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Facial coverings effective?

Disasters   (5,122 Views | 128 Replies)

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Well thankfully we have something in Washington state now called “contact tracing” to identify the exposed persons. And roughly 1,600 DOH employees or US coast guard to enforce it. We also have a Washington Administrative Code (WAC) 246-100-040, of course probably meant for something like TB, where they can force us under house arrest or imprison us 😁 to limit exposure. 
 

For some reason our state looks more like communist Europe now....

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8 minutes ago, Thanksforthedonuts said:

I breast feed In public without covering up. There is nothing sexual about it unless the other is mentally ill. 

I was referring to my posterior (edit to clarify: as what I also tried to routinely cover).

Edited by moriahcat

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19 minutes ago, moriahcat said:

I was referring to my posterior (edit to clarify: as what I also tried to routinely cover).

☺️ I know you where probably referring to some ‘nether regions LOL,

I just thought I would share my breastfeeding practices as well! 😄

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Just now, Thanksforthedonuts said:

☺️ I know you where probably referring to some ‘nether regions LOL,

I just thought I would share my breastfeeding practices as well! 😄

Eh, I meant more in the metaphorical sense -- as in, only you can cover yourself.  But I guess it works literally too.

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BlessYourHeartt has 12 years experience and specializes in adult ICU.

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To piggyback onto your analogy, if a C.diff patient had an explosive bowel movement near you, would you be less contaminated if s/he was wearing pants or if his or her hiney was out in the open? 😉 I would imagine a surgical mask contains a great deal of respiratory droplets coming out of the wearer's nose and mouth. The ideal solution would be for everyone out in public to wear surgical masks to contain their own secretions and, thus, to protect each other. It's not being promoted due to mask shortages and due to the fact that you just can't tell a segment of the population "how to freedom" even if masks were freely handed out. 

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On 5/12/2020 at 1:29 PM, Nurse SMS said:

I also live in Texas, where people tend to value their own right to refuse to comply higher than the well being of the general good. 

The crazy thing to me is that the ones who are most vocal about refusing masks are the ones who, if you asked them, are the most patriotic Americans.  But those patriotic Americans don't seem to think anything of endangering their fellow Americans, and, indeed, go out of their way to endanger people purely to make a point of it.  

We call WWII era folks the "greatest generation."  What did they do?  The worked together, military and civilian alike to win a war.  People accepted rationing as patriotic, and planted victory gardens.  People had all kinds of drives (newspaper, metal, etc.) to help with the war effort.  People had blackout curtains, and accepted curfews and night-time driving restrictions, even when they were far inland and in no real danger.  

Now we're at war with a virus.  A virus that will likely kill more Americans than WWII did, and has already killed more Americans than the Vietnam War.  And these "patriots" are out there refusing to even wear a simple bandana over their faces to help save the lives of their fellow Americans.  We have become a nation that insists on rights, and eschews responsibilities of living in a society.  The fact that most of these "patriots" also consider themselves the best "Christians" is the most mind boggling thing.  I just can't get over the cognitive dissonance of it all.

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Emergent has 25 years experience.

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There are some cottage industries popping up with these facial coverings. I just ordered six from a local gal that is on our community facebook page. That way, I will have some lovely color coordinated masks to wear with different outfits. I can coordinate my purse with them as well. This is the 2020 fashion accessory that no woman should go without.

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8 hours ago, Emergent said:

There are some cottage industries popping up with these facial coverings. I just ordered six from a local gal that is on our community facebook page. That way, I will have some lovely color coordinated masks to wear with different outfits. I can coordinate my purse with them as well. This is the 2020 fashion accessory that no woman should go without.

If you are actually supporting cottage industries, sure. 

As I said, I'd probably only trust my wallet to Etsy, after critical review of the product's construction.  Going local is even better.  I offered to pay for the masks I was sent free, at least for the shipping if nothing else, and she refused.  (My mask is mostly blue floral, but the different blue florals all work well together -- my mom's is peace signs and flowers.)  

Again, I'm partial to the "nape of neck and back of head tie" style, mainly because it's a pain to even find glasses that fit.  Ear elastics, no matter how adjustable, just aren't gonna work for me unless I get a kid's size, and then it might be too small.

