Difference between LPN and RN knowledge?

[stewiegriffin]

I'm in the traditional ASN program at my school. Half of my classmates are on the traditional track and the other half are transitioning from LPN.

One of our careplan questions is, "What RN knowledge did you apply today?" I wasn't worried until the LPN's in the class kept getting low marks for their answers to this question.

The instructor keeps telling the LPN's that they have to start thinking like RN's now. They were told that their careplans only showed their LPN knowledge.

For those of us who aren't already LPN's, how do we even know how to answer the question? I really couldn't explain the difference between RN knowledge and LPN knowledge.

At this stage in the game, the transition students have way more education than those of us going the traditional route.

I'm very confused!

[justme1972]

I'll give you a good example.

This semester we had to do group projects and "teach" the class a procedure. In our group we had 5, and two of them were LPN's...one with 18 years of experience and our project was blood transfusion.

When we were doing our "brainstorming" session about different aspects to cover, we knew from 1st year that you weren't supposed to give blood that was over 4 hours old, but I wanted to research why and make it part of the presentation , b/c at least for me, the "why's" make me remember.

When I asked the LPN's, they both said, "Oh, I don't know, you just don't."

I said, "There must be a reason." One of the LPN's said, "If there is a reason, I've never been told, it's just procedure."

Neither one of them knew whether you gave Tylenol and Benedryl, whether it was a facility policy, individual decision, or standard practice before you gave blood. (This later appeared on a test of ours, and I "won" my point b/c they were never mentioned in our book as to why they were given).

[totoro]

"The RN then is lacking the BSN, the BSN is lacking the MSN, the MSN might be lacking the PhD. "

First of all, RN is not lacking the BSN. RN is the BSN or the ADN.

"I've had my seat in a regular RN program since I started my LPN program. I'm done in Dec with my LPN, and begin the RN in Jan. I purposely don't tell people I'm starting the RN program."

You don't really know that RN students look down on LPNs because you are not in RN school yet. We had some LPNs when i went to Nursing school (BSN) and we thought they had advantage because they had some knowledge. people shouldn't assume that BSN, RN, or whatever thinks that they are "better" or is "against" the other profession based on what you think they think, or what you might think if you were in their shoes. