I wasn't sure where to post this question, so don't mean to step on any toes.
I have civally committed my son recently for depression, suicide attempt #2 and my new found awarness of his heavy heroin use.
I am concerned that Methadone may preempt relapse. He has chronic pain from a motorcycle accident 10 years ago. His addiction started with pain meds and then esclated to heroin.
His feedback to me is that on low doses of Methadone he can keep a quality of life that would be better for him. I don't know much about long-term use of Methadone if there is such a thing.
I'm just happy to have found him "barely" alive, and took him straight to the hospital.
Any helpful information concerning how Methadone works would be appreciated. How is a person weaned off of this?
Recovery is defined in this article as a voluntarily maintained lifestyle characterized by sobriety, personal health, and citizenship.
The article (18 pages) is an excellent look at developing a more precise definition. Way too much info to post in this for this forum.
In the article sobriety is defined as "Sobriety refers to abstinence from alcohol and all other non-prescribed drugs." The first thing a good addict would do is say "The methadone is prescribed, so it's OK!" The author continues on saying that research shows the best way to achieve and maintain recovery is practicing abstinence from all mood altering substances. "Personal health" refers to physical, emotional, and psychological (I would also include spiritual...but that's me) aspects of the individual and attempting to achieving a maintaining a healthy state. And finally, citizenship is living with respect for those aorund you.
The reason methadone is used is it's slow onset after oral administration and long duration of effect means less risk of a significant high (for me the "rush" was a major part of using) AND a significantly less intense withdrawal when compared with short acting drugs like dilaudid, morphine, meperidine and fentanyl. Unfortunately, the withdrawal is much longer than the shorter acting opioids.
Since methadone is an agonist opioid, it posesses the potential to be abused, as we are all well aware. Also, methadone has gone from a medication to assist in detox to simply maintaining a state of having opioid receptors constantly occupied. Easing withdrawal has turned into preventing it. Very controversial topic.
For a recovering health care professional, pilot, truck driver, etc...methadone maintenance isn't really an option. Studies do show that even though a person on chronic opioid therapy (cancer pain and chonic non-malignant pain) develops significant tolerance to the sedative and euphoric effects ONCE MAINTENANCE LEVELS ARE ACHIEVED, their cognition can be slowed and reflexes can be altered. Even if these changes are imperceptible, they have no place in a setting where that delay could cause injury or death.
I've got some great links to information on methadone. If anyone's interested let me know and I'll make them available.
I am totally on board with the above post. D is in an MI/CD house for 3 months, then he'll go into a sober living house. How ironic is that?
He currently is at a 75mg dose. I see him a bit more focused, but to me, mom, he looks very, very old.
We often talk about that "stinking thinking" stuff. And I usually receive a thanks from D once the lightbulb goes on. Not that I'm looking for the thanks: it's more that I have grown a bit as well and I can identify some of the old patterned ways of his thought or insite in conversation.
I'm still at a loss at times about being verbally proactive abput the Methadone Clinic. But it is not my life. I can only support what seems to be working for him.
It was very interesting at a hospital visit before the move to the MI/CD house. D expressed great fear about something so simple as riding the bus to the clinic. Being out in the real world.
He has shown alot of progress (I think) in separating the thought of relapse to the the actual step that would cause the relapse. He seems to be grasping that there is a defining moment that he can save himself and he talks about those options.
He has started beading to keep his mind busy.
He told us yeasterday, "gee I made my first sober friend ever", isn't that great? This is coming from a guy who 2 months ago said and felt he had no friends. Of course we told him to give it time.
He beaded a rosary for me. That is something special.
I pray every day that he'll get it this time and I know he is too.
His MI/CD house is next to a crack house. Can you believe that? So scary the other day while waiting for him to come out to the car, there was a guy standing at this "crack" building throwing a stick up to hit a window.
Happy Thanksgiving. I'm thankful that even tho D has relapsed after returning from work. He is now again clean and sober. He decreased from 175mg of Methadone by 5mg a day to "be ready" to RTW. Well his first paycheck he scored. He's no longer working. He is back on Methadone and has made plans with the adicctionologist and his primary, counselors and priest not to go so high up on the dosing, but rather include what he tells me what was missing from the git go his first time around.
His spirituality or lack thereof pertaining to recovery was a crucial missing part D says. I've never been so proud and relieved to hear him say this and practice remedy for the loss.
Thanks again for the support. May you have a blessed day and a bellyfull of pumpking pie!
:heartbeatI'm so glad your son is getting off the methadone. I never used it, my addictionist uses seboxone(temporarily) and vivitrol injections to prevent relapse. Methadone withdrawl is the absolute worst withdrawl to go through. Worse than any opiate out there. If he needs it try seboxone or vivitrol. You are a great MOM! :yeah:My heart goes out to you and your son. I will pray for your family.
I went to a pain clinic (still do, though not the same one) when my license was on probation. I was prescribed Tramadol, which I had taken preciously and worked great. (Couldn't get anyone to prescribe me any which led to me taking narcs from work, which led to my probation, but that's another story).
Anyway, the clinic changed doctor's and the new doctor thought I was taking too much Tramadol and actually wanted to DC my Tramadol completely and put me on Methadone, for pain!