Of course, I don't coordinate purses (I have one -- LOL), or accessorize much.  Makeup is for weddings, funerals, clubbing back when I was young and dumb, and job interviews. 😉  Otherwise it just sweats off when I get busy.

To each their own, though!  I can see wanting enough masks to be able to wash them all if you *do* wear foundation, and not have to do laundry all the time.

Edit to add:  I've used Etsy before for chemises for my weird hobby of hitting people with duct-taped foam wrapped clubs (aka the SCA), so yes I do trust that marketplace.... at least insofar as finished sewing products.

Edited by moriahcat

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NRSKarenRN has 40 years experience as a BSN, RN and specializes in Vents, Telemetry, Home Care, Home infusion.

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Looking for the Best Coronavirus Face Mask Materials?

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https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/best-diy-coronavirus-homemade-mask-material-covid/

 

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Runsoncoffee99 has 16 years experience and specializes in Peds.

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What an odd thread. I really cannot believe a nurse would even make it.

In any event,in some parts of Asia,they have no problems with wearing masks.Some wear them year round due to pollution. Just look at South Korea and Japan. I wonder if the custom of wearing masks contributed to their lower infection numbers,even if by a small percentage?

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CrunchRN has 25 years experience as a ADN, RN and specializes in Clinical Research, Outpt Women's Health.

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Or had the virus mutated by the time it got to the US?

Edited by CrunchRN

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For those of you still wondering if cloth masks are effective, maybe it would help to stop thinking of viral contagion as all or nothing.  Outcomes are not based solely on whether a person is exposed to the virus or not, but also on how MUCH virus.

Consider smallpox - a highly contagious disease that is deadly to about 30% of patients and disfiguring to many survivors.  Before there was a vaccination (from Jenner's discovery that the milder cow pox could provide cross immunity to small pox) there was variolation. It started in the middle east and China where a small amount of infectious material (powdered scabs or fluid from pustules) from an infected individual would be rubbed into a scratch made on the forearm of a healthy person.  If all went well, the person would develop a milder case of small pox, come through with no real danger, and gain immunity from future encounters.  It was obviously risky, as you couldn't guarantee how much infectious material was there, and some people ended up dying from full-blown small pox after variolation. Nevertheless, it was regarded as effective enough that George Washington had his troops variolated when he saw how quickly disease spread through his ranks. Even before people knew what a virus IS, they understood the relationship between viral load and severity of symptoms.

Back to cloth masks.  Cloth masks made from Joann fabrics aren't going to prevent all virus particles from escaping. That's not reason enough to declare them failures, though.

Scenario 1: Let's say an asymptomatic COVID patient wears a cloth mask.  Even basic cotton from Joann is going to keep most of the droplets in.  But not all. Now say some of those droplets make it over to me and land on my Joann fabric mask.  My mask will prevent some of the droplets from coming through, but probably some virus will get through to me.  

So, now I'm infected, but the masks haven't necessarily failed.  The virus starts multiplying, but while the viral load is still small my body's immune system recognizes an intruder and ramps up defense.  

Scenario 2: Let's say an asymptomatic COVID patient wears no mask, and I wear no mask.  Now all the droplets that would have been stopped by his mask, and stopped by mine are allowed uninhibited access to my face.  I've inhaled them.  

So, now I'm infected.  But in this scenario I've inhaled hundreds of millions more. Now a virus with exponential growth is starting with a high viral load. Before my immune system even starts its defense, the virus has a crazy big head start.  

Which scenario do you think is going to give me a better chance clinically?  Which scenario is more likely to give my immune system a chance to gain the upper hand before the disease attacks multiple organs in my body?

Cloth masks might not be effective at eliminating viral spread, but they can be helpful in mitigating spread and decreasing viral load when transmission occurs.  They are a harm reduction strategy, not a guarantee of containment.  We accept harm reduction in other areas as being worthwhile, even when we know they are not absolute preventatives.  We wear seatbelts, not because they guarantee survival, but because they improve the odds.  Masks do the same.

  

Edited by turtlesRcool

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