Was this workplace violence? What should I do?

Nurses General Nursing

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I am a nurse in an ER that can be (like others, no doubt) both busy and stressful. Last night while working a clerk (I'll call him "G") was talking in a very negative manner about another co-worker who was not there. He was also speaking very loudly. I told him he was speaking loud and that everyone could hear his conversation, that's all I said. This person went off the chain with no warning. He started yelling at me using the most vulgar profanity and told me to "get the F out of my F face." I told him I was at my duty station where I was suppose to be (he was not at his.) I guess that didn't help much and I then added that I was not going to be spoke to that way. I was upset. shocked and surprised but not angry. Then he said "I should beat your F'ing A55." I apologize for the language. I'm not a prude, I hear cursing daily but that doesn't mean I like it. I am just trying to relay the shock and surrealism that hit me and try to give you a glimpse of this persons mental state. After saying that he should beat me he started to stand and I thought "this man is going to hit me" and I took a step back while someone yelled at the guy to stop. I then removed myself from this mans immediate area. This was witnessed by several people. One who was quick to tell me that if this man got fired he would lose his pension.

A few facts:

-This person is nearing retirement age but is a big guy, much bigger then me.

-I've told my significant other that if anything ever happened at work, like G bringing in a gun and shooting the place up, people knew he was off and did nothing about it. I said this years ago and recently, BEFORE this happened.

-I have seen "G" go off on one of the nursing supervisor, cursing her out but not as nastily as he did me.

-This person is putting in 60 to 80 hours a week because of lack of help.

-"G" is nearing retirement age.

- "G" is a hard working, doing above and beyond what his job calls for and is always willing to help out and lend a hand.

-"G" is also very high strung and anxious.

I was going to let this go but my sig other was very upset when I tried to talk to her about this. She said I should report him. But I am not sure if this is work place violence or not or if that even matters. And my co-works frown on getting management involved in any problems. Now that I think about it, and I can't think of anything else, I feel I should do something but I'm not sure what. I don't want an apology and I don't want punitive actions against "G". He needs help and I am worried about my safety. I am not worried about being hit or "beat up." I am concerning about being shot, stabbed or killed. I am not a wimp but I am worried that I may be labeled as one should I report "G". But things are different now days. People don't just have words or even fight and then drop it anymore. You hear about someone coming back with a knife or gun and shooting up the place. And if I thought this about G before, I can't help but wonder what he may do now.

Should I tell "G" that if he gets help I will drop it other wise I'll file a complaint? Soooo, confused on what to do. I want to be sure whatever I do, it is for the right reason and not for any petty impulses or childish hurt feelings.

I've gotten some intelligent and thoughtful responses to some other posts so I hope some of you here may have some words of wisdom or advice to help me now.

Thanks

Irving

Yes, that is workplace violence , he threatened you. He was also interfering with the functioning of the unit. You need to report this to your manager stat.

Do not make excuses for him. It is not your duty to get him "help". Let administration deal with this OUTRAGEOUS behavior.

sounds like a toxic culture. ie, someone else kindly reminding you that G will lose his pension if he loses his job, as if that's your problem and it also hints of retaliation should that actually happen. Sounds like you'll be the scapegoat and most likely crucified while everyone else knowingly suffered in silence but will paint you as the bad guy even though you did everyone a huge favor. Which means you'll be the walking target for no good reason. Disciplinary actions such as the one you're contemplating should come from management - and if the history of his actions hasn't received that kind of change/action yet, it will never happen unless a change in management happens. Which tells me this type of behavior is condoned, and you're in no position to make any change without having your safety and reputation adversely affected.

My advice: treat it like water down a duck's back, keep it professional, avoid direct conversations with him and certainly avoid providing further unsolicited advice to him, which started all this to begin with.

My advice: treat it like water down a duck's back, keep it professional, avoid direct conversations with him and certainly avoid providing further unsolicited advice to him, which started all this to begin with.

Let this advice be your "consideration" for the guy's situation. It sounds like he is working more than he can handle and keep himself in check. Should another incident occur, do not hesitate to report him. He knows he has it coming to him, long overdue.

Specializes in ICU.

Report him. Regardless of how hard he works, he deserves to get fired, and he deserves to have trouble finding another job because of his termination. That sort of behavior needs to have consequences. I don't care how stressed out or whatever the guy is - he needs anger management classes, at the very least, and needs to figure out how to be a decent human being. We all get stressed. There is zero excuse for taking out your stress on your coworkers. I have been under horrendous stress from working two jobs and going to school full time, and I have yet to raise my voice to anyone, let alone make violent/threatening gestures.

Since the supervisor clearly can't control him, I would bypass your management and make a hostile work environment report to HR, who will probably be able to get more done than your manager.

However, if he is a favorite, do be prepared to have negative consequences fall back on you for reporting him.

sounds like a toxic culture. ie, someone else kindly reminding you that G will lose his pension if he loses his job, as if that's your problem and it also hints of retaliation should that actually happen. Sounds like you'll be the scapegoat and most likely crucified while everyone else knowingly suffered in silence but will paint you as the bad guy even though you did everyone a huge favor. Which means you'll be the walking target for no good reason. Disciplinary actions such as the one you're contemplating should come from management - and if the history of his actions hasn't received that kind of change/action yet, it will never happen unless a change in management happens. Which tells me this type of behavior is condoned, and you're in no position to make any change without having your safety and reputation adversely affected.