I said absolutley no thank you! It was the stupidist thing I ever heard of. Why in the heck would a doctor want to prescribe something so addictive for pain, especially knowing I was on probation. He never understood why I didn't want to take it.
Ya know, I hear ya. But thru this crazy process and in my research and in talking with many others, addicts and family members of addicts, I do know this. Chronic pain, which I have myself (which is another story lol) is so individual . Each person has their own tolerance to pain and nerve receptors that it isn't easy to treat or suffer through. Your decision is highly respected by me.
All I do know is at the begining of this process, I knew squat about addiction, sx's treatment, codependency issues for an addict ( I specify addict for drugs as I grew up with an alcholoc mom and then married one and I got help, but the codependancy issues involving a heroin addict was so different for me), so that is why I posed this question to begin with.
Now after seeing D high,suicidal, hospitalized 6 times in one year through CD-Psych lockdowns and then finally going to the courts to have him committed, I've learned SOME! Not alot alot, but enough to know what was right for D and to believe in his FEAR of relpase and his desire to have a functional sober life. I've seen him on a maintenance dose of 120mg per day for about 4 months. Wanted to return to work, decreased himself at 5mg per day till off and go off to work, going through Methadone reduction withdrawals. Ok, he got his first paycheck and relapsed.
SO I socked it to him again and currently he has 4 months sober time from heroin. He returned to the methadone clinic and is maintaining at 90mg per day, still sweating, still having anxiety issues, still having using dreams and cravings. But he is attending meetings, has a great support staff of counselor's and addictionologists and see's a psychologist weekly to get to some underlying anxiety issues. He is not as sedated as he was at the 120mg dose. Yea to be honest he really wanted to feel comfortable without any work outside the methadone clinic work towards his recovery. This is D, not anybody else shoulda, whatever.
So for D I see and hear him and understand his true motive. Currently he is back into the production engineering field. This is what he went to school for. He has been blessed in being in the right place at the right time and got an edge for an opening with a national production angency. His very first trip out to the club where this company managed the event he was terrified.
He was so afraid of the socializing, being in "THEE ENVIRONMENT", and we really had to talk through some heavy stuff with this VIP pass in his hands. He was home at 2:15am from MPLS, which tells me he left before the event stopped. He was sober and mission completed he was able to talk with who he needed to talk to.
So today D was telling me my Dr. asked me: Will you ever need to take speed? "No", will you ever need to take cocaine?,"No". Will you ever need to take heroin? "No". Will you ever have the need to take an opiate? "Well maybe what if I have an operation or a car accident"? The opiate abusers I've learned have a heavier advantage IMO, I haven't researched this, Jack may know, to relapse. But if an opiate is needed for D it will be in a controlled setting.
I'm on a run here, so let me shut -up and just say that for D for right now Maethadone is helping him function better along with other help. He poses the question to himself openly, will I be on this the rest of my life?, or will I someday be able to s l o w l y stop the methadone. He's open about it.
I really use all of the feedback on this site to keep things in perspective for me. I recently posted I need to take care of me now and that is what I am doing.......But that too is another story!:lol2:
Umm...well wow!!! I have been reading these posts and what I dont really hear a lot of is...addicts sharing. I am first an addict. i am a healthcare professional with a critical care specialty. I have grown up in a house full of alcoholism and addiction. However, nothing has been more paramount in my life than going through and working through my own experience with addiction. The only thing that I have found that prevents relapse is the addicts desire to not use becoming greater than his desire to use. THAT and his HIGHER POWER...be it God or Good Orderly Direction, etc. is the only thing that will be present when you are alone and there is nothing between you and that first bag, pill or drink.... I have had my own experience with chronic pain issues and have tried pills, patches, and methadone. Lemme tell you that I used suboxone, fentanyl patches, methadone and all the things inbetween...but I always lost the battle between my addiction and my most honest of intentions not to abuse those pain medications. Nothing worked...until I was willing to go to any length to get clean and stay clean I would not be able to change anything. To me methadone is necessary for the medical detox of severe opiate abuse and for pregnant women (also medically necessary as the w/drawl is noxious to the fetus). However, if you are an addict...ANY mind or mood altering medication, drink, substance is going to lead to back to that DOC (drug of choice). I have heard many people in AA, NA and CA say...I regreted taking methadone, I have never heard one say...I regret giving it up and trying to make it through the 12 steps of the fellowship and leave the substances behind.
You most definitely need to let your son come to that decision on his own...how can you do that? Al-non and Nar-non meetings have helped soooo many family and friends of alcoholics and addicts get through their own CODA issues and defects in their coping skills by living and having an addict in their lives. I cannot stress enough that I have heard over and over again that ANY mind or mood altering substance does not make a difference to an addict. Our minds dont know the difference between prescribed oxycotin or a 2 shot bag of heroin...they have the same effect on our mental, physical emotional and spiritual life.... My personal experience has showed that it has not worked for me...and has not worked for any other addict that I have met--NONE--none who make sobriety a life long decision. I will admit that it may appear to work for any length of time but it always followed by a still worse and more devestating relapse. There are ways to deal with chronic pain without narcotics. There is a better way of life...onnly your son can make the decision for himself...you can support him through alnon and narnon...thats my experience...its not opinion.
:lol2:
mzloco
40 Posts
give up one addiction for another.......stay away from Methadone