I gave a lot of money to this place

Nurses General Nursing

Published

This is the one thing I do NOT like about Hospice. Tonight, had a patient transferred in from an area hospital. The woman has end stage cancer. She is absolutely Hospice appropriate. However, the family is in NO WAY shape or form ready for her to be in hospice. She is still a full code, they want all her meds to stay the same and asked when her AM labs would be drawn. I asked them exactly what it was they wanted. They really would like more treatment, but the doctors told them nothing more could or would be done for her. We discussed hospital and acute care vrs. hospice and comfort care. She was admitted respite care so that the family could have time to decide whether or not to place her or to take her home. They thought she was coming in as an inpatient for symptom management. I reviewed the two types of services with them as well. The decision was made to have her admitted, then discuss all options with the medical director and social worker on Monday. (Did I mention the great planning that had this woman transferred at 6pm on a Friday night? They KNEW this was going to be a problem:banghead:) So in comes patient's sister after I finally got through to the spouse and children. "What do you MEAN she can't stay past 5 days? We cleared all this with "Mrs. Big whig" at your main office. Don't you understand who I am? I have donated a lot of money to this place and I demand that you take care of my sister:rolleyes:" My reply? Ma'am, "Mrs. Big whig" doesn't have the authority to make those kinds of decisions, her title is in marketing. The doctor and social worker will be in Monday to help straighten everything out. Futhermore, while our organization does appreciate all donations that will not encourage us to make fraudulant claims to insurance companies. If we did that then they would shut us down and we could help nobody. ALSO, I have cared for a US Senator's father and I have cared for the homeless, they all get treated with the same respect.

She was not happy with me, her hand was on her hip and she was jabbing her finger in my face. Finally the patient's spouse had to tell her to stop it. She then left the building and promptly called "Mrs. Big Whig" and left a message on her cell phone. I got a call at 11:30 at night. How dare I say she has No Authority, she IS a director. I replied, I wasn't being disrespectful, I was being honest. You do NOT have the authority to decide if someone is admitted GIP or repite care. Further, I hope the money she gave was worth all the energy and time I have spent admitting this patient tonight while the rest of my patients got neglected. I was informed in no uncertain terms it wasn't about the money it was about the patient. Blahhhh, sometimes I just want to tell them all where to go. I just want to take care of my patients and make them as comfortable as I can.

Specializes in ICU/Critical Care.

"Don't you know who I am"

Nope and don't care.

What I hate even worse is when someone from above tells me "so and so is a "VIP" patient". Just what is that supposed to mean? That everyone else isn't?? That I'm supposed to treat them "better"???

Drives me nuts - and it comes from my management :banghead:

mc3 hospice :nurse:

Specializes in Corrections, Cardiac, Hospice.

Hmmm, guess I should clarify things.

We are an inpatient non-profit Hospice facility, not a hospital. Our Assoc. Medical director accepted the patient and he is going to see her Saturday morning, but I thought it was in the best interest of the family/patient to wait until Monday to speak with the big cheese:D (I love our Medical director, he is the sweetest, smartest, most compassionate doctor I have ever met. A pretty great human being as well. Even more, he lost his beloved wife to pancreatic cancer 15 years ago, so I thought the husband could relate to him.) The social worker on this weekend is per diem and just recently graduated. She worked as an intern for us last spring. Our social worker has been doing this for years, again, I felt it was better to wait until Monday when she was there so that she could help the family work through their issues.

TiredMD, to answer your question. The family made the decision to sign the consents to admit the patient. The decision to admit was made early in the day by the MD that was covering.

Thanks for all your support. I documented 9 pages of notes on this admission. Was there until 4:15 am. Went to a movie with co-workers today and did some retail therapy, so I am much better:cool:

I'm so stealing the "Do YOU know who you are?":D May even ad a quick neuro assessment, complete with pupil checks. After all, they could be having a stroke, and if they're important, I want to do all I can to help!:devil:

Specializes in ICU/Critical Care.

Visitor: Do you know who I am?

Nurse: Do you know who you are?

Visitor: I'm asking you

Nurse: NO, I'm asking you.

Visitor: Stop it, I'm asking you...DO YOU know who I AM?

Nurse: A PITA

Specializes in Hospice.

Is this family aware that the costs of treatment beyond symptom control are not covered by most hospice benefits? It can come as quite a shock to receive a bill for things like TPN, IVF, chemo meds, or a code? Unless, of course, your hospice company plans to eat the cost ...

Sounds like they are looking for a cheap (to them) alternative to a nursing home!

If there's a palliative care service at the hospital where pt's cancer is being treated, maybe they can suggest comfort measures that are appropriate for those still seeking curative tx.

If there is a person in your organization that deals with risk management, it might be time to let them know what's going on. This is a set-up for all concerned.

Please let us know how it turns out!

Specializes in Hospice.
I was informed in no uncertain terms it wasn't about the money it was about the patient. Blahhhh, sometimes I just want to tell them all where to go.