My advice: treat it like water down a duck's back, keep it professional, avoid direct conversations with him and certainly avoid providing further unsolicited advice to him, which started all this to begin with.

I am agog at this suggestion. This is a hospital, not the mafia. OP is not suggesting any disciplinary actions.

OP did not offer unsolicited advice. OP "told him he was speaking loud and that everyone could hear his conversation". That kind of conversation is NOT appropriate within earshot of patients, families, or co-workers. "G" is a loaded cannon ready to go off, and needs to be dealt with. OP should be able to report this without fear of retaliation.

I have been there, done that. I wrote up 2 CNA's for having a VERY loud discussion at the desk bashing nurses. I told them that patients, families, and co-workers can hear this conversation. They got in my face, told me it was none of my business.. Well, yeah it was. I backed off for the time being.. I had patients to take care of.

Then management got the write-up, then I was getting the dirty looks and suggestions that I better watch my back on the way to my car. I looked them straight in the eye... and kept on keeping on.

There is no place for threats and intimidation in the workplace. I hope OP has the courage to follow through.

Specializes in Medical-Surgical/Float Pool/Stepdown.

Do you have an employee action line where you can report what's going on so it's sort of anonymous but is also brought to the attention of the people that have more resources/control and deal with situations like this more often?

This sounds really volitile and your manager may be in the works of discipline but may not be either. You have the right to feel safe at work and even more so with your coworkers, let alone with crazy patients and family members!

I am agog at this suggestion. This is a hospital, not the mafia. OP is not suggesting any disciplinary actions.

OP did not offer unsolicited advice. OP "told him he was speaking loud and that everyone could hear his conversation". That kind of conversation is NOT appropriate within earshot of patients, families, or co-workers. "G" is a loaded cannon ready to go off, and needs to be dealt with. OP should be able to report this without fear of retaliation.

I have been there, done that. I wrote up 2 CNA's for having a VERY loud discussion at the desk bashing nurses. I told them that patients, families, and co-workers can hear this conversation. They got in my face, told me it was none of my business.. Well, yeah it was. I backed off for the time being.. I had patients to take care of.

Then management got the write-up, then I was getting the dirty looks and suggestions that I better watch my back on the way to my car. I looked them straight in the eye... and kept on keeping on.

There is no place for threats and intimidation in the workplace. I hope OP has the courage to follow through.

I've seen it happen too, with the opposite result. The poor lady ended up resigning. There are various degrees of herd mentality, and in OP's case, it appears there is a deep rooted culture there that allows that type of behavior. For you to stand up for yourself in an environment that allows it, or even encourages it, is a completely different system than one where the staff know one another, will cover for one another, and you're the odd man out if you tip the apple cart.

That's the problem with this site...everyone thinks it's the same scenario everywhere. It's not. some places are indeed like the mafia. Why do you think OP is so reluctant to do any disciplinary actions against someone who is technically his subordinate and is seeking advice? Is it his personality or is there something in that setting that is making him question his intended action? From what I'm reading, it's the latter.

I've seen it happen too, with the opposite result. The poor lady ended up resigning. There are various degrees of herd mentality, and in OP's case, it appears there is a deep rooted culture there that allows that type of behavior. For you to stand up for yourself in an environment that allows it, or even encourages it, is a completely different system than one where the staff know one another, will cover for one another, and you're the odd man out if you tip the apple cart.

That's the problem with this site...everyone thinks it's the same scenario everywhere. It's not. some places are indeed like the mafia. Why do you think OP is so reluctant to do any disciplinary actions against someone who is technically his subordinate and is seeking advice? Is it his personality or is there something in that setting that is making him question his intended action? From what I'm reading, it's the latter.

I do not think the scenario is the same everywhere and I am aware of deep rooted culture and herd mentality. In the scenario I described, I was the minority and an agency nurse.

I'm not going to try to interpret OP's reasoning.

He still needs to grow a pair, and deal with it. Better to go down fighting... than turn tail and run.

I would have reported him the very minute I was able. Document this, and report him before he shoots up a hospital. Come back to us with an update once you have done this. You said he did this in front of several witnesses. It'll be hard for HR to ignore this. Make sure you strongly emphasize that you feel your safety is being threatened due to the hostile work environment created by this person.

I hope he DOES lose his pension.

Hell that, if the same situation had happened to me, I would have just called the cops. Bypass the whole chain-of-non-command and done this after telling (no, ordering) the pig to grow up and knock the crap off. Ain't no one got time for that...

Just sayin's all.

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In what universe is it OK for a guy to physically threaten you and get away with because of a pension?!?!?

Reality check time.

How will you feel when he comes to work angry and assaults a patient for mouthing off at him? Or another coworker? Or a visitor? Or an annoying child in the waiting room?

How will you feel knowing that you had the chance to stop it before it happened but you gave in to peer pressure?

Think about that hypothetical situation for a minute, then make your decision.

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