Getting alternative AA meetings approved by your program?

[dirtyhippiegirl]

So, like most of us here, my monitoring program orders me to go to a set amount of AA or NA meetings a week. Celebrate Recovery is also on the approved list and al-Anon on a case-by-case basis.

Has anyone ever tried to get an alternative-AA or even a non-AA program approved by their monitoring program? Or is in a monitoring program that allows alternatives to straight AA/NA?

Non-AA groups would be like SMART or LifeRing. Alternative AA groups in my area are Buddhist-based or Atheist&Agnostic groups. I think I would have better luck pitching the alternative-AA groups since they are still basically AA and abstinence-based.

Anyone?

[TXRN2]

In TPAPN- quite a few years ago- I got approved to work nights. It had been my regular shift before, & I had spent some time on days, but then was allowed to go back to nightshift.

[Vanursie]

Well that gives me some hope! Night shift was all I did for years and it has been hard adapting to days!

[dirtyhippiegirl, BSN, RN]

Did you every get your request approved? I am right now struggling to get the courage to request my no nights stipulation change. I have two years sobriety and 100% complient, recently got my controlled sub access back but would like to do nights permanently. I work in a hospital setting so there is always supervision there but for some reason I am terrified to even ask my cm in VA. I feel like you just don't hear of monitored nurses doing nights. Does anyone have any suggestions or experience with this?

Nights is not an immediate restriction in my state's monitoring program! I'm in Kansas. SO maybe you could use that as a defense point for why you should be able to work nights.

I brought up the subject with the director of my program during a monitoring meeting and he asked me to email him some information on the topic. (Well, first he wanted to debate how an Atheist can work an AA program without a higher power but I think that was some mental sparring on his part. lol.) Haven't gotten around to emailing him -- have been busy with work unfortunately. :/

[Vanursie]

Atheists can def recovery too! For the first year I used my cat as a higher power! Haha not sure why but it worked! My counselor said any of the meetings or programs such as SMART and a few others I forgot all count toward monthly meetings but unfortunately there is none of those available in our area. I've seen a lot of peers struggle with the aa concept and although I was not brought up religiously I felt okay going to aa meetings. I'm pretty much just open to any ideas or beliefs because I haven't a clue what's out there or where we stand in this world, Hopefully when you email him he approves it! I'm hoping I get approved for nights, it just always helps to hear other people have succeeded then it doesn't seem like such a big deal to ask for it to be considered

[catsmeow1972, BSN, RN]

I came across something called Rational Recovery. It's an online thing. Does not have face to face meetings but does do this online monitoring program that has actually been approved in lieu of the 12 step meetings. I think you check in however many times a week and can participate in a chat room setup. The gentleman that runs it has a lot of information about how forced AA etc attendance is actually a civil rights violation. Also has material on what is called AVRT. It's a method of working recovery in a non12 step manner. It's worth a look at. I am in the process of trying to get this okayed instead of drudging through meetings that don't apply to my issues and are not a productive endeavor. To paraphrase what someone said earlier, if I am going to have to do this, I would at least like to get some use out of it. In keeping with what I wrote previous, I have mental health issues, not an addiction issue. I am of no help to people in AA/NA etc. and they are not really of any help to me. How is that supposed to be "mutual support"? Even my therapist recommended to IPN that the meeting attendance be stopped as she feels it is counterproductive. Sadly, that's been soundly ignored.

[Lillie1004]

I too am stuck with the stipulation of attending AA/NA meetings, never mind that my issue is mental health. Never have your evaluation at a place that has a financial interest in drug and alcohol recovery. You will be labeled alcoholic or addicted to anything they can think of to fleece you of many thousands of $$$. The particular place I wound up with (good grief, I should have researched more) I think, hands IPN the exact same recommendations for every. single. person. Nothing like inpatient AND outpatient treatment that is addiction focused when a person does not smoke, drink, do drugs and just has the misfortune of being clinically depressed and hitting bottom (for a variety of reasons). That being said, I made some effort at inquiring about alternate choices for the AA stuff because I am neither particularly religious nor do I have a very high personal opinion of the whole "insert issue here-anonymous shtick." (If it has helped people that have problems that it addresses, that's awesome but the doctrine and history of it all just does not sit well with me, nor does it make a lot of sense. But that's just me. I will not force my personal opinions on anyone else. I am also not comfortable socializing with people that I don't seem to have much in common with.

