Examining each other?

cherokeesummer · Sep 23, 2004

Have you been told for sure that everyone will be in the same room? The reason I ask is because we also did Head to Toe Physicals on each other and were able to wear underwear and a gown or a bra and shorts, etc...

We did it in groups of 2, with our partners and about three groups in the lab at a time. Then when we did the final check off it was just 2 partners and a teacher.

I agree that it is a personal issue when in front of the whole class because in reality you will be working on patients, that you may not see but once or twice and you won't have 30 other bystanders in most cases...

I would see if others agree adn get some clarification from the teacher.

whatnext · Sep 23, 2004

Our Health Assessment class also requires us to examine each other, but we are able to get in groups of 2 or 3 and use dividers between the beds so we have some privacy. I would think you would also be offered some sort of privacy. So far we haven't had to do much more than lift up our shirts and unbutton the top of our pants, but I don't know what will come next. This is my first semester and it's filled with lots of surprises. Good luck.

stressgal, RN · Sep 24, 2004

Just a funny story to pass on. One of my instructors (male) is working on his Practitioner courses. He was required to do a pelvic exam on his female professor as a final. I will not be able to object to anything until I can top that!

Hang in there.

Trauma Columnist · Sep 24, 2004

Does anyone protest this sort of nonsense? I just sit here with my mouth hanging open that students do this sort of thing. Examining a cooperative and healthy fellow student is nothing like doing it in on a patient. I just can't imagine this "nurse play" as being beneficial. Am I the only one on this BB to feel this is a true privacy invasion?

All_Smiles_RN · Sep 24, 2004

I'm with you Trauma. In my class, we did head to toe assessment, but fully clothed. We manuevered the stethescope (sometimes under the shirt) for apical pulse, removed shoes for pedal pulses, pushed up pant legs when checking for edema and clotting, and ausculated lung sounds through the shirt. I learned just fine without stripping down. Abr, I'm sorry you're in a situation like this. Hopefully you and your classmates can come to some sort of compromise with your instructor.

...Jennifer...

abr · Sep 24, 2004

Thanks everyone.

I do feel this is an invasion of my privacy. I've talked to quite a few of my classmates & they all feel the same way. We've decided to refuse to do this. We are willing to agree to get into shorts & t-shirts (tank tops). I actually talked to my pharmacology prof & she said that if we approached the prof & told her we were uncomfortable with the sports bra that there was no reason for her to not allow us to just do tshirts.

I fully understand not wanting in lots of layers of clothing. I'm willing to compromise, just not strip down to a bra in front of everyone.

Plus it's only this prof. The other health assesment profs are not requiring this of their students.

I'll let ya'll know how it goes next week.

J. B. · Sep 24, 2004

Thanks everyone.
I do feel this is an invasion of my privacy. I've talked to quite a few of my classmates & they all feel the same way. We've decided to refuse to do this. We are willing to agree to get into shorts & t-shirts (tank tops). I actually talked to my pharmacology prof & she said that if we approached the prof & told her we were uncomfortable with the sports bra that there was no reason for her to not allow us to just do tshirts.
I fully understand not wanting in lots of layers of clothing. I'm willing to compromise, just not strip down to a bra in front of everyone.
Plus it's only this prof. The other health assesment profs are not requiring this of their students.
I'll let ya'll know how it goes next week.

I will never forget my sponge bath

RedSox33RN · Sep 24, 2004

I'm appalled by it. I wouldn't do it. The "worst" we have to do is wear shorts and a t-shirt to lab some days for a "pretend" sponge bath. That was over with last week though, and all we had to do this week was wear comfy clothes to do range-of-motion exercises in.

No way no how, would I be in a bra in front of 17 strangers, not including instructors, in my lab. It is a terrible invasion of privacy, but the anxiety factor alone for most people would be enough to cause illness - stomach, GI problems, headaches, etc.

From what we learned in our Fundamentals book, assault is the threat of making someone do something they don't want to do - "If you don't participate in this class assignment with shorts and a bra, I'll give you and F and you won't pass." Not that they SAID that to you, but is the implication there? That's just wrong. As far as I know, no nursing school I ever applied to said in their requirements that students had to examine each other half-naked. Not on any syllabus I've seen either.

I'd file a complaint, either formally or informally.

mlolsonny · Sep 24, 2004

We didn't have to strip down, but did have to do cardiac assessment with the stethoscope under the shirt and auscultate lung sounds the same way. We didn't have to do breast exams, though.

I'm already an LPN, going on through an accelerated program, but if we can't be professional with our fellow students, how can we be professional with our first REAL patient? I'm not trying to gloss over the fact that it is uncomfortable, but we are viewing the body objectively, as professionals.

We had two males in our class of 39 students. One in each lab section, so the males got female partners. I think this says something about empathy... We have to be willing to put ourselves in our clients' shoes, as uncomfortable as it may be.

I think it's also OK to say at this time, no one enjoys a physical assessment, neither client, nor nurse. It's uncomfortable. And after being an LPN for almost two years and a CNA for two years before that, whenever I have to do a skin audit on an A&O pt, I'm still uncomfortable. I'd rather assist with a shower or AM/HS cares, to audit without being obvious about it.

Roland · Sep 24, 2004

I just think there is a fundamental difference between working with patients and with fellow students. You have to see students everyday in class often throughout the rest of your nursing education (and in some cases nursing career). I don't think twice about my doctor doing a prostate exam, but if I had to go to class with the guy it would be a problem (for me). Honestly, if it were an option I would choose a hundred scarring lashings on the back with a whip until my flesh was reduced to hamburger, or being shot in the groin with a 38 caliber bullet over having to be exposed in front of class mates. Unfortunately, it's not an option and my wife and son are counting on my success so I will do whatever it takes. I just don't think that younger "attractive" people understand how older "fatter" people feel about this sort of thing (especially older fatter people who used to be buff, and enjoy lying to themselves as a coping mechanism about just how out of shape they are!). In my case I am so self concious about my weight that I avoid all of my older friends and family who knew me when I was younger. I will do this, but I resent doing it and find it to be an exercise in cruelty.

ana115 · Sep 24, 2004

Just a funny story to pass on. One of my instructors (male) is working on his Practitioner courses. He was required to do a pelvic exam on his female professor as a final. I will not be able to object to anything until I can top that!
Hang in there.

OMG!!!! :imbar