60 Minutes Foreign nurse recruiting - page 2
The 60 Minutes program this evening will have a snippet on overseas recruiting to fill positions at US hospitals. I wonder what they'll say about the nursing shortage. There are a couple of other... Read More
Jun 9, '02Joined: Jan '02; Posts: 5,673; Likes: 159I wish they would have spent more time focusing on the reasons behind the shortage and appropriate solutions. IMO they spent way too much time focusing on foreign recruitment.
Jun 9, '02Occupation: Retired Joined: Jul '01; Posts: 4,288; Likes: 31I'm guessing that I missed it. Now the wife is watching "Batchelorettes in Alaska".
And they wonder why I don't watch tv.
Jun 9, '02Occupation: Worrywort Joined: Jul '01; Posts: 1,349; Likes: 16Anyone notice that the nurses in the AIDS CLINIC WERE NOT WEARING GLOVES WHILE DOING INVASIVE PROCEDURE
Sure,thier admin doesn't even provide universal precautions so what do you think those gravy 80 hr weeks are like?
Peeps scratches S. Africa off travelers list.
Jun 10, '02Joined: Aug '01; Posts: 892; Likes: 3I read an article a couple of months ago about nursing schools in the Philipines deliberately and intentionally educating nurses "for export to the U.S." The Phillipines is not a poor country who cannot afford to lose its' nurses to the U.S. Yes , it is a poor country. But, they have more than enough nurses to care for their citizens. The schools and the government are working together for the sole purpose of preparing the nursing students to immigrate to the U.S. The U.S. immigration Service is cooperating, encouraging, and working with the Phillipine government to receive the Filipina nurses on this end. Recruitment is not necessary. It's a done deal, once school is finished, they come here, (the ones that want to), and most do. Their government benefits because these nurses are sending Millions of $$$ back to the Phillipines annually....The U.S. is funding the schools, yes, your tax dollars, via foreign aid to the Phillipines, is paying for the Filipino nurses education. In the hospital that I work in, approximately 30% of the nurses are Filipina. Most of the middle management positions...supervisors, charge nurses...are held by Filipina nurses. They are cliquish, clannish, speak Filipina, never report one of their own making a mistake, as a matter of fact, we rarely hear of it, because it is "covered up", smoothed over.....they discuss the error ad infinitum, but the American nurses usually don't have much of a clue as to what's going on. They write up the Americans PDQ. And there's lots more on the way. The future of American nursing....in 20 years, is Filipina/Filipino. Many married couple R.N.'s also. Once they arrive, they plan to stay til retirement,...most of them.
Jun 10, '02Joined: Jul '00; Posts: 11,351; Likes: 387I've heard the same about the Phillipines. I think the real problem is recruiting from African countries who can ill afford to lose their nurses. But really, what nurse in her right mind is going to stay in Swaziland when she can move and make more money than she could ever imagine elsewhere? She will go to the US and send money home to Swaziland. Who wouldn't?
Jun 10, '02Joined: Jan '02; Posts: 6,855; Likes: 8,512G'day from Down Under.... They're recruiting here in Australia too for US hospitals. Don't know why! We've got our own shortage of nurses & it's quite a problem! We also are recruiting O/S for nurses.
I'm amazed at the post above regarding the training of & procuring of, Filipino nurses. Unreal!!...I think it's high time you all joined or formed, a union!!... You MUST protect your rights & conditions. Judging from some of the posts I've been reading on AllNurses, you folks are being ripped off & treated VERY badly over there. Seems to me, managements are bending over backwards for new staff, but failing to look after or reward loyal, long serving staff. Sounds like you need some kind of Nurses revolution over there! Interestingly, I'm coming across more & more Americans who have migrated here to Oz, seeking a better life. It's well known we live in the last true paradise on earth here, & it IS!!...
Sadly, however, things are slowly changing & the people in positions of power are making some huge mistakes. Especially in the health arena.
Jun 10, '02Occupation: Worrywort Joined: Jul '01; Posts: 1,349; Likes: 16I was dissapointed in the portioning of the story. The story was about the unethical(so what else is new) recruitment of nurses from another country. The story briefly touched on the reasons for the vacant positions and an actual floor nurse was asked the questions! That was excellent. How they ever got that by the suits is beyond me!
The story missed the point, which is the failure to fix those problems that the nurses interviewed brought up. I can't imagine the nurses not trying to discuss it, but I can see how it's not as "sexy" a news story as taking nurses from understaffed, poor countries.
There's nothing to stop foreign recruitment if the suits have found it to be cost effective somehow, which is a kind of fuzzy math that I'm not familiar with. Foreing nurses are a source of cheap labor for both the hospital and the agencies though and as the recruiter said "we will sponsor your green card" and other amenities.....................not much difference between that and a pimp!:roll The foriegn nurses will be abused beyond what conditions already exist. What are they going to do? The agency holds the green card, keys to their homes and has them by the ba**s.
At a time when the report that came out about the shortage affecting patient care it would have been appropriate to concentrate a story on the reasons for the "shortage" but the fix that the suits are trying to sell to the public is foreign recruitment .................I don't get it It is obviouse that foriegn recruitment will cause working conditions to get worse as nurses that are used to poor working conditions, low wages and lack of respect flood the workplace and are held hostage with thier greencards and obligations to the agencies. As PRN nurse stated, the phillipino(a) nurses are using subversive technique to entrench themselves. They understand our system because they were trained to work under it. The first thing you're taught in orientation is how to get fired right? They like what we have and they are here to take it. As Fergus51 said who could blame them, it's better than what they have now. I think that it's just a stategy to prevent the balance of power to shift as it has been.
