Elizabeth Warren says doctors, nurses don't treat black women same way as other women

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You are reading page 16 of Elizabeth Warren says doctors, nurses don't treat black women same way as other women

Megarline, CNA

111 Posts

44 minutes ago, Tenebrae said:

The evidence shows that there is a degree of bias in health care ( in at least in my corner of the world) by being aware of that, we can be mindful of that and ensure that it doesnt impact on how we deliver health care to all our patients

Absolutely, there is a bias. They charge patients higher who can afford healthcare. (Rolling my eyes.) It happened to me. But there are people who have no penny think that nobody is good enough for their healthcare. Entitlement generation. The government sucks, according to them. Don't get me started with this one.

Specializes in Critical Care.
On 4/28/2019 at 3:29 PM, KonichiwaRN said:

And which of these studies can quantify the variable, "prejudice?"

The burden of proof exists with Elizabeth Warren. She claimed prejudice.

Now, quantify it.

They can’t because it’s BULLS.IT. ?

It isn’t a race thing. I’ve had stoic black And Hispanic people and really whiny dramatic white people. Those stereotypes they teach you in school are BS.

I look at my patients baseline. Have they been whining about every little thing? “Oh it’s a 10/10!” While laughing and eating a cheeseburger? Then if she says 10/10 I’m thinking okay probably like a 7/10. Still worth addressing, but yeah.

If I have a patient who just had a load of ent surgery say a bilateral neck dissection, and he never asks for pain medicine but the family says he never takes anything? I’ll try to talk him into taking a lortab. The subjective pain scale as objective is BS. I take it into consideration but I also look at their body language and history, as well as diagnosis. “Whole body holistic approach”

nursingpower

66 Posts

Specializes in Cardiac Critical Care.
On 4/26/2019 at 7:56 PM, Kallie3006 said:

Is it bash medical professions month and I just didn't realize it?

Don't get me wrong I do believe that prejudice exists but according to Ms. Warren, the only concievable reason for the increased materials deaths in African American women is due to doctors and nurses being prejudice. This is absolutely ludicrous.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/politics/elizabeth-warren-doctors-nurses-black-women.amp

This is not bashing. She specifically spoke on maternal childbirth mortality rates. In general studies show that the profession of medicine and nursing have not effectively closed the gap, especially compared to white women.

Our country doesn't do much to address healthcare, racial and educational disparities. In regards to how African American females are treated. Research support biases by doctors and nursing. So the application of ludicrous in this situation shows exactly why it will continue to happen. It's not just prejudice. It's racism, which implies a much larger impact...ie mortality, infant mortality, pain management, quality of life, disability, ability to function. So much research supports this, it should be common knowlegde

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/is-bias-keeping-female-minority-patients-from-getting-proper-care-for-their-pain/2019/07/26/9d1b3a78-a810-11e9-9214-246e594de5d5_story.html

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4843483/

https://www.heart.org/en/news/2019/02/20/why-are-black-women-at-such-high-risk-of-dying-from-pregnancy-complications

Specializes in 25 years exp: NICU, Mat/Child, ICU, MedSurg, Exec.

"She acknowledged the other known causes of outcome disparities and pointed out that even when we adjust for those known factors there is still a disparity, the evidence shows that this remaining factor is prejudice, which is a correct statement."

This comment is not intended to offend anyone. I believe that this topic has two facets. First, E. Warren is running a political campaign and is attempting to appeal to the African Americans by broadly stating that their medical care and personal treatment is substandard. This statement is intended to fuel anger and resentment. Having said that, there are some areas of the country where there is disparity however, that can be said for any ethnic group depending on where they are seeking care. Secondly, it fails to truly address the breadth of the statistics. For example, where does the person/s live, is the person/s seeking care in their own community, are there limitations on treatment available, are there poorly skilled healthcare professionals working at the facilities they frequent and what is anticipated by the patient prior to arriving at the facility? There are so many layers to this topic that it's not fair to generalize. I have personally experienced poor care in facilities that I felt comfortable in. As a nurse, It was easy to see that the inadequate treatment was due to a lack of skill, fatigue, failure to take a detailed medical history and trust of the patient. The later of which is more likely contributed to not having a relationship with the patient. Bottom line for me is that yes, there are differences for all ethnic groups, statistics aren't always factual..studies can be poor quality and/or manipulated. And Warren is being a politician.

