Frustrating CNO process for IENs

[kakeru]

I'm an internationally educated nurse and have had extensive experience in nursing from my homeland and internationally. I'm on the process of assessment in CNO for RN registration. I'm also a new immigrant in Canada looking for a better future for my family and aiming for career advancement. However, ironically, CNO might have mislead me into a chaotic process of registration.

I was assessed to undergo OSCE through CEPHEA to determine if I have gaps in nursing practice. I am resigned that I will definitely have identified gaps especially in regards to Canada's nursing practice which I'm not quite familiar with. However, what ****** me off is that CNO seems to have no idea on how to help the IENs fill in the gaps. Imagine a friend of mine who recently been assessed with 3 gaps among the many criteria and after which was lost what to to next. She was given a list of colleges and universities to inquire from and guess what?? The were no particular pathway or courses available to specifically fill in the gaps. There is however, a bridging program at York university which takes 20 months to finish and accepts only 50 candidates per school year. Talk about the backlog of IENs who wanted to get in! it's hundreds or probably thousands! Other colleges offer courses too by the way, then you need to push through university. So in total that will take you three years to finish.

I understand that Canadian nursing system is different and I am most willing to conform with what is needed. However, it's really insulting to IEN's to pay for an OSCE assessment then be left without a clear tract of what's going to happen if we fail. No offense but I've worked for 15 years internationally and I don't think that I have to study for 20 months more so 3 long years to be an RN in Canada. Nursing is nursing regardless of where we came from. It's basically caring with few tweaks of technical differences from place to place. And personally, I think, it should not take 20 months or more to learn and conform with the differences. So frustrating!!!

[Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN]

I understand where you are coming from and before I came here I have weighed all the risks involved with our move. It has been a great deal of sacrifice considering what I left behind. And I have every right as an immigrant and I am religiously paying my taxes. And if ever I need to study I will pay. I didn't come here to beg or depend. I came here because I want to work.

You lost the argument because we are not talking about taxes the immigrant should be paying. You don't have the right to look down on the capabilities of IENs. You don't know what they have sacrificed and what they are capable of.

I am aware of OSCE in other provinces of Canada and that's what I thought the process will be in Ontario. For instance in Manitoba, if the college identified gaps in your practice, the college will guide you how to bridge the gaps. There is a program available. A very clear tract. From what you are saying, it seems that the OSCE was designed to put off the IENs. Well I refuse to believe that.

I would suggest good read on this forum. When there was a "Nursing Shortage" , nurses where imported , unfortunately many of them could not pass the CRNE even after 3 attempts. These nurses professed to very capable but could not pull their weight. It seems the Canadian Government attempted to assist these nurses, but many ended up leaving. This was at the expense of the Canadian Tax Payers.

If you just came to Canada and do not work, how are you paying taxes? Also why should the Canadians pay to educate you when your education is lacking? It seems like the Canadian Government has been good to you, they never promised you a job or profession ( they do not do this for their native born citizens) but a wonderful country to live in.

[kakeru]

Tell you what... apparently your government said the opposite. And any education was never shouldered by Canada. It's being paid by the IENs like me.

And I am working not as a nurse yet but paying taxes religiously. No IEN will ever thought of being dependent to your government. We come here to work

[Novo]

And do you think that's fair?the OSCE here in Ontario aims to assess IEN's gaps in regards to Canadian nursing system plus the many areas of nursing. Given this predicament, it can easily be inferred that the answers to the so called "gaps" are available in universities where the Canadian nurses graduated from. I don't know about your system in US but here in Ontario its a chaos. The process is misleading and we ended up being RPNs. And when I used BON I meant body of nursing or college here in Canada.

It's already been explained to you. Regulatory bodies are meant to assess your ability to safely practice nursing, they arent in the business of educating IENs. Perhaps you should take up your grievances with the post secondary institutions.

Also, you should know that there is no shortage of nurses in Canada.

[itsmejuli]

I love Google, look what I found by typing in "Ontario IEN bridge"

Ontario Immigration - Working as a Nurse in Ontario

This link lists resources and training for IENs.

[Fiona59]

I love Google, look what I found by typing in "Ontario IEN bridge"

Ontario Immigration - Working as a Nurse in Ontario

This link lists resources and training for IENs.

Aw, juli, that would mean doing your own research instead of having it handed to you by one of the much maligned regular posters who spread doom and gloom throughout the board.

[kakeru]

IENs came to Canada under the federal skilled worker category. We are not refugees whom you might perceive as dependents of your government. It was Canada's government who identified that there was shortage of nurses here and so we came with their promise and high hopes of becoming a nurse in Canada and live what we thought would have been a better life. Don't put off nurses from other countries because I'm definite that we can offer much more than you ever expected. It's not our fault if you have to compete with us with job placement. Some of us are far better than any of you considering the many experiences some of us have had anywhere else in the world. I understand that you are proud of your Canadian education and experience but that doesn't give any of you the right to belittle nurses from other places. It's a tight competition but putting off other nurses just gives bad impression to Canadian nurses.

