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Discussion

Help me understand...

This is long, but if you read and can help me understand... I will greatly appreciate it!

A little background:

I am currently taking Intro A&P as a summer class. For my particular LVN program, we are allowed to take this class in advance of the program (with or without acceptance to the program) to substitute for A&P for AH. I opted to take the summer class for several reasons - 1) opens up a huge chunk of time on Fridays while my kids are at school for studying or me-time or whatever, 2) one less thing to study and memorize and learn with everything else going on in the program and 3) I felt it would give me a little bit of an academic advantage, having studied this subject before the core program classes that build on it.

Out of 25 people in my class, 18 are Fall LVN Program students... presumably for the substitution option. (I don't know why anyone would do this route otherwise..)

That said, a good deal of my class mates are failing.

We have a separate lab that makes up 25% of the total final grade (avg of 4 tests), and from what I can tell by their own account, the majority is barely passing even the lab portion. We have had 2 tests so far with class averages below 50% on each, and a test coming up on Tuesday... final exam is 7/22.

After the last test, the usual 'how did you do' conversations arose... (we are allowed to keep the test paper and given an answer key once we turn in our scantron) I was disappointed in my grade until I found out my 81 was one of the highest... Of course, I got lots of questions about how I study, etc... and I gave up my secret (study outline at the end of each chapter closely mirrors the test questions.. but we were told this on the first day)... and I actually read every page of every chapter at least once... take notes in class (and don't miss class)... but I only STUDY those outlines for the chapters we are testing on...

My confusion (and the point of this terribly long post) is how anyone could spend that much money to PAY to be in school, and not do the reading... not make the effort to learn the material.. Why bother at all??

Is this an indicator of what to expect in nursing school? I know for a fact that one of my classmates is in the same program location as I am (there are 5 options for the program, my A&P class is at a campus for a different location than my program... same college though).. but I really feel for the other 16 people in this class going in to the program... A&P isn't nearly as tough as some of the subjects we will study (based on posts here and friends/family who have been through the program) and you just can't blow it off until the day before/day of test... Why take the spot if you're not committed enough to put the time in to studying...

I know I am making assumptions... and I know what that often gets a person.. lol.. I'm just trying to understand and thought maybe other students might have a different perspective. It's too late to form study groups and such for this class (only 4 meetings left, 1 of which is final only)... but perhaps I can learn a way to help a fellow student if I see this in the Fall... if for nothing else than I hate to see someone do themselves in...

Or maybe I just need to not worry about what/how others are doing? LOL If that's the case, just come on out and tell me.. ;)

As an aside, I have never taken a college level science class before and would never recommend anyone take a summer science class that wasn't prepared for the sheer speed of the class... let alone the subject matter to be learned quickly in just 7 weeks. I took a huge chance on this class and if I wasn't able to do as much study time as I am, I probably would have wasted my ~$700 by getting in over my head.. It is pretty overwhelming to learn this much in such a short time! :uhoh3:

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    It is my opinion when the class average is below 50%, something is wrong with the instruction.

    Summer science classes are hard... I took general biology last summer (first science class in 15+ years) and I studied my tail off and only made a C+. I especially struggled with the lab test because I had no idea what to expect with the labs. There were 22 people in my class and a little over half of them did worse than I did.

    I guess what I am trying to say is that it is great you're doing so well. But for some people, these types of classes don't come easy.

    Don't worry so much about how everyone else is doing.

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    • Experts

    Their grades are their problem, not your's. Worry about yourself first. Give yourself your mental energy, you will need all of it when school starts in the fall. Good luck in the class.

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    Oh- and it is also a possibility some of the students in your class aren't actually paying for their education. (Parents, maybe?)

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    • Author
    It is my opinion when the class average is below 50%, something is wrong with the instruction.

    Summer science classes are hard... I took general biology last summer (first science class in 15+ years) and I studied my tail off and only made a C+. I especially struggled with the lab test because I had no idea what to expect with the labs. There were 22 people in my class and a little over half of them did worse than I did.

    I guess what I am trying to say is that it is great you're doing so well. But for some people, these types of classes don't come easy.

    Don't worry so much about how everyone else is doing.

    I have to agree about something being wrong with the instruction... however, on the first day, he did tell us exactly where the test questions come from (chapter outlines in the book) and what to study... at the very least, it seems as though the class average should be higher. He does curve the grades (if test avg is below 75%, grades are raised the difference... plus 25pts for 50% avg.. so even then, it is possible to pass without passing)

    I am right with you on the summer science class. I haven't had a science class since I was a sophomore in high school .... 22 years ago! It isn't easy at all... but if you can do it... and I can do it... it IS possible!

