Curious what your school would do? - page 3
Ok, I am an RN and I work on a med surg floor. I onnly graduated 6 months ago and I know I would have had an automatic clinical failure for what I am about to explain happened at my work the other... Read More
Dec 10, '06Occupation: OB RN Specialty: OB ; Joined: Apr '06; Posts: 728; Likes: 133Quote from colleennurseI am in third semester- end of- woo hoo.. once we prove compentency, we no longer have to have our CI look at our meds, except insulin, heparin or coumadin. Every time I did a med pass with her, I knew my drugs, action, dose etc, and paramaters ( like BP, P etc) and could answer any question she had for me on the spot so 1/2 way thru the semester she told me I was good to go. Of course she or my primary are always available for questions or a double check.It must be a law where we live, because when I was in school we were never allowed to pass any meds without the instructor checking them with us first.
Dec 10, '06Occupation: Pediatric Nurse Practitioner & Nursing Instructor Specialty: 7 year(s) of experience in Pediatrics ; Joined: Oct '03; Posts: 359; Likes: 528I am a nursing instructor in a BSN program, and I can tell you how it this situation would have been handled according to our protocol.
If this was the first offense of any type for this student, meaning no other issues in class or clinical and student was otherwise up-standing, the student would not have been failed. However, the incident would have been written up with re-education to the student completed by the clinical instructor and with the course instructor and/or chair of the department in attendance. (And obviously an incident report at the hospital or care facility)
Usually during that conference, it is made Very Clear to that student that if any other mistake is made, no matter how small, their a** is grass.
I would like to mention that depending on where the student is in the program, they may not need the instructor present to pass meds. Usually this is for students in the last quarter or semester before graduating. Any other time, as an instructor, I am glued to that student's side until the meds are administered.
Dec 10, '06Specialty: 8 year(s) of experience in NICU/L&D, Hospice, and back to Mom/baby! ; From: US ; Joined: Jul '05; Posts: 812; Likes: 178mistakes can happen, although with medication administration...it can be avoided. she not only wasn't able to perform the "6 rights", she blatently lied to cover her tail. i would expect my school would show her the door. i don't have any comments on your question about calling the program director. i'm guessing that the instructor will take all appropriate actions.
but imo there is a difference in the caliber of students in a univ program vs a community college program.
thus allowing students substandard students who may not care for our profession practice, thus leaning to carelessness in the clinical setting.
wow! because i am not a bsn student, i don't care about the practice of nursing??
these students study really hard to be a nurse, and know they want to be a nurse and usually have what it takes, and thus are more careful.
do you know why i am at a cc? i beg to differ on what you insinuate here.
i have been to both types of institutions and know the difference,
so have i! the only difference was the cost! the classes weren't harder, just more expensive! i still got a's in all classes i took at unlv.
yes your community college may have a good nursing program, but generally speaking community colleges let in more substandard students then universities. i'm not talking about the in community colleges, but the types of students allowed into the program.
thank you. be careful of the judgements you pass on others.
i'm sure some community college students are superb, but the caliber of students are generally different. the mere ignorance of this statement has disproven your own point. i have 2 young kids at home and have managed to continue with straight a's (3.98) throughout my college career. the only a- i received was from a community college class, not from the university. i have money left over after paying my tuition to not have to work, so i can study more!
[quote]Last edit by Race Mom on Dec 11, '06
Dec 10, '06Joined: Feb '06; Posts: 391; Likes: 9Quote from colleennursethis is hardly safe nursing practice eitherThe RN had pulled the medication out of the pyxis and checked them, opened them out of there packages and was going to pass them, but must have been sidetracked. So she put them (they were in a med cup) in these cabinets that are outside each patients room, in a drawer and was going to give them when she was done doing whatever.
Dec 10, '06Joined: Jul '06; Posts: 9[quote=HealingHands327;1963673]Didn't mean to offend anyone. But IMO there is a difference in the caliber of students in a Univ program vs a community college program. So I was wondering where the student who made the error was taught.
I am highly offended by that remark. I attend a CC. I applied to the program with a 4.0 overall, 3.8 prereqs and got in as an alternate. All applicants that were selected had a 4.0 and then we were sorted by the NET test.
Our university here, USF, has been accepting 3.0's. They also have shorter hours than we do.
I don't put myself above or below anyone else. I have never posted here, but reading what you wrote, well, was astounded.
I sure hope you change that attitude before working with the "CC nurses".
Dec 10, '06Occupation: ER Nurse - Pedi and Adult Specialty: 6 year(s) of experience in Tele, ICU, ER ; From: US ; Joined: Aug '06; Posts: 502; Likes: 96Anyone else a little put out about the fact that this nursing student also LIED to her instructor and accused the RN of a med error? It seems to me that this kind of CYA attitude also gets into the work place with defense attitudes, some due to the punative attitudes many institutions have regarding med errors.