Working conditions are going backward because of foreign recruitment. For some strange reason it balances on a ledger in the accounting office so the suits are going to use this.
Does anybody know if unions allow foreign recruitment at their hospitals?.........That would seem unlikely. I don't think that the recruiters or suits are offering union memberships with those greencards. It seems as if the phillipina contingent is already organized to do away with the competition and now S. African nurses are ready to learn the nuances of natural selection.
Foreign nurses are forced to compete for territory. They are going to be blackmailed with their greencards and desperate with fear of losing what they have. They will work under conditions that we think are unacceptable for much less money...........with a smile.
Unionize...............................What other option is there.Last edit by Peeps Mcarthur on Jun 10, '02
Jun 10, '02Joined: Jul '00; Posts: 11,351; Likes: 387Peeps,
We are a unionized province and we allow some foreign recruitment IF the employer can show tht no union member is available to fill the position. If we didn't we would be in really bad shape. This was temporarily suspended with the latest cuts to health care though....
Jun 10, '02Specialty: Clinical Risk Management ; Joined: Aug '01; Posts: 2,345; Likes: 75I watched the segment on 60 minutes last night. I am appalled at the methods being used by these companies to "shore up" the dam from the flood of nurses who are leaving nursing.
It's rather arrogant of the countries who lure nurses from countries that need them even more than they do. I'm all for bettering one's lot in life, but this is simply corporate piracy at its ugliest.
It's about getting nurses to come here in order to keep the rest of us from thinking that we deserve better...to make us think that it's okay for us to put our licenses & lives at risk on a daily basis & give up time with our families at rates less than what men without high school diplomas earn in a factory...to put patients in jeopardy to hold down the bottom line for corporate suites to get bonuses & a larger raise than the rest of the employees.
Peace to all nurses,
Jun 10, '02Occupation: lvn/lpn Joined: Mar '02; Posts: 62; Likes: 6
Recruitement of foreign nurses is nothing new. They have been doing it for years.
Phillipine nurses were recruited for Texas hospitals and offerred pay, apartments and phone. As time elapsed they found that they could not continue to meet their bills, send money home and live. To meet daily expenses many moved into together into a 1 bedroom apt. Many could not stay after failing to pass those portions of the exam that would allow them to be a B.S.N. here.
The practice of recruitement (hoodwinking?) is something that allows foreign nurses to come to the U.S. Other areas have a greater porportion of other ethnicities.
Many of us as LVN's were asked to take assignments to assist with orientation. Language, homesickness, climate, technical differences added to the difficulties. It did not eliminate or negate the nursing shortage immediately. It was not a quick fix.
Pay is a major factor stateside. In no other profession would one not be paid for the number of years in their chosen field.
All nurses would like to be in control of their shifts, finances, and delivery of healthcare.
No one seeks to investigate the total picture of said shortage. That is, many LVN's/LPN's work alongside the RN in critical care areas. We assist, teach, and hold hands, but as we are not recognized as " nurses" I suppose that we cannot be counted.
We have asked for a fair review for years, yet have not received one.
Please take time to think about the following statement:
Would you dismiss a combat medic because he is not a "real nurse"
I dare say that that would not bode well.
P.s. Yes, I did notice the lack of universal precautions in that segment.
Jun 10, '02Joined: Mar '01; Posts: 542; Likes: 44You are correct about each and EVERYTHING you said in your post. I have some personal experience here too and I can only say that it makes for a rough work environment.
Jun 10, '02Joined: Jun '02; Posts: 39; Likes: 1I would definately have a problem with the situation described by prn nurse. I feel that our agencies need to see what can be done to recruit and retain nurses here. There money will be much better spent. They spend all of this money to bring these nurses over. Will they be worth the investment over the long run? Or will they be a liability? Many of them cannot speak English very well. Or if they do, one cannot understand them. Will there be legal problems if they do not have a good working knowledge of our language? What about charting?
I had my son in the ED a couple of years ago to have a finger sutured. His nurse was a Filipina. Sweet lady, but I couldn't understand a word she said. At least I knew how to take care of my son once we got home in spite of not being able to understand her. I felt sorry for her other patients though. Her patient teaching must have been a nightmare for them.
Jun 10, '02Occupation: med/surg/ortho RN Joined: Oct '01; Posts: 2,617; Likes: 161Recruitment from other countries such as south africa is unethical and down right dispicable. My problem with all of this is, if there isnt money to raise salaries here how do they justify bringing nurses from those countries along with their whole families, supplying their visa's, rent, all moving expenses, bonuses, and who knows what else.
Also, according to their statistics,, 1in 5 people in south africa are HIV positive. What are the chances that these nurses, with no adequate precations arent actually exposed and just havent converted yet. Do we get to pay the bill for their care then, or perhaps is that part of their goal, to get better medical care in the states by bringing their positive family members along with them. I'm not bashing them for wanting proper care, but quit honestly we have enough here to take care of without bringing in others to drain our already shaky health system.
Considering their 1 to 5 ratio, what are the chances that at least half of those coming in will be either HIV or Hep pos. and how will that affect those treated in our hospitals?