Nursing Unions-what is the good,bad, ugly?

Nurses General Nursing

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anyone in a nursing union w/in your facility? what is the good, bad, ugly?

Same education. Same work. Quite different life results. Only difference in the men is where they live.
Yea, but thank God they don't have to pay union dues. Why just think of the hundreds of dollars they've saved over the last 20 years! wink wink
Specializes in Critical Care.
Yea, but thank God they don't have to pay union dues. Why just think of the hundreds of dollars they've saved over the last 20 years! wink wink

It's not about the 'hundreds' of dollars, but about the mediocrity of service. It isn't about what unions do for us, but what they do to the pecking order. My experience is that entrenching mediocrity breeds it up the senoirity system. I've worked in a VA union shop, so I know the differences.

What good is it to have a ratio of 5:1 if 20% of your employees deem themselves too superior to actually work. If you are trying to make your way as a new nurse, the extra burden STILL falls to you. And don't tell me that the 'less' senior nurses don't get the crap assignments. But now you have to do it with untouchable busybodies all over you. No wonder they say nursing eats their own.

To me, 'It's not in my contract' would be the most infuriating, anti-team thing a person could say. What I like about my job: the autonomy to do a job and do it well. When I take report, for the next 12 hrs, nursing is my job and my art. If I do it well, it is a kind of reward in itself. I just don't want people telling me that I can't do that job to the best of my ability because it isn't in my contract, or in theirs to help.

I can't tell you how many times 'shop rules' got in the way of pt care. And I know the game. Unions are great if you have seniority - they are your personal insurance policy to not be responsible for the responsibility that comes with that seniority.

But if you're a new nurse: I'd definitely go with a non-union shop as my first job. You might actually learn something instead of just pulling the load for somebody that already 'put in her dues'.

I'm not completely anti-union. I can see that, in some places, they might be beneficial. But you kid yourself if you think the cost is just your union dues.

And, in my current job, I have benefits and safety mechanisms on par to you. I work in critical care with a 2:1 ratio - by grid, contribution and defined retirement plan - employer contributes directly to one and matches 50% of the first 3% of the other, decent healthcare, 36 hrs is fulltime and OT begins at hour #37 at 1.5 plus 2 dollars, no mandatory overtime (our policy specifically says that mandatory overtime is only allowed if the CEO declares an external disaster, that the whole management team must be in house for the duration of the disaster, and that it must be renewed every 6 hrs. - in 10 yrs in the area, it's never once been declared), I work in a closed-staffing unit - I don't float, ever, and nobody floats in, by policy, Tx BNE Safe Harbor rule provides protection against unsafe staffing, We need 10 more nurses, tomorrow - and that IS a kind of job security, my pay is roughly equivalent to Calif pay without the cost of living. Cost of living adjusted, I probably make MORE (It's been 4 yrs since I made less than 80,000/yr and 2 since I made less than 90,000- granted, that is with alot of overtime, but it was overtime of MY choosing), all the overtime I want, but no requirement to do so if I don't, and several committees where staff nurses actually input into the design of policy.

And I don't have to worry about pleasing some heavyhanded 'tenured' busybody that doesn't carry a fraction of her own load.

~faith,

Timothy.

Specializes in Critical Care.

If the union has been your friend, run with it.

But its just not true to say that a union shop ALWAYS beats a non-union one. They each have their benefits --- and their liabilities. Depending on the circumstances, sometimes a union shop would be a better deal, but those same range of circumstances dictate the opposite, as well.

~faith,

Timothy.

Can someone please explain to me why unions are such touchy subjects.:uhoh3: I really don't care if the hospital I work at has one or not. If they do I might try it out and if they don't oh well. I will still work the same.

I used to work at the VA and I know what you mean.

People were always threatening to report you to the union.

Once I stopped a nursing assistant (not certified) from bringing "sterile" 4x4's and kerlix from the room of a patient with gangrene to that of my burn patient to save a few steps.

She said, "Get it yourself or I;ll report you to my union."

She also brought her knitting bag and took towels, silerware, bandaids, aspirin, and just about anything else out of the hospital with the yarn on top.

Once she complained to my steward that I was "acting white".

I've experienced the "Not in my job description" too often.

If nursees don't do their work it is up to management to correct it.

