End of the Nursing Shortage

Jo Dirt · Nov 13, 2008

There's no shortage of nurses. Factories are closing, everyone and his brother is going to nursing school, and it's becoming increasingly easy to do. The schools are churning out nurses like there is no tomorrow.

I work with a nurse in her 50's who is a recent graduate of an LPN program. The only reason she became a nurse is because the factory she worked at more than 20 years shut down, and she frequently complains of the work load. She has no idea what rough times are like at this nursing home (she's been there less than 6 months). I can't see her staying with this job, the way she complains now when she has to do a little something extra, and even though I have seniority I had to be flexible enough to float because she will only work one hall.

Nursing is a hard way to make a living. A lot of people aren't cut out for it.

Flightline, BSN, RN · Nov 13, 2008

Nursing is a hard way to make a living. A lot of people aren't cut out for it.

This is the one thing my wife mentioned as well when we were at dinner. It might seem easy as it is presented (Make 35 an hour with only an associates degree!) but that isn't the reality.

Nursing school is very hard; it can't be done in 2 years. Most people finish every single other prerequisit prior to starting the nursing school portion. It's a stressful job that exposes people to the worst of humanity and many people who try it won't be able to hack it.

Nonetheless, I do believe this economy is going to bring nurses out of the woodwork and back into the application lines.

catfish1 · Nov 13, 2008

After 15yrs. as an LPN, I went back to school for my RN degree.The main reason was as an RN I could get a job anywhere. That is not true. Since becoming an RN in May, the only job I had was a H.H. position and in Oct. they closed our office. Since then I have yet to find a job. If you can't get hired as a new grad,then you must have at least 1yr. exp. Sometimes, I wished I'd stayed an LPN since in my area thats all there is. I'm getting more and more discouraged everyday as my bills continue to pile up.

chevyv, BSN, RN · Nov 13, 2008

I agree that most nursing programs lose so many students that it should help a bit.

I understand the baby boomers might work longer, but many are in their 60's now and I haven't seen one in my 4 years of clinicals on med surg (unless it was in management). Nursing has always cycled and will continue to do so. With so many turning to nursing now, I wish them luck as they wait on the list and begin their prereqs. Many will fall out by the time their number comes up.

Keepstanding, ASN, RN · Nov 13, 2008

everyone seems to be turning to nursing. i remember way back when (5 years ago) when nursing was a calling. there were still other jobs a person could do and make a living--like heating and air conditioning. now nursing is a lifeboat--a recesion-proof job that anyone and everyone is considering.
i see post after post in here of people who have no experience, no particular desire, and no particular aptitude for nursing inquiring about nursing as a job. they need something to pay the bills. i just went to a restaurant tonight, and two of our waiters are starting nursing school.
let's face it, with the coming depression, nursing wages are attractive. so here's a prediction, please tell me if you agree or disagree:
nursing boards will start requiring a 4-year degree to sit for the nclex.
the nursing shortage is going to end in about 3 years; in five there will be a glut of nurses and getting a job will be about like getting a job as an np is now.
travel agencies will cease to exist and agency nursing will go the way of the way of the dinosaur.
without unions, hospitals will force nurses to take about 14 patients a shift and will simply fire those who won't do it.
what do you think?

who say's we are going into a depression ??

cecsix · Nov 13, 2008

will we have another depression? it probably depends on interpretation. here's what i found with a quick google:

question: what is a depression?

answer: a depression is a severe economic downturn that lasts several years. fortunately, the u.s. economy has not experienced a depression since [color=#3366cc]the great depression of 1929, which lasted ten years. the gdp growth rates were of a magnitude not seen since:

1930 -8.6%
1931 -6.4%
1932 -13%
1933 -1.3%.

during the depression, unemployment was 25% and wages (for those who still had jobs) fell 42%. total u.s. economic output fell from $103 to $55 billion and world trade plummeted 65% as measured in dollars.

the depression was aggravated by poor monetary policy. instead of pumping money into the economy, and increasing the money supply, the fed allowed the money supply to fall 30%. the "new deal" created many government programs to end the depression, but government programs alone could not end it. unemployment remained in the double-digits until 1941, when the u.s. entry into world war ii created defense-related jobs.

we probably won't see a depression like that again, simply because the government has learned how to avoid it. many laws and government agencies were put in place because of the great depression with the express purpose of preventing that type of cataclysmic economic pain.

HouTx, BSN, MSN, EdD · Nov 13, 2008

Wow! what a great thread. Thanks Flightline.

The numbers don't lie. There are not enough nurses to meet healthcare requirements today. Nursing has one of the highest 'participation rates' of any profession. The majority of those 500,000 non-working urses that were mentioned in an earlier post are probably not able to work; inactive too long, physical limitations, fully occupied with other responsibilities, etc.

That being said - since there is no Federal mandate on the use of nursing resources - it is strictly up to each employer how they decide to use us. Allocation decisions - how many positions, how many 'extra' tasks to give nurses, etc. are up to the employer Even in regulated environments - employers simply eliminate ancillary positions and give more work to the nurses. So - if employers decide not to hire nurses, there may be an excess number of nurses in a particular area..... not because they aren't needed, but because the jobs have gone away.