Doncha just love the happy-dolphin-music crowd! I HATE that smarmy crud! And it's almost always from a suit who never got within a mile of real hands-on care.

The hypocrisy of it just blows me away! Of COURSE it's about money!

Specializes in ED/trauma.
This is the one thing I do NOT like about Hospice. Tonight, had a patient transferred in from an area hospital. The woman has end stage cancer. She is absolutely Hospice appropriate. However, the family is in NO WAY shape or form ready for her to be in hospice. She is still a full code, they want all her meds to stay the same and asked when her AM labs would be drawn. I asked them exactly what it was they wanted. They really would like more treatment, but the doctors told them nothing more could or would be done for her. We discussed hospital and acute care vrs. hospice and comfort care. She was admitted respite care so that the family could have time to decide whether or not to place her or to take her home. They thought she was coming in as an inpatient for symptom management. I reviewed the two types of services with them as well. The decision was made to have her admitted, then discuss all options with the medical director and social worker on Monday. (Did I mention the great planning that had this woman transferred at 6pm on a Friday night? They KNEW this was going to be a problem:banghead:) So in comes patient's sister after I finally got through to the spouse and children. "What do you MEAN she can't stay past 5 days? We cleared all this with "Mrs. Big whig" at your main office. Don't you understand who I am? I have donated a lot of money to this place and I demand that you take care of my sister:rolleyes:" My reply? Ma'am, "Mrs. Big whig" doesn't have the authority to make those kinds of decisions, her title is in marketing. The doctor and social worker will be in Monday to help straighten everything out. Futhermore, while our organization does appreciate all donations that will not encourage us to make fraudulant claims to insurance companies. If we did that then they would shut us down and we could help nobody. ALSO, I have cared for a US Senator's father and I have cared for the homeless, they all get treated with the same respect.

She was not happy with me, her hand was on her hip and she was jabbing her finger in my face. Finally the patient's spouse had to tell her to stop it. She then left the building and promptly called "Mrs. Big Whig" and left a message on her cell phone. I got a call at 11:30 at night. How dare I say she has No Authority, she IS a director. I replied, I wasn't being disrespectful, I was being honest. You do NOT have the authority to decide if someone is admitted GIP or repite care. Further, I hope the money she gave was worth all the energy and time I have spent admitting this patient tonight while the rest of my patients got neglected. I was informed in no uncertain terms it wasn't about the money it was about the patient. Blahhhh, sometimes I just want to tell them all where to go. I just want to take care of my patients and make them as comfortable as I can.

Wow, I applaud you for all you did say! You said a lot of important things while remaining tactful and respectful. I tend to freeze up in those situations, so I'm pleased to hear someone's doing what I hope to be able to do one day.

On the other hand, my understanding of hospice is, that once a patient is admitted, they are required to be DNR / no code. Maybe that was only at the one hospice facility with which I am familiar, but it seems like full code defeats the whole purpose of hospice -- esp. if they've been told nothing else medically can be done for the patient.

Medical mysteries... :confused:

She was not happy with me, her hand was on her hip and she was jabbing her finger in my face.

Right about that point is when I would have gone ballistic. Jabbing fingers are a big trigger for me. :rolleyes: I applaud your ability to stay cool and I can only imagine the things you were saying to yourself!

Specializes in ICU/Critical Care.

I'm sick of administration's attitude that we should just "take" verbal abuse.

Specializes in Hospice.
On the other hand, my understanding of hospice is, that once a patient is admitted, they are required to be DNR / no code. Maybe that was only at the one hospice facility with which I am familiar, but it seems like full code defeats the whole purpose of hospice -- esp. if they've been told nothing else medically can be done for the patient.

Medical mysteries... :confused:

This may have changed since I was oriented to hospice, but my understanding is that CMS expressly forbids requiring pts to be dnr in order to receive hospice care. It may be different with private insurance.

Is that facility inpt only? It is reasonable to require dnr to be admitted to a hospice inpatient unit (which is only a small part of most hospice programs and has strict criteria for admission)...but not for the program as a whole.

As for defeating the purpose of hospice ... people can code from reversible causes that have nothing to do with the terminal diagnosis. Since, theoretically, hospice is designed to provide the best quality of whatever life is remaining, should we then force a pt to give that up because she choked on a piece of steak, for instance? Or an anesthesia problem during a dental procedure? Or an allergic reaction to a bee sting?

I've oversimplified 'cause I don't want to hijack the thread. It's a complicated discussion.

Meanwhile, I really hope OP returns and lets us know how things turn out.

Specializes in CDI Supervisor; Formerly NICU.
Visitor: Do you know who I am?

Nurse: Do you know who you are?

Visitor: I'm asking you

Nurse: NO, I'm asking you.

Visitor: Stop it, I'm asking you...DO YOU know who I AM?

Nurse: A PITA

Heh. I'd like to work with you. Move to Texas.

+ Add a Comment