NurseBlaq

1,756 Posts

54 minutes ago, Donnanak said:

"She acknowledged the other known causes of outcome disparities and pointed out that even when we adjust for those known factors there is still a disparity, the evidence shows that this remaining factor is prejudice, which is a correct statement."

This comment is not intended to offend anyone. I believe that this topic has two facets. First, E. Warren is running a political campaign and is attempting to appeal to the African Americans by broadly stating that their medical care and personal treatment is substandard. This statement is intended to fuel anger and resentment. Having said that, there are some areas of the country where there is disparity however, that can be said for any ethnic group depending on where they are seeking care. Secondly, it fails to truly address the breadth of the statistics. For example, where does the person/s live, is the person/s seeking care in their own community, are there limitations on treatment available, are there poorly skilled healthcare professionals working at the facilities they frequent and what is anticipated by the patient prior to arriving at the facility? There are so many layers to this topic that it's not fair to generalize. I have personally experienced poor care in facilities that I felt comfortable in. As a nurse, It was easy to see that the inadequate treatment was due to a lack of skill, fatigue, failure to take a detailed medical history and trust of the patient. The later of which is more likely contributed to not having a relationship with the patient. Bottom line for me is that yes, there are differences for all ethnic groups, statistics aren't always factual..studies can be poor quality and/or manipulated. And Warren is being a politician.

Black/Native woman here and there is a disparity and it is prevalent in all facets of healthcare regardless of income status and I can validate this first hand from my own experience and through that of my children and family and friends. What you just did is diminish the plight of those of us who are discriminated against and/or receive substandard care based on ethnicity. It's dismissive. Check your privilege. You can't speak for a class/race of people and our experience if you're not part of that group yourself.

And before you come back with whataboutism and more dismissiveness, I have family nationwide and I've personally lived in multiple states and have worked and been patients in those states so I can speak to the fact that what you just said was loudly wrong!

On 4/29/2019 at 4:00 PM, bag003 said:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1595019/

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0146000517300423

i could go on forever with the scholarly articles related to this. This is not a political issue, and what warren said was true. We are doing our patients a disservice (even if it's not on purpose). We can do better and the first way to change is to recognize that we have some sort of bias in these populations and listen to them

I think it's biased to say that everyone has biases.

Specializes in 25 years exp: NICU, Mat/Child, ICU, MedSurg, Exec.
4 hours ago, NurseBlaq said:

Black/Native woman here and there is a disparity and it is prevalent in all facets of healthcare regardless of income status and I can validate this first hand from my own experience and through that of my children and family and friends. What you just did is diminish the plight of those of us who are discriminated against and/or receive substandard care based on ethnicity. It's dismissive. Check your privilege. You can't speak for a class/race of people and our experience if you're not part of that group yourself.

And before you come back with whataboutism and more dismissiveness, I have family nationwide and I've personally lived in multiple states and have worked and been patients in those states so I can speak to the fact that what you just said was loudly wrong!

Don't assume you know anyone else's ethnic background by their outward appearance. I can comfortably state my opinion about discrimination because I have been discriminated against and so have my family members. Please come down off your high horse. You aren't the only person that has experienced a prejudice in this country. I can speak to the fact that what You have said is profoundly wrong!

On 6/8/2019 at 9:46 AM, ThePrincessBride said:

And not only that but the Irish were indentured servants. That is completely different from genocide (which wiped out millions of Native Americans) and generations of cattle slavery (which is what my African ancestors suffered).

I even had an Irish slavemaster rape my African ancestress, and I have the DNA to prove it.

