying that nurses should not always ask them to do everything that they are there to assist them but not do everything for them. I guess I could have said it better.
I understand. Don't worry!:balloons: Communication is not my forte at all!
Actually, I had written my post and did not re-read for clarity, which I should always do.
I attempt to communicate what healthcare looks from down here with the unwashed ( the aides, not the patients! we wash them...) because I hope it might improve teamwork. Seen a boat load of problems on the job when folks don't understand each other.
Also, I have such respect for those of you who have gone on to be LPNs, RNs and more. You experience stresses on the job that most people just can't imagine.
Here's my humble opinion on it all: You are a part of a team. Peri-care or IV drip-monitoring, it doesn't matter: patient care requires everyone's cooperation. If a task is too odious for you, then find a different line of work.
As an aide, I had to deal with all sorts of lazy, a**h*** RN's and LPN's whose butts were the same shape of the chairs behind the nurses' station.
"Oh, SN, I was just in 1312A to do her blood sugars, and she said she needed the bedpan."
"How long ago was that?"
"Ummm..about half an hour I think."
I wanted to scream.
The unit manager OTOH, was awesome; he is one of the most professional RN's I have ever seen, and he will put down whatever he is doing and grab a gait belt if asked for help.
I understand. Don't worry!:balloons: Communication is not my forte at all!
Actually, I had written my post and did not re-read for clarity, which I should always do.
I attempt to communicate what healthcare looks from down here with the unwashed ( the aides, not the patients! we wash them...) because I hope it might improve teamwork. Seen a boat load of problems on the job when folks don't understand each other.
Also, I have such respect for those of you who have gone on to be LPNs, RNs and more. You experience stresses on the job that most people just can't imagine.
thanks for being understanding. i have to re-read for clarity also. I have gotten myself into trouble a couple of times this way :trout:. oops
My motto is "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you". It is humiliating to be an adult and to have to have another adult clean up your mess. I have seen many patients go through the tortures of the damned at having to have another adult see them as helpless. I do all that I can to maintain their personal dignity.
Besides...poop I can stand by the truck load :uhoh21: . It's the snot that makes me want to run for the hills! :chair:
Yup, me too- blood doesn't bother me at all, but mucus/saliva does me in...Guess I'll have to get over that if I ever decide to become a CRNA!
Specializes in Mostly LTC, some acute and some ER,.
As a CNA myself, I have much more respect for nurses who do not feel that it is below them to wipe behinds, or help in a sticky situation. I am the only aide on my shift, and when it gets messy and overwhelming its nice when a nurse jumps in an helps. I really respect that. After I graduate nursing school, I know it won't be below me, because I know where I came from.
I think working as a PCA will make me a better nurse someday. I can guarantee I won't be one of those nurses that chase down someone to remove a bedpan.
As far as technical jobs as a PCA I do the following: start and d/c foleys, d/c IVs, simple sterile dressings, I/Os, BS's, then the usual bed/bath/peri.
On our unit CVCC (cardiovascular care unit), the nurse to patient ratio is about 1:5 and the PCAs are about 1:9.
As a CNA myself, I have much more respect for nurses who do not feel that it is below them to wipe behinds, or help in a sticky situation. I am the only aide on my shift, and when it gets messy and overwhelming its nice when a nurse jumps in an helps. I really respect that. After I graduate nursing school, I know it won't be below me, because I know where I came from.
There are nurses who could help more than they do, but it's funny that on one side of the ring we read thread after thread of nurses who are burned out, leaving the profession altogether after being worked to death. Then there are threads started by aides and others who are not nurses who complain that nurse's butts are the same shape as the chairs behind the nurses station because they sit and do nothing.
I've seen too many CNA's and non-nurses who think nurses should have plenty of time to help wipe butts, clean poop, etc.. I've been a CNA, I've been an LPN and I've been an RN. Being a CNA to me, is one of the filthiest, most thankless jobs a person could have. That is why I busted my a$$, sacrificed being with my children when they were babies, sacrificed money I could have spent out having a good time or frittering away on hairdo's and fingernails, to move up the ladder somewhat. Now I have a whole other set of responsibilities. CNA's are not expected to do the work of LPNs/RNs but look at what flack the nurses catch because they are not doing the jobs of CNA's. Until you are a nurse don't assume nurses don't help more on the s%&t patrol because they are lazy and want to sit around and drink coffee and not get their hands dirty.
I also want to add, that when I was a CNA in nursing school, I swore I was not going to be like the nurses and I was going to help the CNA's out. That went about as far as my first year as a nurse. When I was in LTC, I remember standing with the med cart in the hallway passing meds and I was right outside the door where a call light was going off. I had already checked on this patient, and what he wanted was to be dried and gotten up. He was maximum two person assist. I heard one of the aides say, "she could at least answer the call light, she's right there." What they didn't take into account is that I *had* answered the call light, and the man didn't need me, he needed them. I also heard some aides talking about a former CNA now nurse: she thinks she's too good to help us now! When I had downtime at the nursing home I enjoyed helping the CNA's on rounds. We would laugh and it was enjoyable. But just because we can help sometimes doesn't mean we can help all the time.
Im not above performing personal care however I think it does somewhat distract the patients view of our ability to asses, and assist in their care plans. if a patient sees us changing their briefs and then admin IVs they tend to doubt our ability
Spidey's mom, ADN, BSN, RN
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