Disrespectful, Lazy CNAs who bully

Lanesmama · Feb 17, 2011

Sounds like your facility needs to come up with better policies for its employees. My facility has a no phone policy on the floor- do it and you get canned. We don't have the internet available. Our DON is fierce and will look into any matter immediately and take care of the problem. It's a big facility but we know what is expected and accepted and we don't cross the lines- those who did aren't "we" anymore.

I think the main problem with your original post is the word subordinate. You say it isn't negative but it is generally used negatively so it automatically puts people on guard. I am just glad that the nurses I work with are nice to us and we do our jobs as expected so we don't have to deal with the b.s. you are mentioning... I guess maybe I'm a little naive because I haven't seen what you are describing- at work or in any clinical setting.

sevensonnets · Feb 17, 2011

Amen Conqueror, that needed to be said! The RN is legally in a position of authority over the CNA. A CNA earns respect from nurses by doing what they're hired to do: take care of patients. If being a CNA is your chosen path in life, then be the best CNA you can be. Respect will follow automatically.

eriksoln, BSN, RN · Feb 17, 2011

I just wanted to add too, a lot of times the behaviors of "less than motivated" CNAs is enabled by the RNs. Any chink in the armor of the RNs can/will be used by someone more interested in game playing than working/pt. care.

Case in point, there is a TERRIBLE aid on the new unit I am at. Such a crying game player. No skills at all, not with a single thing she does. Takes forever to complete any task and said task is very poorly done. Goes into ISO rooms, no gown, cleans up patients with no gloves.

Her game: When one RN tells her to quit complaining and get her work done, what does she do? Goes to the RN on the other side of the hall who is always gossiping about her and get the fires going on a new controversy. "Can you believe what she said to me. I'm with you, she is no good and a bully. I'm not helping her."

She plays this all night, one post to the other until eventually the whole night is gone and she got what she wanted......a night of walking around in circles complaining, nothing done.

Now, I see this and can't help but recall the psych. teaching from school with regards to "Staff splitting". Borderline personality patients do it the most. Well.......coworkers can suffer from borderline personality too. If the RNs would quit with the gossip and not feed into her game, she'd have nowhere to run to with her game. Just refuse to listen to her BS about how mean nursey Bill/Sally is on the other post and direct her to do something constructive.

A more unified RN group solves the problem with a lot of less desirable CNAs.

NaKcl, BSN, RN · Feb 17, 2011

" A more unified RN group solves the problem with a lot of less desirable CNAs. "

I totally agree with this statement. Clear direction of expected job duties need to be reminded also.

My workplace charge nurses didn't do a thing about this. As long as they(charge nurses) got the help, they didn't care about the rest of staff.

It was bad.

joanna73, BSN, RN · Feb 17, 2011

We have some awesome hardworking CNAs where I am. And one or two who should probably be terminated. No matter how respectful we (the RNs) may broach a subject, a few always have an attitude. I don't care what the title is...respect is earned. Ultimately, we are supposed to be there for the patients. Some forget this.

I was told I was "bossy" by a CNA because I asked nicely if she would toilet a resident, while I gave another insulin. We had a meeting about various issues, and the CNA's were told if they could not be respectful of one another, and the RNs, they were free to start looking for work elsewhere. The lazy people unfortunately create a toxic environment that spreads like a cancer to all the hardworking, positive staff. This affects patient care.

General E. Speaking, RN, RN · Feb 17, 2011

Yup, have asked a tech to do take someone to the bathroom while she was chatting about her hair at the nurses station. I gave her a reasonable amount of time to go. She didn't (as Zookeeper said: they will 'test" you).

I repeated my request and stood there. When she didn't get up and continued to ignore me, I simply said "I have asked to twice to do such and such... and you haven't done it. So, I take it you are you refusing?"

This approach usually works.

I respect the hard-working techs and value their service. I consider them a part of the "village of people it takes to raise a child". However, I do not have time for laziness nor do I tolerate a blatant disregard to my request to assist a patient.

I have been known to say, "You work for X hospital and I work for X hospital. You are not doing me any favors. We are here for the patients."