My ancestors have been in America since at least the late 1600s and my miniscule amt of NA ancestors thousands of years before that. Irish people are very new to this land, and I wish white Americans would stop trying to claim that they are more American than anyone else. It is ludicrous.

Do you mean chattel?

Everyone is biased/prejudiced. Including AA's and NA's.

How can we fix this problem?

NurseBlaq

1,756 Posts

4 minutes ago, Donnanak said:

Don't assume you know anyone else's ethnic background by their outward appearance. I can comfortably state my opinion about discrimination because I have been discriminated against and so have my family members. Please come down off your high horse. You aren't the only person that has experienced a prejudice in this country. I can speak to the fact that what You have said is profoundly wrong!

No ma'am. What you said was bunk full stop. You can't dispute my life experiences. No one dismissed your experience, but you did exactly that with your dissertation of " well... blah blah". Other people's experiences aren't up for debate. You're upset why? The only person on a "high horse" here is the one trying to act like other people don't experience discrimination and called solid evidence proving that fact as untrue and claiming someone speaking on it is lying because they're a politician. Get over yourself!

Edited to add: No one knows what you look like so what do you mean don't judge by outward appearance? I'm speaking to the BS you said on this forum. We can't see you!

Better yet, don't reply because I'm not replying to you.

Specializes in 25 years exp: NICU, Mat/Child, ICU, MedSurg, Exec.
3 minutes ago, NurseBlaq said:

No ma'am. What you said was bunk full stop. You can't dispute my life experiences. No one dismissed your experience, but you did exactly that with your dissertation of " well... blah blah". Other people's experiences aren't up for debate. You're upset why? The only person on a "high horse" here is the one trying to act like other people don't experience discrimination and called solid evidence proving that fact as untrue and claiming someone speaking on it is lying because they're a politician. Get over yourself!

Edited to add: No one knows what you look like so what do you mean don't judge by outward appearance? I'm speaking to the BS you said on this forum. We can't see you!

Better yet, don't reply because I'm not replying to you.

Censoring the conversation? I am really not concerned with whether or not you reply back. You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine. No one is dismissing your experience or minimizing discrimination. Please be open minded to the fact that nearly everyone has experienced it in some fashion and I believe I stated as much in my first post. I did not say anyone was lying...I simply stated that there is a political motive by Warren. Disagree if you like but the truth is that that is exactly what she did and you responded the way she wanted. You say you have no idea what my race is but you are clearly assuming what it is by the comments you have made. Go back and read them. No need to argue the point anymore right?

NurseBlaq

1,756 Posts

1 minute ago, Donnanak said:

Censoring the conversation? I am really not concerned with whether or not you reply back. You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine. No one is dismissing your experience or minimizing discrimination. Please be open minded to the fact that nearly everyone has experienced it in some fashion and I believe I stated as much in my first post. I did not say anyone was lying...I simply stated that there is a political motive by Warren. Disagree if you like but the truth is that that is exactly what she did and you responded the way she wanted. You say you have no idea what my race is but you are clearly assuming what it is by the comments you have made. Go back and read them. No need to argue the point anymore right?

Girl bye! You literally dismissed the whole premise of people being discriminated against then tried to replace it with your own perception of being discriminated against. And you being nonBlack or Native is evident by the fact that's who you chose to dismiss. Move around with that nonsense.

Better yet, let me mute you and move on.

Specializes in 25 years exp: NICU, Mat/Child, ICU, MedSurg, Exec.
2 minutes ago, NurseBlaq said:

Girl bye! You literally dismissed the whole premise of people being discriminated against then tried to replace it with your own perception of being discriminated against. And you being nonBlack or Native is evident by the fact that's who you chose to dismiss. Move around with that nonsense.

Better yet, let me mute you and move on

You are far too sensitive and I see you could not resist responding. Still trying to put me in my place huh. Is it that I am not giving recognition to you personally as being discriminated against? Go back and reread the post. Try not to be so judgemental this time and acknowledge what was really said and then move on to a more tranquil place.

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