    I would like to clarify that aside from trying to understand the human element of it... I am trying to turn my observations into a means for helping fellow students in the fall.

    I do appreciate the reality check on worrying about others' performance! :) I hope that comes across in this... I guess I know it is really not productive, but after being asked for tips after the last test... I guess I was trying to take a bad habit and turn it into a productive skill? (maybe? lol)

    I can admit that I am not one who does the 'how did you do' questioning... that makes me uncomfortable to even answer and definitely not something I would seek out... lol... you just never know when a conversation like that could 'go south'...

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    • Author
    Oh- and it is also a possibility some of the students in your class aren't actually paying for their education. (Parents, maybe?)

    Good point... I know it is a trend for some (not all!) people to not appreciate college opportunities until they have to work hard to afford them... haha....

    Again, thanks for all the feedback! :)

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    its a LVN program- that is why.

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    • Author
    its a LVN program- that is why.

    I'm not sure I understand your point.

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    Perhaps they had other things going on in their life that prevented them to do well on this one exam and it is typical for people to ask if someone got a better score to what they do to prepare for tests.

    Your one post says the teacher curves and gives 25 pts. or something...not sure I understand that, but does that mean your 80 whatever score was initially a 60 ish? I think you are fortunate to have curving in your class as most don't. I don't think it is fair for you to say they shouldn't take up a spot or spend all this money when again you have no idea what other commitments the students have. In general, I don't think students would purposely choose to receive a bad grade. Sometimes it is just getting familiar with the teacher's testing style and the types of questions.

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    • Author
    Perhaps they had other things going on in their life that prevented them to do well on this one exam and it is typical for people to ask if someone got a better score to what they do to prepare for tests.

    Your one post says the teacher curves and gives 25 pts. or something...not sure I understand that, but does that mean your 80 whatever score was initially a 60 ish? I think you are fortunate to have curving in your class as most don't. I don't think it is fair for you to say they shouldn't take up a spot or spend all this money when again you have no idea what other commitments the students have. In general, I don't think students would purposely choose to receive a bad grade. Sometimes it is just getting familiar with the teacher's testing style and the types of questions.

    my 2nd test grade was an 81 raw score... he hasn't announce the curve for that test, but his estimation was 20pts, making my 81 actually a 101... 1st test I made a 78, curved up 17 pts to a 95...

    I wasn't trying to be harsh with my statement about taking up a spot or spending money, honestly... and I do apologize if it came off that way. I guess I was just trying to express that I don't know why anyone would waste their time/money (a perspective thing, admittedly) and take a spot if they aren't going to do the reading.

    I have heard it expressed by several of the classmates who are failing that they do not do the reading... and rather than rudely ask why not, I was just trying to gain a bit of insight from outside sources...

    I have never had a class with a curve before this one, and I don't really understand the concept. To me, it seems like it could be an attempt to falsely represent the class average (points awarded but not earned) or to help students with what is admittedly an overwhelming amount of information.

    I can see how someone's circumstances might interfere with the ability to succeed in a class. I've had those kinds of issues, myself...

    I really am not trying to be critical or anything of the sort... and I guess it really doesn't matter in the big picture... sorry if I came off in any sort of condescending or offensive way...

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    One thing that some people cant seem to understand with A&P is that it is a self-study class. You have to teach it to yourself and take it upon yourself to learn the material. The powerpoints that my Prof makes up are terrible. They dont even make sense sometimes. I have to read the chapter and rewrite my own study guide for our exams.

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    • Experts

    Some people, especially if they are just coming out of high school, do not get themselves into a different mind set for nursing school (or prerequisite) classes. They just see them as "school" or "school work" and do not put themselves into gear to prepare for a livelihood knowledge base that they will be required to actually know this material. They are still used to just getting by and forgetting everything they crammed, the day after a test. Nursing does not work that way.

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    I didn't take your post condescending or offensive just wanted to state a different point of view as to why some may not be doing so well. In asking if you were curved to the 80 was seeing if everyone is in fact getting the low score and then curved up to a better score. Like someone says the instructor needs to look at how they are presenting the material as well as people need to take it on themselves and self teach. I found that in my A/P I, but had a marvelous teacher for A/P II.

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