Excelsior Nurses

Sheri257 · Dec 6, 2003

Originally posted by lgflamini
Don't have to call- a good 25% of the Excelsior grads I met were at other hospitals in the area where I picked up agency hours.

Well, there might be a difference between an Excelsior grad who's been working as an RN for ten years, and an Excelsior grad who's fresh out of school.

Obviously someone who has already been working as an RN for some time probably wouldn't have the same potential problems as a new Excelsior grad.

Just as an example, in my area, the hospitals actually prefer ADNs over BSNs because those grads have more clinical experience.

All I'm suggesting is that you might want to check even further, just to make sure. Regardless, I do hope I am wrong and that it works out for you, even though I personally wouldn't want to take the chance.

Coldfoot · Dec 6, 2003

Does anyone have experiance getting or trying to get licensure outside the US with an EC degree?

jnette, ASN, EMT-I · Dec 6, 2003

Originally posted by lizz
Well, there might be a difference between an Excelsior grad who's been working as an RN for ten years, and an Excelsior grad who's fresh out of school.

Obviously someone who has already been working as an RN for some time probably wouldn't have the same potential problems as a new Excelsior grad.

Nope... no difference here. There are MANY Excelsior grads in my area and none had any difficulty getting hired on as new grads...

heatherbless · Dec 6, 2003

why is there a debate over this with ec? just do you own thing and quit puttting other people's choices down. ec has put out plenty of quality rns. you should just focus on your own abilities and clinical skills and be the best nurse you can be.

Sheri257 · Dec 6, 2003

originally posted by heatherbless
why is there a debate over this with ec? just do you own thing and quit puttting other people's choices down.

actually, the debate started when someone claimed that some of the issues raised about excelsior were "rumor and myth," which isn't true.

as far as putting other people's choices down, perhaps you missed this:

all i'm suggesting is that you might want to check even further, just to make sure. regardless, i do hope i am wrong and that it works out for you.

i don't think that was putting anyone down.

debRNo1 · Dec 7, 2003

originally posted by lizz
actually, the debate started when someone claimed that some of the issues raised about excelsior were "rumor and myth," which isn't true.

i don't think that was putting anyone down.

guess that someone would be me you did put me (and others) down and you are dead wrong that rumors dont exist.

i live in ny and already have my degree and didnt comment about the california issues at all~ just the general rumors about the program

i chose not to listen to the nay-sayers like you and complete my degree in this manner and im proud to have completed the program. proud of my persistence and determination to complete the program.

i spent five long years listening to rumors and myths and managed to sort them out and obtain my degree regardless of the massive amounts of misinformation out there regarding this program. so your statement is way way off and my "claim" is valid and comes from my personal experiences.

if you havent had first hand experience with this topic then please dont comment+ post put-downs.

your misinformation, put-downs, and negativity just prove what i have "claimed" in my completely innocent post.

i guess the first thing a hospital will do when a nurse puts a patient in danger is to see where they got their degree :roll

i didnt intend to start a debate at all just sharing my personal and first-hand experiences with what i will continue to call "rumors and myths" related to the program.

i researched the program extensively prior to enrolling, i knew i could study independantly without an instructor or professor to tell me all the answers and point me in the right direction.

this program is certainly not for everyone as i have previously stated but if you are an experienced lpn it is a good way to get your degree without fighting/waiting for a seat in a nursing program and committing yourself to a set schedule of classes.

empty wagons rattle the loudest

Sheri257 · Dec 7, 2003

Originally posted by debRNo1
Guess that SOMEONE would be ME You did put me (and others) down and you are dead wrong that rumors dont exist.
I live in NY and already have my degree and didnt comment about the California issues at all~ just the general rumors about the program

First, I think it's very wrong for you to selectively edit my previous quote, leaving out this very important part, where I was obviously NOT putting anyone down:

All I'm suggesting is that you might want to check even further, just to make sure. Regardless, I do hope I am wrong and that it works out for you.

Second: I still wish lgflammi the best of luck, even though we view Excelsior differently.

Third: I mentioned the California controversy because your original statement questioned whether some hospitals refuse to hire Excesior graduates.

Originally posted by debRNo1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by NursePerson
I have been told that OR, ILL, CA, And at least 3 hospitals in Ut. won't hire them due to some of the student not having enough or no clinical experence at all. Anyone else know about this?
____________________________________________________
WHO told you that ? I do beleive it is probably just ANOTHER myth about the program.
There are so many rumors and myths that it really could discourage you from applying to or completing the progam. I suggest contacting Excelsior for any and all questions.

Why do you think California decided to investigate Excelsior in the first place?

BECAUSE THEY WERE GETTING COMPLAINTS FROM HOSPITALS

Some of whom refuse to hire Excelsior graduates.

Do you honestly think that the California board just woke up one day said, "Let's spread some nasty rumors about Excelsior?"

I suppose you think that California, or the five other states which either don't accept Excelsior or have put restrictions on them, isn't relevant.

Well, I'm sorry, but the actions of other states -- where other nurses do have to be licensed -- IS relevant to this discussion.

I suppose you think we should all ignore the documented facts, and focus upon other "general rumors about the program."

Well, that's ridiculous.

chris_at_lucas_RN, RN · Dec 7, 2003

Well said Heatherbless!!!

This thread turns out to be the only real reason I can think of to AVOID BB's--lots of loud horn tooting by people who are not experts, proclaiming themselves to be and shooting down the experience of others.

"I can see that you support EC" or words to that effect, in a previous post, is a good example of that. Who cares who supports what? Do the research and present the research. The whole thread started with a question that was based on a nonfact.

