Does it bother CRNA's that MDA's get so much more...?

Specialties CRNA

Published

Hey guys,

I'm not a CRNA yet. I want to be. I just got hired in a MICU/SICU. I was just wondering if it bothered any CRNA's the fact that MDs who practice anesthesia get paid wayy more for doing the same thing? I know some hospitals/facilities require the MDA oversee the CRNA, but does that equate to a couple hundred K more?

I don't know...I just feel CRNA's are not compensated enough for the ENORMOUS amount of responsibility and knowledge they hold.

And it doesn't matter. I suspect that there are plenty of LPNs out there that can match or best RNs on questions and practice. They still are going to, in most cases, going to be paid less and hospitals are still going to view/employee them a certain way, no matter the brains.

As far as competitiveness for MDA, if one wants to get the pay, go for it and if they work hard enough and have the aptitude, they will get it. But don't cry about what MDAs get paid, when they have done the work and jumped through the hoops, that you choose not to do.

What do you know about me ? I have a Dr degree ty! Their is no short cuts to me decade of my life in school that I have made.Who was crying hmm.

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
What do you know about me ? I have a Dr degree ty! Their is no short cuts to me decade of my life in school that I have made.Who was crying hmm.

The spelling police in me is screaming..........:o:sofahider

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Specializes in Oncology/Haemetology/HIV.
AS I have stated earlier ,I personally was test with a student MDA and we both missed same questions . When it comes to providing anesthesia both know about the same from my point of view . But it sure is a political storm out there, bad apples to both sides .Health care teams to me are a waste of money and all it does is save MDA's bottom lines.

I don't think imdscd had mentioned anything about money just the abilities between the two types of providers. The difference in comparing LVNs/RNs vs MDAs/CRNAs is that CRNAs have numerous studies that show we give equal care as compared to MDAs.

No one is "crying" about MDA pay, but before someone that doesn't know anything the history, the laws, or the research about CRNA practice (not to mention the politics) they should at least read the AANA home page before they jump in with both feet and start flaming people. Just my unhumble opinion.

First, you do not know what I have studied or read regarding CRNA

Second, you were not being flamed.

Third, my POINT was that original post was regarding whether CRNAs were upset that they made less than MDAs, and indicated that s/he felt it unfair when they felt that they did the same thing. I addressed him that then s/he needs to have worked for that degree, if it was distressing to him. Then s/he would get the pay.

And lastly, that all of these posters going off on tangents about requirements, and arguing about what one state does or does not require and this place or that is interpreting this- None of this has to do with what the OP asked or the price of tea in China. It is just bunch of posters arguing and not answering the question.

Now if you wish to class that as a flame, that is your choice. I was attempting to answer the OP. If someone is insisting on taking that answer and trying to turn it into a "urinating" contest, that is to them. For me, life is too short and time to precious.

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Specializes in Anesthesia.
First, you do not know what I have studied or read regarding CRNA

Second, you were not being flamed.

Third, my POINT was that original post was regarding whether CRNAs were upset that they made less than MDAs, and indicated that s/he felt it unfair when they felt that they did the same thing. I addressed him that then s/he needs to have worked for that degree, if it was distressing to him. Then s/he would get the pay.

And lastly, that all of these posters going off on tangents about requirements, and arguing about what one state does or does not require and this place or that is interpreting this- None of this has to do with what the OP asked or the price of tea in China. It is just bunch of posters arguing and not answering the question.

Now if you wish to class that as a flame, that is your choice. I was attempting to answer the OP. If someone is insisting on taking that answer and trying to turn it into a "urinating" contest, that is to them. For me, life is too short and time to precious.

Ok, if you want to get back to the OP then only two of us on here should have posted at all. The OP asked for CRNAs opinion...

The problem is you cannot answer the OPs question unless you are a CRNA. Are you a CRNA?

Tangents are not necessarily a bad thing. They open up a dialogue just like a normal conversation. It also gives some of us the chance to educate other nurses about the misunderstandings in nurse anesthesia practice that seem to always come up.

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Specializes in CRNA.

Carol, when a poster comes into a CRNA forum and chooses to inaccurately describe our profession, education, licensing and even our title....they are going to get called out on it. The original question was answered. I think the "tangent" was the most beneficial topic discussed in this thread. Hopefully those reading these posts will come away slightly more enlightened and tangents such as the ones you described above will not be necessary in future communication.