Conqueror+, BSN, RN · Feb 17, 2011

Subordinate \Sub*or"di*nate\, n. One who stands in order or rank below another; -- distinguished from a principal. --Milton. [1913 Webster]

Source: The Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48

I don't see anything to be defensive about. It is indicative of our culture. The mere suggestion that someone is in authority over someone else causes a PC riot. When I was a CNA I did my job without being asked. Now that I am a nurse I expect no less.

newway · Feb 17, 2011

Subordinate \Sub*or"di*nate\, n. One who stands in order or rank below another; -- distinguished from a principal. --Milton. [1913 Webster]
Source: The Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48
I don't see anything to be defensive about. It is indicative of our culture. The mere suggestion that someone is in authority over someone else causes a PC riot. When I was a CNA I did my job without being asked. Now that I am a nurse I expect no less.

same source just a little further down 1. To place in a lower order or class; to make or consider as

of less value or importance; as, to subordinate one

creature to another.

[1913 Webster]

Synonyms: inferior, junior, less, lower, minor, smaller, less

it simply wasn't needed in the sentence to convey her point. It only left one to inference something more. As stated earlier respect is a two way street.

Conqueror+, BSN, RN · Feb 17, 2011

I haven't read where it says to treat with little respect but perhaps I missed it. As I said respect is due to everyone so not sure where this is coming from.

Mrs. Sparkle Pants · Feb 17, 2011

Conqueror, I completely agree with you. Everyone is not equal. There must be a chain of command, but everyone's jobs are equally important. Yes, maybe I made a jump, but the OP's tone seemed to convey a lack of respect. While it seems you make an effort to show everyone respect, I think we both know there are many people who don't. I also agree that there are quite a few miserable people in the world who will be unhappy and lazy no matter how nice you are to them (I am convinced the vast majority of these people work at my local DMV and cable customer service, but that's another thread), I have found killing these people with kindness is much more effective than trying to find a way to scare them into doing their jobs.

I was recently at a client's home and their daughter told me a story abut someone from our agency who came to their home and was just overall rude and "lazy." She later found out the woman's daughter had.just died. You just never know what's going on in someones life and sometimes you just can't leave your personal life at the door. Respect, kindness, and compassion go a long way, that's all I'm saying.

anotherone, BSN, RN · Feb 18, 2011

Does anyone else have problems with CNAs (or other subordinate staff) who was generally disrespectful, insubordinate and lazy? I know this is a problem since the dawn of time and will continue to be a problem, but what about when they bully & take advantage of their fellow staff: Other CNAs and nurses. The easy answer is to fire them and hire people who actually care about the patients and take pride in where they work, but because of the HR "set up" we have, it allows them to get write up after write up, warning after warning.... so they remain until they transfer out or quit.
Anyone have any tips on how to deal with staff like this?

We have plenty on my unit. Some are awesome and I am in awe of them. Others will bark orders at myself and other RNs and LPNs and "report" us to management if we don't "help" them! Well, as nurses we have to prioritize care for many patients and some don't understand that it is not a matter of me not wanting to help with a bath............... it is a matter of me needing to do an intervention for someone else NOW or answering a call back from an MD on a critical issue NOW. I don't have any tips and will be reading the rest of this thread for them! Thanks for starting it!

anotherone, BSN, RN · Feb 18, 2011

Everyone is going to burn my butt for saying so, but you asked so I'm saying.
nurses, especially new ones have no delegation skills and want to make friends and find a happy place in their new home. No one is taught in school to say.. "put down the phone and answer the call light"... you practice sterile technique until you puke, but no one teaches you to say.. " you need to round on my patients and hit the call bell when you need help turning". or "while you're making turning rounds, it makes sense to have a cart with ice to refill the water containers".
.

Thanks, I am a new nurse and this is a big issue for me. We are usually short on cnas. I find myself doing my job and thier job. BLAH BLAH BALH i know it is the nurse's responsibility but they are getting PAID to do something..they don't give my meds, do my assessments, call mds and pharamcy or multiple other things i have to do and can barely manage... I hate running around the whole day/night giving meds, assessments, dealing with multiple issues and seeing the cnas sitting at the desk DOING NOTHING.... WHILE pts are not turned, or vitals or IOs done. Then I ask nicely for help "can you please get this pt's vitals?" and am given major attitude!(they should have done it without me asking). I completely understand when they are busy working, but sitting for long periods of time doing nothing.ahhhhhhhhhhhhh!