In any case, my efforts at finding approval for something that might actually be helpful and still meet the requirement have been soundly ignored. So I go to the meetings (usually AA, because they tend to not be in cracktown and seem a little safer). I sit there and discreetly read a book. I go, I am present and therefore fulfill the requirement. Nobody said I have to participate. Its a crappy attitude but it gets me through this and hopefully out the other side with a little of my sanity intact.

I absolutely agree. My diagnosis was self medicating for depression and social anxiety. I'm ok with very small groups where attention isn't on me and one on one interactions, but the AA/NA meetings I have attended make me very anxious and miserable making it impossible for me to gain anything out of the experience. I have tried to attend and get more comfortable in the situation, but feel the same way each time. I wish online meetings were accepted and would gave no problem actually participating, for once , in those. But they aren't, which is a shame. I am not gaining anything from these meetings because I just watch the clock until I can leave.

[catsmeow1972, BSN, RN]

I just want to know what the point is of forcing attendance of these things on people that do not have drug/alcohol/addictions issues. I believe it is an example of the trend of patholigizing otherwise normal behavior. The "recovery" industry seems to purport that everybody is addicted to something, and therefore AA etc. is the end all be all fix. I still maintain that if AA etc is what keeps you sober/clean etc. go for it. Great that there is something out there to help you. For the rest of us, I feel that mandated attendance is useless and something of an insult to those who find help there.

[Lillie1004]

I just want to know what the point is of forcing attendance of these things on people that do not have drug/alcohol/addictions issues. I believe it is an example of the trend of patholigizing otherwise normal behavior. The "recovery" industry seems to purport that everybody is addicted to something, and therefore AA etc. is the end all be all fix. I still maintain that if AA etc is what keeps you sober/clean etc. go for it. Great that there is something out there to help you. For the rest of us, I feel that mandated attendance is useless and something of an insult to those who find help there.

I absolutely agree with you. I actually try to go with a friend to AA who says the program saved her life. When I met her there, she knew everyone and is totally comfortable in that environment. Her knowing everyone actually made me MORE uncomfortable. As if, if everyone weren't staring at me before, now they are. It's an irrational mind thing, I know, but it's my messed up brain and it's how it works. But, let me know if you're able to substitute Rational Recovery. It's worth the $300+ to do it this way. Thanks!

[dirtyhippiegirl, BSN, RN]

How would you provide proof of attending online meetings? Seems like an ethical issue to submit, say, copies of chat logs because you're divulging everyone's issues that way.

I know people who just go to NA/AA speaker meetings. The stories can get pretty crazy-entertaining and some of the speakers are actually really good. But my state does not necessitate that you provide proof that you have a sponsor and are working the program.

I do kinda get why monitoring programs want you to attend in-person meetings. I have more than two dozen psych unit admissions to my name, so I am intimately familiar with severe mental illness. I wish the mental health community had the same easily accessible, grass-roots, peer-lead community that AA/NA provides to addicts. The *relationships* that are built are the cornerstone of success in the (AA/NA) program in my opinion (and that's a very controversial opinion to have if you're in the program so there's that) and it's a shame the same sort of relationship support isn't more widely available to folks with mental illness.

[catsmeow1972, BSN, RN]

I'm not entirely certain how it works, but I believe that there is a way for the moderator to supply proof that you've been "there" so to speak. There is a charge for it but that I think it is to defray the cost of confidential recording of participation. I have not done any more looking into it due to lack of time and money. My states program is so financially severe that in spite of working full time, I have very little income to spare. For now I am just takng the grin and bear it approach

I too understand the idea of in-person contact. Some type of social interaction is vital to aid in keeping one's wits about themselves. I just don'f understand the point of forced interaction with people you would otherwise have no identification with. I know for me, treating my depression involves taking my meds, seeing my therapist and making an effort to go out and do the things I enjoy. Forced attendance at those meetings is not enjoyable and as Lille said above, survival of them means clock watching till I can leave without being rude.

[Lillie1004]

For me, it's not just the speaking that bothers me. It's everything about it...being around people, holding hands with people I don't know, how everyone there wants to be there because this works for them, the steps, the prayers, everything. I've attended meetings, many meetings. I've tried. In addiction, as well as mental illness, you can't go by the "one size fits all" approach. It's not. For me, dealing with my mental illness comes first because with that dealt with, I have NO desire to use. These people say they think about drinking every day and that there are certain triggers for them. I don't have those feelings now that I'm on an antidepressant that works for me. AA/NA does nothing fo my sobriety, but Effexor does. It's the difference between life and death for me and you would thin Boards Of Nursing would recognize the difference.