Of course all in the barganing unit are entitled to representation but if they won't care for their patients, sleep on duty, or take drugs then nothing can be done.

If they look like the woman the managers husband left her for - that is not a cause for making up stories and firing a good nurse.

If she reports an incompetent physician that is not a cause for termination.

If his patient needs constant care and he is ordered to go start an IV on another floor he should not be terminated for staying with his patient.

If a nurse complains that she cannot accept a transfer from ICY for ten minutes because the room is still dirty after she discharged a patient she should not be terminated for insubordination because the doctor is angry.

If he never documented pain relief on the PCA page and always documented a description of pain in the narrative at least every hour unless the patient was asleep he needs to be told that is the new expectation instead of a 'final written warning' preceded by nothing. Especially if the written notice was taped to the door of the unit bathroom to be read when sitting down.

contribution and defined retirement plan - employer contributes directly to one and matches 50% of the first 3% of the other.

Yeah ... but here's my question about the retirement benefits. Let's say you're put years into the place, and you're literally weeks away from becoming vested or, receiving better benefits if you're already vested.

But, management changes at the facility, they've decided you're making too much money, and some new director wants "her own people" in. You're fired, and there's nothing you can do about it in a right to work state. So you lose the retirement benefits that you've been working so hard for.

I hear you on the negatives with unions but, to me, "at will" firing is a BIG negative ... and I can't afford to take the chance anymore.

granted, that is with alot of overtime.

So what is your hourly base rate of pay?

:typing

It's not about the 'hundreds' of dollars, but about the mediocrity of service.
I think you missed the point. The five brothers with union jobs have retired in nice homes on a decent pension while the three brothers with non-union jobs are still slaving away with crappy paying crappy pension jobs. I think they would have been glad to pay union dues for decent pay and a decent pension.
Yeah ... but here's my question about the retirement benefits. Let's say you're put years into the place, and you're literally weeks away from becoming vested or, receiving better benefits if you're already vested.

But, management changes at the facility, they've decided you're making too much money, and some new director wants "her own people" in. You're fired, and there's nothing you can do about it in a right to work state. So you lose the retirement benefits that you've been working so hard for.

I hear you on the negatives with unions but, to me, "at will" firing is a BIG negative ... and I can't afford to take the chance anymore.

So what is your hourly base rate of pay?

:typing

Right to work states do not have rampant firings every time there is a change in management. As far as retirement plans, I will trust my own 401K, IRA's, and investments over a union pension any day of the week. Ask American Airlines and the United Auto Workers how secure their pensions are right about now.

I made less than 80,000/yr and 2 since I made less than 90,000- granted, that is with alot of overtime, but it was overtime of MY choosing),
I've only been a nurse for 5 years but my base pay is almost 90k. If I took call or worked overtime, I would be making the 100-150k other RN's in my union job make. Do you think the hospital WANTS to pay me this well? All the anti-union types can laugh at my union and I'm laughing all the way to the bank.
I will trust my own 401K, IRA's, and investments over a union pension any day of the week.

I get both the tax sheltered retirement savings AND a pension. Thanks to my union.

Requiring someone to join a union is like requiring someone to join the Republican or Democratic Party, or mandating someone join the First Baptist Church, it goes against the Freedom of Choice-Freedom of Association that I believe is an integral part of being an American.

I agree. And at the hospital I will be working at, I will have no choice. What bothers me the most is that our unions donate money--paritally MY money-- to political causes that I completely disagree with. Our last election had a ballat that failed, but it would have required people to either give permission or not give permission to have their union dollars go to political causes. I can not believe that ballat did not pass as all it did was allow people to decide how they wanted their own money spent....still scratching my head over that one. Anyway, I'm not sure what I really think about unions, but I do know that I do not want my money being spent supporting people that go against everything I believe.

Cassi

You may opt out of that portion of your dues. You only have to do it once. I would write a letter to both a local employee of the union and to the membership department or executive department.

To bad there is no place else you can work.

In a 1988 U.S. Supreme Court opinion, Communication Workers of America v. Beck, in which the Court declared that employees forced to pay union dues under the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA) do not have to contribute to a union's partisan political activities.

http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/olms/EO13201_PosterWithNLRB.pdf

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?navby=case&court=US&vol=487&page=735

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