When (if?) this student graduates, will she report any med error she makes on the floor? Or will she cover it up, or try to blame the next (or previous) shift for a mistake she makes?
She used bad judgement in giving those meds - she really should have known better, but I'm really bugged by the attempt to cover up and lie.
On the CC/Univ remark: Go get your first job. Let's see you ONLY go to univ-trained RNs when you need help or have a question.... if you even know which nurses they ARE!
Dec 10, '06Occupation: RN (OBGYN) Specialty: OBGYN, Neonatal ; Joined: Jun '04; Posts: 728; Likes: 58I don't know that the student would be failed right away but maybe...definately would have a committee meeting I'm sure to vote about what happens.
Was the RN late giving the meds? If so, the student should have been asking but never ever take them and give them...if I were the student I would have asked the RN a few times (as it were getting closer to the late time) and then maybe have asked my instructor if we could do it to help out the RN since she was busy.
I agree never ever should a student give meds without the instructors consent and never without having opened them theirselves to know what the med is.
Dec 10, '06Occupation: RN (OBGYN) Specialty: OBGYN, Neonatal ; Joined: Jun '04; Posts: 728; Likes: 58Oh yeah...sorry just read back about the lie too...that would be a violation of the honor code in our school which from what I understand has pretty bad consequences. Yikes!
Dec 10, '06Occupation: RN (OBGYN) Specialty: OBGYN, Neonatal ; Joined: Jun '04; Posts: 728; Likes: 58Quote from leslasicI have no idea why attending a community college or a university would make any difference in this situation or any, for that matter. The standards are the same. Errors are errors, no matter where you go to school or the type of RN program.
I am offended by your insinuation.
I see your point there, I attend a diploma program and regardless of where the person attends it is still bad...I do agree that what type of school they attend is not an issue.
Dec 10, '06Occupation: OB RN Specialty: OB ; Joined: Apr '06; Posts: 728; Likes: 133Quote from jovno doubt! what if someone else wandered by and took the meds??!?!??!:uhoh21:this is hardly safe nursing practice either
Dec 10, '06Joined: Nov '06; Posts: 54; Likes: 18Quote from swtoothsorry i stand by my opinion and of course am entitled to it. i appologize for the original poster since this is a whole different issue. i don't know about other states but i know cali for sure, most schools has randomized selection based on low gpas.and also you need a lot higher of a gpa than a 3.0 to get into a community college program for one thing!!! you should really do some research before you open your mouth. very few community colleges if any let students in randomly, most require a gpa above 3.3 if not higher and work on a point system. universities let 18 year olds attend nursing school fresh out of highschool! like another poster said community colleges have the highest nclex pass rate in my state as well!! private universities have the lowest with state universities next in line. hmmm guess it doesn't really matter what the gpa is to begin with it is how well you are taught, although we cant all be too stupid or we wouldn't be surpassing those much better students you presume that are attending a university. . the difference is that some people have the money to go to a university right off the bat and well others like myself who are adults may not be able to afford the high tuition costs. so like another person said you should really change your presumptions before you get gobbled up in the real world of nursing!!
pasadena city college, all you need is a 2.0 and all prereqs completed. then you are in the "random selected pool of applicants"
los angeles city college it is a 2.5 on required courses. then once again it is random.
rio hondo community college it is once again a 2.5 with random selection
glendale community college is a 2.0 with random selection.
the list goes on. the point is there is room for acceptance of substandard nursing students in a a community college in comparison to univ. schools where there are more requirements. not saying you are a bad student or your school has a bad program. but with the some of the schools i've provided as my example, you can see how i came up with this point of view, and it is logical. i think the level of education and standards do matter. would you want such a selection criteria for our pharmacists and doctors? didn't think so. and so i feel the same for nursing.Last edit by HealingHands327 on Dec 10, '06
Dec 10, '06Joined: Dec '06; Posts: 757; Likes: 134Quote from leslasicI have no idea why attending a community college or a university would make any difference in this situation or any, for that matter. The standards are the same. Errors are errors, no matter where you go to school or the type of RN program.
I am offended by your insinuation.
I agree and am offended by the comment made. I'm a pre-nursing student, and I currently work with nurses of both CC and Uni caliber and they are all excellent nurses.
Dec 10, '06Occupation: staff nurse Specialty: Critical Care, Pediatrics, Geriatrics ; Joined: Mar '05; Posts: 1,783; Likes: 108The only substandard nursing student is the one with a generalized, biased, assuming, and judgemental attitude towards others who obtain their degree in a different manner. I'm sick of the BSN is the best attitude really. Can we please move on?