Has ACLS been 'dumbed down'?

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ACLS used to be an extremely rigorous course in the past. Now, more and more people are getting it and it's practically a walk in the park. I understand the reasoning of it being viewed as a learning experience, but I'm wondering if the standards have become too lax? No one fails anymore.

What do you think, should the standards be tightened up again, or is it fine the way it is?

Specializes in IM/Critical Care/Cardiology.

,It's very interesting and great knowledge, Sues.quatch

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Specializes in L & D; Postpartum.

My first ACLS experience was 2 years ago, after 30 years in nursing. I just redid it in August and the entire experience is part of why I will retire from any nursing job that requires ACLS in August of 2009. I do not find it useful---other than for me to know since the possiblilty of using it for me is nil, I'm more dangerous than anything, IF I was dumb enough to assume that peace of paper means I know what to do. I don't.

It's not a good learning experience. To try and cram that much information into 2 days at a desk, with instructors who've had 4 triple lattes and talk a mile a minute is ludicrous.

If you're in a unit that can be expected to use it often, then yes, you need it and you would go in knowing that. To foist it upon the rest of us, (OB's and dental assistants) is nuts. I know to call the code team, but if anybody thinks I feel I'm competent to draw up any of the meds just because I took that class, they are wrong, so wrong.

I don't think it's a matter of dumbing down. I think facilities want bragging rights as to how many of their staff are ACLS certified, not taking into account that many of those people do not in any way feel competent or confidant about any of it.

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Specializes in ICU, ER.

People will learn and retain more in a relaxed, positive atmosphere. The goal is to save patient's lives, not scare the people taking the course. I am glad it has changed.

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Specializes in LTC, Med/Surg, Peds, ICU, Tele.

Thanks for the feedback. I know that I, personally, learn better in a more relaxed atmosphere. From talking to colleagues, I would not have even wanted to take the old course. The last re-certification I did was barely graded though. It did seem like a rush job.

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Specializes in IM/Critical Care/Cardiology.
My first ACLS experience was 2 years ago, after 30 years in nursing. I just redid it in August and the entire experience is part of why I will retire from any nursing job that requires ACLS in August of 2009. I do not find it useful---other than for me to know since the possiblilty of using it for me is nil, I'm more dangerous than anything, IF I was dumb enough to assume that peace of paper means I know what to do. I don't.

It's not a good learning experience. To try and cram that much information into 2 days at a desk, with instructors who've had 4 triple lattes and talk a mile a minute is ludicrous.

If you're in a unit that can be expected to use it often, then yes, you need it and you would go in knowing that. To foist it upon the rest of us, (OB's and dental assistants) is nuts. I know to call the code team, but if anybody thinks I feel I'm competent to draw up any of the meds just because I took that class, they are wrong, so wrong.

I don't think it's a matter of dumbing down. I think facilities want bragging rights as to how many of their staff are ACLS certified, not taking into account that many of those people do not in any way feel competent or confidant about any of it.

Hate to be the bad apple here, but do you really think your to "dumb" to draw up a med? Generally you receive support in a very short amount of time and it's not always "just you" alone trying to save a person from crashing. I bet you have better skilled qualities about you than you think, and to quit for your own sake rather than trying to help out in a code sounds a bit selfish to me.

I agree there is alot of info and the instructors all teach differently, but you do own a mouth to ask questions or don't you care at all?:trout:

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That's pretty much what I was trying to say!

I can remember when experienced ICU and ER nurses would turn pale at the thoughts of taking ACLS.

I remember back in the dark ages when it was a real pain to take ACLS. It was a scary thing. The doctor where I worked at prided himself on how many he could fail (including docs) The next time I took it, our instructors were extremely friendly, excellent teachers who were experienced (ER, RT) in these situations. I too like another poster have a problem with some of the AHA points but that's just the way it is.

A lot of the unnecessary stuff was deleted and I'm glad because it did nothing to increase the ability to function in a code situation.

I don't think it's a matter of dumbing down. I think facilities want bragging rights as to how many of their staff are ACLS certified, not taking into account that many of those people do not in any way feel competent or confidant about any of it.