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
Carol, when a poster comes into a CRNA forum and chooses to inaccurately describe our profession, education, licensing and even our title....they are going to get called out on it. The original question was answered. I think the "tangent" was the most beneficial topic discussed in this thread. Hopefully those reading these posts will come away slightly more enlightened and tangents such as the ones you described above will not be necessary in future communication.

A very polite FYI.....the first post ended on the general board, as some do, as that it where I found it and I have learned much. I have learned this is a hot button item....much hotter than I could have imangined...had I realized it I would have avoided it like the plague;):)

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Specializes in Pedi ICU.
this is a hot button item....

Very true.

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My goodness...I'm having to duck from all the mud slinging...funny to me that a tiny little question incites such rage...if someone asks me if I like to beat and strangle small animals, the answer is no but I don't get my feathers ruffled beyond comprehension...I think it's a fair question about pay rates for some of the same functions...for example, if an ASE certified mechanic and a non-ASE certified mechanic both change oil in the same car and the ASE mechanic makes $5 more per hour for the same thing, it's not very fair...of course, life isn't fair...BUT, telling someone to go be an MDA if they want to make that much money for sometimes doing the same thing isn't completely fair...specifically, women have been known to make less money than a man for the same job...can we go and tell women to become men so they can make the same pay?...no, we cannot...this is why women fight for equality...this mode of thinking seems to solidify the thinking that CRNAs are lesser beings than MDAs...all I know, and trust me I don't know much, is that an MDA was directly responsible for the death of one of my family members and legal proceedings determined this...who knows what would have happened had a CRNA been administering anesthesia that day...

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Specializes in Hospice / Psych / RNAC.
My goodness...I'm having to duck from all the mud slinging...funny to me that a tiny little question incites such rage...if someone asks me if I like to beat and strangle small animals, the answer is no but I don't get my feathers ruffled beyond comprehension...I think it's a fair question about pay rates for some of the same functions...for example, if an ASE certified mechanic and a non-ASE certified mechanic both change oil in the same car and the ASE mechanic makes $5 more per hour for the same thing, it's not very fair...of course, life isn't fair...BUT, telling someone to go be an MDA if they want to make that much money for sometimes doing the same thing isn't completely fair...specifically, women have been known to make less money than a man for the same job...can we go and tell women to become men so they can make the same pay?...no, we cannot...this is why women fight for equality...this mode of thinking seems to solidify the thinking that CRNAs are lesser beings than MDAs...all I know, and trust me I don't know much, is that an MDA was directly responsible for the death of one of my family members and legal proceedings determined this...who knows what would have happened had a CRNA been administering anesthesia that day...

Your analogy doesn't hold water. Of course the certified mechanic should get more ... he went that extra step to insure he's in compliance with everything. If the other mechainics want the extra bucks then they have to get with the program and get certified.

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My analogy doesn't hold water because you don't want it to hold water. These are the same reasons why some felt that African Americans were not "good enough" to take a bullet in the Civil War, but it's really because their white masters didn't want them to have weapons and possibly revolt...in fact, in my former life I was employed with a major financial institution and saw too many times where a "manager" was hired because they were "qualified" simply because they held a degree (that degree may have even been in horticulture) and non-degreed employees worked circles around them...either way, it doesn't change the fact that a "qualified" MDA killed my family member and that there will always be underqualified MDA's and underqualified CRNA's and vice versa and it doesn't change the fact that the OP had a valid question that deserved a valid answer without posturing from any of us.

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Specializes in Anesthesia.

Jedidan45,

I am sure I speak for everyone on here that we are sorry for your loss. No anesthesia provider (MDA, CRNA, or AA) wants to lose a patient. When we do lose a patient I would like to think we did everything we could to save that patient.

I personally lost an Aunt to complications during a routine elective Lap. Chole, and my father received permanent recurrent laryngeal nerve damage after lung surgery. Serious complications from anesthesia are rare. Both MDA and CRNAs are well trained to take care of anesthetic emergencies. There has not been a study yet that shows a patient is safer in the hands of an MDA or CRNA.

Before this thread degrades past the point of saving I think we should stay close to the original topic: "Does it bother CRNA's that MDA's get so much more pay?"

The simple answer for me to that question is no, if CRNAs made the same as MDAs we wouldn't get near the jobs we do now. Our lower pay is what keeps us/CRNAs gainfully employed.

It costs around 1 million to train every anesthesiologist. It costs virtually nothing to train CRNAs, and SRNAs work for free during their clinicals making them great for hospitals' bottom line.

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Specializes in CRNA.
the OP had a valid question that deserved a valid answer without posturing from any of us.

I think the OP wanted to stir things up, the question is designed to do that....and it worked.

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