[NotReady4PrimeTime, RN]

Perhaps we experienced Canadian nurses should simply stop attempting to explain things in these threads. All we get for our efforts is abuse... being labelled racist, negative, nasty and so on. What happened in Canada in 2007 and 2008 set the stage for the much more rigorous assessments now required to meet Canadian standards and that isn't our fault. It also isn't our fault that it takes as long as it takes for all the original documentation required by the Colleges to reach them, which then draws the process out some more. It isn't our fault that nursing education around the world isn't exactly the same as it is here, or that nursing in Canada is a highly technical and knowledge-based profession. And it isn't our fault that economic conditions have forced health care systems to pare staff to the bone so that newly-graduated Canadian nurses are having trouble finding jobs, which means no jobs for newly-arrived IENs, but you'd think by the tone of some posts that it IS our fault because we're pointing it out.

Let's say for a moment that the shoe was on the other foot and I decided I wanted to work as a nurse in one of your countries-of-origin. What would my experience with educational assessment, registration and obtaining employment look like? Oh wait, my rudimentary command of the language is going to hold me back. And my transcripts don't actually capture the 600 hours of supervised practice I completed 20 years ago when I was nearing graduation. Right, I don't know that I could read the instructions on the supply package because it's not in English. Oh, let's not forget that nurses are LEAVING this country for a better life somewhere else because they can't find a good-paying job. Sound familiar?

Personally, I don't care where a nurse is from as long as all the requirements for registration in Canada have been properly met, as long as s/he's capable of doing the job as well as I can, as long as I can understand what s/he's telling me about a patient and know s/he understands what I'm saying in return and as long as ethical boundaries are maintained. My workplace is very multicultural and I have friends from all over the world. Our potlucks are fabulous. And we do good work.

[joanna73, BSN, RN]

Why should an IEN experience be taken into consideration? No, you're either meeting the Canadian standards of practice or you're not.

If not, then you are expected to find a way to meet those standards. Also, the Colleges are not going to provide assistance when for years many of our locally educated nurses and the IENS who have settled cannot find work here.

If we had a nursing shortage, things might be different.

[Fiona59]

50years ago my family migrated to Canada. It was a time when Canada was advertising heavily for skilled immigrants.

Well, my mother's nursing qualifications weren't recognized. Told to go back to school and start over (and this was when it was hospital based). No way could my father have managed that. His trade qualifications were recognized but he was at the bottom of the union's hiring board.

It was not uncommon for men to migrate first, get established and then bring over the wives and children. There was no ESL for wives and the children only go the basics in public schools. Yet everybody survived and flourished.

This was before the internet and inexpensive telecommunications. But there was no outcry in the media. People just buckled down and got on with their lives.

I'm beginning to wonder if this IEN constant complaining is a result of the "me generation" expecting the world to be their oyster and to achieve what they perceive as the norm without the struggle.

[itsmejuli]

A little about me.

I'm a Canadian immigrant, my parents came to Canada when I was 4 yrs old.

I'm also an IEN, I had married an American and did my LPN training in the USA. I had considered continuing on to RN but by doing extensive research I discovered that in 2011 it was better for me to come back to Canada as an LPN.

My daughter-in-law is American and now living here in Alberta. She completed the SEC and was told she'd have to do the bridge program. She didn't complain, she understood that her nursing education didn't meet the provincial nursing standards here in Alberta.

I work with mostly new immigrants to Canada. Some were nurses back home, in fact quite a few of them were trained nurses back home. None of them have complained about how difficult it is to become a nurse in Canada. Nor do any of them feel entitled to a nursing job here in Canada.

One of my co-workers left her family behind in the Philipines 4 years ago so she could start a new life here for her family. She left her husband and 3 children behind. This year the family will finally be reunited. She doesn't complain, she's excited to have a new start for her family.

Another co-worker was a nurse in India, she left behind her husband and children to start a new life here in Canada. She hasn't complained about the process to be a nurse here either.

I knew another IEN from India, she has a Master's Degree in nursing. She came over with her husband and left her child in India. She has extensive nursing experience but she is working as a home health care aid. She didn't complain either. She's well aware of the process to become an RN in Canada and will do it when she's ready.

So please don't assume that any of the Canadian posters on this board have anything against IENs.

[kakeru]

Did you know that IENs who have longer & more extensive experience are being offered higher salaries compared to the newly grads of Canada? That means length of experience matters my dear. How is that any different with being assessed for entry-to-practice in Ontario?

[kakeru]

I wasn't assuming anything. It's the tone of some of the comments that puts me off. I just can't take being pushed to the ground as if IENs have nothing to offer. And not complaining doesn't always resonate happiness it just sometimes mean that they have no choice. Oh sorry there is always a choice and they choose not to voice out what they really felt. Well, to be fair, I'm quite aware of CARNA's process and it's what I've expected Ontario would be doing.