At least these people should have a basic understanding of the ABCs and why we give the drugs that we do. As for OBs...don't think your patients are beyond crashing and burning. The worst codes I've ever been on have been in OB (staff was great...situation sucked) The worst codes as far as basic knowledge of ANYHTING. is med surg. ie. pt. is short of breath and blue..no O2 on the patient. Pt. foaming at the mouth and no suction in room, pt with aspiration precautions and no sx at bedside, I could go on......

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I"ve been an ACLS instructor since '94 and I definitely disagree with the AHA on some points. We remediate anyone who needs it. It's not about passing or failing, so much as making people comfortable with a certain knowledge and skill set. I always though it was ridiculous to fail RNs on an intubation station when they would never be allowed (much less required) to place an ET tube.

Some teaching centers may pass everyone regardless of their performance, but we train RRT, MD, RN, EMT-P and our philosophy is "you work as a team" but if a student is being "hand-held" or appears to be out of their element, we make them go through it until we feel comfortable with their performance.

I am scheduled to take the one-day ACLS recert class in a couple of weeks but wonder if I should retake the entire 2-day course. Don't use the material in my job, but I do understand it. In your opinion, does the one day recert class pare down the info too much to successfully complete the course? Thanks...

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Specializes in Med-Surg, Cardiac.

I remember the days in the mid 80s when you'd come out of your mega-code sweating, and they had the slide show test of your monitor strip reading (a second or two per strip). I agree that that was kind of ridiculous. However I think the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction.

Now when I recert we don't have a mega-code per se, more like a conversation about what we'd do. When they give out the written exam they have people work in groups on the exam. I don't know if anybody fails.

Although torture of the participants is not needed, I think it's not too much to expect that at the end the people would have memorized the algorithms to an acceptable level and be able to pass a written test on their own. If they find themselves running or working a code they need to know the algorithm.

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Wow - seems like quite a wide range of experiences. I took mine a few months ago - great course. We were expected to have studied the material prior to the class. In the morning we spent about 4 hours practicing all the algorithms. In the afternoon, we were tested on a Megacode and had to pass a written test which included having to know about 20 rhythms. I don't remember the numbers, but not everybody passed - sure didn't seem too "dumbed down" to me!

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Specializes in L & D; Postpartum.
Hate to be the bad apple here, but do you really think your to "dumb" to draw up a med? Generally you receive support in a very short amount of time and it's not always "just you" alone trying to save a person from crashing. I bet you have better skilled qualities about you than you think, and to quit for your own sake rather than trying to help out in a code sounds a bit selfish to me.

I agree there is alot of info and the instructors all teach differently, but you do own a mouth to ask questions or don't you care at all?:trout:

I'm not too dumb at all, but if I don't ever have the situation arise for 16, say, months after I've taken ACLS, how confidant would I be? Not at all confidant. And as far as asking questions at ACLS. That's a laugh. They have such a rigid time schedule that there's very little if any time for that. It was, both times, a very stressful experience for me. I don't think it's selfish at all to call it a day if I don't wish to put myself through that again. And by then, I'll be 61 and hopefully, will be retired anyway. And BTW, everybody should be so lucky to "quit" when it is their call and not for any other reason.

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Specializes in ICU, PACU.

ACLS isn't "dumbed down". ACLS is set up where everyone will get through their weaknesses before they leave the building. Everyone I know including me have studied hard to pass the written test and we take it seriously.

Perhaps ACLS should be considered more percise rather than "dumbed down".

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Specializes in IM/Critical Care/Cardiology.
I'm not too dumb at all, but if I don't ever have the situation arise for 16, say, months after I've taken ACLS, how confidant would I be? Not at all confidant. And as far as asking questions at ACLS. That's a laugh. They have such a rigid time schedule that there's very little if any time for that. It was, both times, a very stressful experience for me. I don't think it's selfish at all to call it a day if I don't wish to put myself through that again. And by then, I'll be 61 and hopefully, will be retired anyway. And BTW, everybody should be so lucky to "quit" when it is their call and not for any other reason.

See didn't think you were to dumb..... I hear you saying you would just not prefer to paticipate. I disagree with instuctors not answering questions. I had plenty and after 2 days I went through the mega code using drug, interpretting EKG's using paddles and when I got to a point of what I'd hang next, I told the truth and said I don't know.

Congrats on your long career, but if I am your patient before you quit and I stop breathing, I'd hope you'd at least ask for help so you can pass the buck.

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