What do you think of this statement? - page 3
This statement was made by my professor during class yesterday, so I pose this question to all nursing students, as well as anyone else who'd like to participate. I am interested in hearing your... Read More
Jan 8, '03Joined: Dec '00; Posts: 830; Likes: 64Im glad I waited to post on this thread. I saw it right after it was written and was hesitated to write a response. But now that I look at the majority of the responses I see that most feel the same way I do. Yes it is true. Sad but true.
I dont think it would take finding a strong man to speak for the Nursing as a complete. I feel that once we have had enough we will bind together and do it ourselves. There are men in nursing and yet we still have the same results. Its how we are looked upon as an industry. We must change the minds of Our Industry before anyone else in the world takes us seriously. Until we learn there are strengths in numbers we will continue to stumble around and take it.
Jan 8, '03Occupation: Manager of Mental Health Services for Older People Joined: Dec '01; Posts: 358; Likes: 1I agree, sad but probably True. I believe Nurses should be seen as nurses irrespective of gender. There are however some key leadership roles filled by females. eg in the UK Beverly Malone (American) is the leader of the largest professional body, The Royal College of Nursing. I personally would welcome more females in key political positions.
Jan 8, '03Occupation: CCU Joined: Aug '02; Posts: 572; Likes: 6Unfortunately, there will probably not be much change in nursing until the number of males increases substantially. Then what will happen is these guys will get pi**ed off and make some changes.
I speculate they will initially form a political forum, structure, identity, and agenda of their own with their own goals and aspirations and reach critical mass to effect change. Women vent, men get even. I think when men identify that a change is possible that will last you will see them assemble as a group of their own to forward nursing.
Jan 8, '03Occupation: Lifetime student! Joined: Oct '02; Posts: 819; Likes: 2Is it too late to get another prof??
That's what I would do.
IF this statement was made by a male than it's gonna be tough to teach if he losses students due to his "politically incorrect" attitude. (not to mention a little bit of______envy goin on there)
IF the statement was made by a female, bring her here I think there are enough of us to give her a little "attitude adjustment!"
Jan 8, '03Occupation: Nurse Consultant Specialty: 24 year(s) of experience in Obstetrics, M/S, Psych ; Joined: Jun '02; Posts: 3,105; Likes: 49Having more men join the profession will increase our political power and working conditions. We should take advantage of this! Why make it an us against them situation at all? Instead, wouldn't it be wiser to just recruit men, women, anybody who truly has the desire to become a nurse. It is an added extra if it also happens to strengthen us a a whole.
The business world has realized that women make excellent managers. They connect well with their subordinates and bring a certain comrardary to the workplace . These are positive female influences that have proven to be effective in what used to be a male only arena. There are more women entering in a supervisory capacity every day.
I would rather see us use all of our resources to make the profession better no matter what gender, race whatever and leave the hostility behind.
Jan 8, '03Joined: Jul '00; Posts: 11,351; Likes: 387I wish I knew how to make that barfy face on here....
Women saying men are needed to improve nursing is just passing the buck. It ignores the fact that women in nursing have made huge strides over the past 30 years.
And the real question is: If men are natural leaders and their opinions are given more political clout, then where are those great male nurse leaders? Where is the "male nurse" lobby in Washington? There have to be tens of thousands of male nurses in America, so why haven't they saved the profession yet? Answer: because when it comes down to it, they aren't all that different from the women they work with.
Jan 8, '03Occupation: CCU Joined: Aug '02; Posts: 572; Likes: 6Hasn't reached critical mass yet, fergus.
So I'll rephrase. If half the nurses were men, or even 30% were, I think the landscape would change...a lot. They are really not that interested in it yet as a political force. The numbers will have to edge up some first.
Besides that, you're just venting, that's all.Last edit by Glad2behere on Jan 8, '03
Jan 9, '03Joined: Jul '00; Posts: 11,351; Likes: 387That's an excuse. If ten of thousands of male nurses aren't doing all that much, I don't think they will magically start when there are more of them. You said it best: They are really not that interested. I don't see why that would change with an increase in their numbers, any more that it has for female nurses.
Jan 9, '03Occupation: CCU Joined: Aug '02; Posts: 572; Likes: 6It may be an excuse or a reason, but that is what is going to have to happen. Your statements to me say a messiah of some type is needed, sure would be nice. At this point men have not yet grouped together because their are different avenues for them to pursue if they become disenchanted, and I also think that males' choices are greater than womens' in nursing so their frustration level is not as high. That is why they will individually exit sooner when dissatisfied because they do have more choices.
Why make waves when there is an easier alternative? It is easier for men to bail and do something else, and I really don't think they feel cornered in this profession like women do. When the numbers of men increases and the frustration level rises as high as is womens', there will be changes.
Jan 9, '03Joined: Dec '00; Posts: 54; Likes: 1I'll might get flamed for this...but I think that it is true that the nursing profession would be taken more seriously if there were more men in the profession. Women are passive, passive-aggressive, jealous hearted, catty, etc...I think that this is so sad that women c/n stick together.
Jan 9, '03Joined: Jul '00; Posts: 11,351; Likes: 387LOL! I don't think a messiah would be a bad thing, but it actually wasn't what I was thinking of
I just think the idea that men would have made nursing more respected is a bunch of monday morning quarterbacking. And I think the argument that there just aren't enough of them is very convenient. If nursing still has problems when it is 50% male we would probably say there STILL aren't enough men yet, we need 75%.
I am perfectly willing to admit that I could be completely wrong in this, but I still think that nurses being 50% men isn't going to make a difference, because in the end men are just individuals with their own needs, same as women. And no matter how many of them there are, they can still leave and find those opportunities outside of nursing. The path of least resistance won't disapear.
We need nurses that are politically active, that are willing to organize as a group and fight for what they want, male or female. Well, till that day I will just hope for a messiahLast edit by fergus51 on Jan 9, '03
Jan 10, '03Occupation: CCU Joined: Aug '02; Posts: 572; Likes: 6I am enjoying this Fergus, what a treat! Your being perfectly willingly is enough for me ! But to an extent what I said is true.
Men are just now starting to realize that nursing isn't such a bad deal in comparison to truck driving or bricklaying or carpentry work. I will also give credit to ladies for having advanced nursing so nobly, I owe them. I also think however, that women being treated badly kept the numbers of women down so that market forces have had a lot of effect on nursing and some of those advances thus yielded are events of supply and demand economics.
In this profession, speaking for myself only, there is an inherent subserviant boundary defined by the role of a nurse. I have a hard time handling that, and I think other men do as well. I know I constantly have this tug to do more in any nursing situation, and I mean that from a medical standpoint, but am legally confined. Women have got to feel this also, but I think in a lesser degree. I think men have an individual drive and ambition that will eventually erode that boundary collectively, especially when the cross-section of men in nursing more closely resembles the general population. Hence, my statement that increased numbers of men will affect changes beneficial to us all.
HOWZZATT for some armchair quarterbacking?
Jan 10, '03Joined: Jul '00; Posts: 11,351; Likes: 387Excellent armchair work! Couldn't have done better myself after watching an NHL game
You may not know this, but being a female nurse has never involved the idea of subservience to me!!! LOL! You can ask some of the people I work with! :chuckle
The difference between your opinion and mine is that I think it is the "male" qualities we need more of (ambition, assertiveness, drive, etc. which I really don't like to call male, but that is what they are perceived to be) not necessarily the males themselves. Couple that with the "female" qualities (like collaborative leadership, consideration and caring) and we'd have some excellent advocates for the profession.
I am woman hear me roar