I live in a major metropolitan area. We are very short of nurses. Do you honestly think they are not going to hire someone who passed the NCLEX and has their RN because they went to one school or another, while they are paying agency nurses through the nose and hiring foreign nurses whose English leaves, shall we say, much to be desired? (Not all foreign nurses, not all agency nurses, etc. etc.--no pot shots please.)

And as for California being a "trend setting state," puhleeze! California is known for a lot of things, but trend setting on a professional level ain't one of them. (NY and MA maybe, but not CA.) California is just as subject to the political whims of whoever can make the most passionate presentation of the argument that leaves them and their interest sitting prettiest as the other 49 are.

'Nuff said.

EC has too many graduates who are successful in completing their programs, passing their boards, landing jobs, continuing their nursing education, etc., etc., etc. to have a damaged rep. And apparently the NLN thinks they are OK, and that's good enough for me.

Sheri257 · Dec 7, 2003

Originally posted by chris_at_lucas
Well said Heatherbless!!!

This thread turns out to be the only real reason I can think of to AVOID BB's--lots of loud horn tooting by people who are not experts, proclaiming themselves to be and shooting down the experience of others.

And as for California being a "trend setting state," puhleeze! California is known for a lot of things, but trend setting on a professional level ain't one of them. (NY and MA maybe, but not CA.) California is just as subject to the political whims of whoever can make the most passionate presentation of the argument that leaves them and their interest sitting prettiest as the other 49 are.

I never said I was an expert. I did actually quote documents and posted links to those documents to support my opinions.

Which, BTW, included information about other states besides California.

If you guys think Excelsior is great, that's fine. Excelsior students like yourself will obviously defend their choices.

However, I also thought debate was encouraged on this board but, perhaps, it is not.

BBFRN, BSN, PhD · Dec 7, 2003

Lizz,

You may have documented facts that support your claim, but you also have several actual EC grads/students telling you that they've had no problems with this program, and you're failing to listen to them. We didn't all fall off the turnip truck, and we all researched the school and covered all bases before we took the plunge to do their program. Your news from CA is not news to those of us who are currently EC students, because we were notified of all this way before you were- from EC, who has a very good reputation for being forthright to their students.

When looking at a school, doesn't it make more sense to check out their national accreditation and the local BON's views on them? Or actual graduate's views on them? What CA says about them doesn't mean squat to those of us whose BONs say they're OK, and keeping NLN accreditation isn't anything to sneeze at. You made assumptions that some of us went into this blindly, which isn't the case.

Maybe it wasn't the hospitals complaining about the EC grads- maybe it was the CA nursing schools. They would certainly have invested interest in not wanting their local students to be sending their money to NY instead of CA. You stated that the hospitals were complaining, but failed to show documentation for that. Therefore, you have to understand when actual EC grads/students discount what you say as rumors/myths. What is your actual experience with EC? You can't make broad statements like, "Hospitals won't hire EC grads" when you have so many EC grads telling you it's not true. We have done as much if not more research than you on the subject, and decided it was the right choice for us. Maybe you're failing to grasp that because of your own personal views as evidenced by the statement, "But personally, I wouldn't want it on my resume."

I'm just wondering why you're so invested on making your points that you're not listening to those of us who have actually been there, done that?

jnette, ASN, EMT-I · Dec 7, 2003

Great post, lgflamini...

yes, this IS debate, and no harm in it. Just because some don't comprehend or agree with Lizz's view, doesn't mean we aren't engaged in debate.

I just don't understand why Lizz is so intent on being so negative. As you well stated, it's not like those who decide on the EC route haven't put in MUCH research into the school, accreditation, BON, etc. etc.... we would be foolish not to. For ANY school, not just EC !

And I have yet to hear of anyone in my area even ASKING what school I (or my other nursing friends... from different backgrounds and schools) attended and/or graduated from. Your current RN licence is all we have ever been asked for.

Sheri257 · Dec 7, 2003

Originally posted by lgflamini
Maybe it wasn't the hospitals complaining about the EC grads- maybe it was the CA nursing schools. They would certainly have invested interest in not wanting their local students to be sending their money to NY instead of CA. You stated that the hospitals were complaining, but failed to show documentation for that. Therefore, you have to understand when actual EC grads/students discount what you say as rumors/myths. What is your actual experience with EC? You can't make broad statements like, "Hospitals won't hire EC grads" when you have so many EC grads telling you it's not true. We have done as much if not more research than you on the subject, and decided it was the right choice for us. Maybe you're failing to grasp that because of your own personal views as evidenced by the statement, "But personally, I wouldn't want it on my resume."

I was told directly by the Board of Nursing staff that the complaints came from hospitals. I suppose it's possible that some complaints may have come from schools, but it's highly unlikely.

The six schools I'm familiar with in Southern California all have waiting lists of one semester or more. The school in my town had to delay accepting 17 qualified students for two semesters because they didn't have room.

The schools aren't hurting for students so, I don't believe they would need to compete with Excelsior in the way you described.

As far as making alleged broad statements like "Hospitals won't hire EC grads," please remember what I actually said in our previous discussion:

The fact is, there are some hospitals who won't hire Excelsior graduates, just as there are some states that won't license them. Will Excelsior graduates find work elsewhere? Probably.

I also said:

In the end, it may not matter much with the current shortage.

My point was that Excelsior grads may or may not experience a lack of options, but I personally wouldn't want to risk it. If that point wasn't clear, then hopefully it is now.

Once again, I wish you the best of luck, and I do hope that ultimately I am wrong, and that it works out for you.