In some cases, I believe that the job downturns are linked to actual decreases in volume - like in Galveston, where they are getting ready to cut loose about half their nurses because the hospital is essentially still non-functional since hurricane Ike. But, I really think that this will all cycle back with a vengance as delayed primary care results in higher levels of emergency and critical care.

In the meantime - where is our Federal bailout? If Congress can pony up $250 billion for banks and soon (I'll bet) a few more billion for auto manufacturers - why can't they come up with some $ to help this problem?

Hey, a gal can dream.

heron, ASN, RN · Nov 13, 2008

I can't speak with authority about the current economic situation ... from what I've read it's unprecedented and thus hard to predict what's going to happen in the next bunch of years.

However, if the past 36 years are any indication, there's a cycle in nursing just like any other business. With the pressures to return to nursing to make the bills, it's no surprise that jobs for new grads are scarce ... it's still a seller's market in some places, but cities like Boston, NYC etc are definitely seeing a glut.

But I believe that reality will set in soon enough. For one thing, even though older nurses like myself are apt to continue working past retirement age, we'll still need more health care as we age. Even full-timers like myself are likely to switch to less physically demanding jobs if possible.

Although the possibility of a good paycheck is a valid motivator for looking into nursing, you're gonna hafta find something to care about in the work itself or you're gonna bug out or die young from the stress of doing something you hate. Bedside nursing is HARD, no matter what the setting and I fear that a lot of newbies are coming in with unrealistic expectations. Does anyone have the real numbers on the attrition rate in the first five years or so?

PreRN Katie · Nov 13, 2008

Everyone seems to be turning to nursing. I remember way back when (5 years ago) when nursing was a calling. There were still other jobs a person could do and make a living--like heating and air conditioning. Now nursing is a lifeboat--a recesion-proof job that anyone and everyone is considering.
I see post after post in here of people who have no experience, no particular desire, and no particular aptitude for nursing inquiring about nursing as a job. They need something to pay the bills. I just went to a restaurant tonight, and two of our waiters are starting nursing school.
Let's face it, with the coming depression, nursing wages are attractive. So here's a prediction, please tell me if you agree or disagree:
Nursing boards will start requiring a 4-year degree to sit for the NCLEX.
The Nursing shortage is going to end in about 3 years; in five there will be a glut of nurses and getting a job will be about like getting a job as an NP is now.
Travel agencies will cease to exist and agency nursing will go the way of the way of the dinosaur.
Without unions, hospitals will force nurses to take about 14 patients a shift and will simply fire those who won't do it.
What do you think?

I don't know about your area, but in mine it is very hard to get into an RN program. I'm only just starting nursing school but I've spend the past 2+ years working my butt off in prereqs to get the grades I needed to be admitted. Nursing IS a calling for me, and it always has been. I was just too scared and unsure when I was younger to really push for it and do the work necessary to make it. Now I'm older and wiser, and more prepared to handle the challenges I face in nursing school and working as a nurse. I had a good job and a 4 year degree, so this is not just a way of putting food on the table for me. I'm sure for some people it is, but you would find that in any profession. I think people who are just trying to get a quick, guaranteed job won't be able to handle the work necessary, and will probably be surprised when they graduate and may have a tough time finding employment.

Don't give up on all of us nursing students, some of us really are doing this for the right reasons.

CrusadersFan · Nov 13, 2008

This is an issue I've thought about for several weeks recently as I decide whether or not the seek an EC graduation. Here are my thoughts (and they are purely my opinon):

1. Nursing is not for everyone. Even if you are doing it just to "get a job", your ability to work with people will be compromised. Many nurses who don't have the passion settle for other jobs because they don't like the hours, the weekend and holiday work or the working conditions (10-12 patients, body fluids, etc.) I see many student nurses who call it quits after their first few clinicals because seeing blood or a BM in a book and seeing it for real are not the same thing.

2. Many hospitals, one in San Francisco that I had heard about, report over 25% of newly graduated nurses quitting within the first year, many never going back into hospital nursing again. Remember, there are insurance companies, school systems and corporations that like to have on-site nurses and nurse advisors.

3. With the acute shortage of hundreds of thousands of nurses nationwide, it will be years before the schools can graduate (and retain enough new grads through their first few years of employment) to hit the moving, and increasing, target of retirement.

4. While many cities (mine included) will go through cycles in which nurses are laid off and then less than enough exist, there are small town hospitals that cannot hire enough nurses because there are no local schools or many newly minted nurses understandably do not want to live in small towns. When they talk of a nursing shortage, these small towns are included in that number.

5. As far as traveling nurses--that job may start to decline but I don't think it will go away because of the limited number of nursing schools that are generally located in metro areas. I recently spoke with a friend of mine who is a consultant to hospitals and she said that Hawaii, which I believe has one nursing school, uses a lot of travellers--something to think about if you hate the cold weather.

heron, ASN, RN · Nov 13, 2008

Actually, I think looking for a quick guaranteed job is a perfectly reasonable motivation for getting into nursing ... it's just not enough to keep you there if you don't get invested in the work itself.

CrusadersFan · Nov 13, 2008

Actually, I think looking for a quick guaranteed job is a perfectly reasonable motivation for getting into nursing ... it's just not enough to keep you there if you don't get invested in the work itself.

Well said! There are many individuals who take jobs (or get an education) to get them by the lean times which I fully understand. I think it takes true passion to stay with it and to be successful in it. Nursing is just one of those jobs that you have to love.