Doctoral degree to become an NP???

core0 · Mar 4, 2009

AND just what are those "professional issues" that you speak of? Hmmm?
Physical Therapy and Pharmacy both have doctoral degrees true, but NEITHER profession has made a mandate that ALL PT's and RPH's need to have a doctorate, so it is not quite as similar as you would have us think.

Actually the mandate is that all NPs and CNS needed to have a masters (with some grandfathering). The method chosen to enforce that mandate was to change Medicare billing rules after other methods failed. The mandate for DNP is for all graduates to have a masters. The issue again is that without some external club there will be no incentive for programs to change or graduates to spend the extra time and money. PT and Pharmacy converted wholesale over a period of 4-5 years. The difference is that they actually have accredidation programs that deal specifically with the professions and have the ability to make changes in the program requirements.

David Carpenter, PA-C

prairienp · Mar 4, 2009

AND just what are those "professional issues" that you speak of? Hmmm?
Physical Therapy and Pharmacy both have doctoral degrees true, but NEITHER profession has made a mandate that ALL PT's and RPH's need to have a doctorate, so it is not quite as similar as you would have us think.

Are you sure PT and Pharm are not manadated to have a doctorate? I would have failed that pop quiz

physasst · Mar 4, 2009

Are you sure PT and Pharm are not manadated to have a doctorate? I would have failed that pop quiz

I'm fairly certain that they are not, although I certainly could be wrong. I'll ask today in the ED.

Mike

core0 · Mar 4, 2009

Are you sure PT and Pharm are not manadated to have a doctorate? I would have failed that pop quiz

Pharmacy and PT schools are required to be doctorate programs. There is no requirement to have a doctorate to work. To work in a pharmacy you have to have an RPh. To work as a PT you have to have your PT license. The DPT is pretty much required to work in a clinical pharmacy area along with one to two residencies.

David Carpenter, PA-C

istat · Mar 4, 2009

Hey Dave,

Just kind of off target but I've just gotta ask. When I trained/worked in Colorado, we used to term "CoreO" for arrest of what ever etiology. Are you back their running around on the front slope? Man, do I miss home. But the mountain states are called the land of "proverty with a view" for a reason. Just curious my friend, enjoy your day.

istat · Mar 5, 2009

You are right. Hopefully someone will correct the curriculum that the DNP schools are advocating. If you want to make it a terminal professional practice degree-then put some patient care material in it. Lord, it looks like a certification course from a master's in health services admin program.

One other point-You need to add a for real residency requirement. You know, like one of the 4400 hours of patient care activities over 54 weeks. Get into people, it is great (yes painful) and worthwhile. The more your there, the more you see. The more you see, the more you do. And the more you do, the better you are. I know everyone will argue too many hours, tired, no need, etc. Take it on and complete it. Then I'll debate/argue your objectively based arguements. But please don't bother with subjective or preceptional points of contention.

core0 · Mar 5, 2009

Hey Dave,
Just kind of off target but I've just gotta ask. When I trained/worked in Colorado, we used to term "CoreO" for arrest of what ever etiology. Are you back their running around on the front slope? Man, do I miss home. But the mountain states are called the land of "proverty with a view" for a reason. Just curious my friend, enjoy your day.

I grew up in Denver. The first place I worked after getting out of the Army was Saint Anthony's. For those not from Denver, Core0 there is a code blue in other places (or a Dr. 99 where I currently am). Back in the pre WWW days (if I must date myself) and before boards such as this there was usenet if you were in academics and something called Fidonet and echomail if you were not in academics. Everyone had a "handle" and I chose core0 and have been using it since.

I currently reside in Atlanta which is kind of anti Denver. I miss the view. I don't miss the poverty with a view or the "view tax" as we used to call it. Fortunately Atlanta has a world class airport with many flights daily to Denver:D.

Now back to the regularly scheduled program.

David Carpenter, PA-C

istat · Mar 5, 2009

I to started off on the Rocky Mountain High post ETS'ing from Fort Cartoon.

OH, your one of those holy tony type's. I'm so sorry. We of the Swedish/DG programs remember you all in our prayers (lol). Wow, they were the good old days, weren't they? I've worked virtually every service from Ft Collins to Pueblo (which just proves that I can't hold a job).

Skipped Colorado and made my way to Alaska. Views good (but it still not the Maroon bells). I do have to admit I enjoy making 6 figures/year for the exact same work that was paying $65,000 (and benefits? Hahahahaha)

And now, back from the land of memories! Take care

CraigB-RN, MSN, RN · Mar 5, 2009

There seems to be a lot of us Denver/Colorado refugies here. I was stationed at the Academy and started my EMT-P career with Mt Valey Ambulance in the springs. I was already an EMT-P when I got there. I couldnt' figure out what they were talking about when they mentioned a core. I looked so stupid. I remeber taking flights from Ft Carson, when the chopper from St Anthonies couldn't handled teh altitude or the air density. I was flying with the 571st even though I was an Air Force Puke.

core0 · Mar 5, 2009

There seems to be a lot of us Denver/Colorado refugies here. I was stationed at the Academy and started my EMT-P career with Mt Valey Ambulance in the springs. I was already an EMT-P when I got there. I couldnt' figure out what they were talking about when they mentioned a core. I looked so stupid. I remeber taking flights from Ft Carson, when the chopper from St Anthonies couldn't handled teh altitude or the air density. I was flying with the 571st even though I was an Air Force Puke.

The thing that confuses me more is that a code99 in Denver was restraint team. Here a doctor 99 is cardiac arrest. I still have to look at the card on my badge to figure what is what.

istat · Mar 5, 2009

Dude,

We need to talk off line (571st 76-80: MVA till 83).

cruisin_woodward · Mar 5, 2009

I agree completely with your assessment, I think MY problem, from a policy perspective, is that they are making it mandatory. I would agree that having an OPTIONAL DNP degree would not be bothersome, not to me at least, but to make it mandatory creates some potential access to care issues, and cannot be proven to enhance care, at least not yet. Why not make it optional, collect data for 10 years or so, and THEN decide whether or not to make it mandatory. I mean, that is the logical thing to do.
BTW- COMPLETELY and utterly agree with you on the whole online thing. Attaining an academic degree, ie; DPH, PhD, etc. online is one thing, but to attain a CLINICAL degree with patients care in the balance on a computer with no face time and interaction is the most dangerous thing I can think of, and I really feel sorry for the patients who are going to get care from those providers.

The purpose of the DNP is not to replace MDs or to make a super NP. There are many practical reasons for require a doctorate. Most of health care is already requiring one. Nursing needs to be on the same level. My reasons for getting my doctorate are simply for personal satisfaction. I agree about the on line program, but there is still a large clinical component if it is BSN to DNP. For MSN to DNP, the clinical component is research based. I am going BSN to DNP and will have 1000 hours of clinical time. None if my classes are on line. Many are with the PhD students. Many are with the Masters students. I'm on my I phone, so I can't get too far into it, but I plan on being a critical care NP. I will still sit fir the ACNP boards. I really think people are making way too much of this. It is just a natural progression. It needs some tweaking, but it's still new!! Give it a chance.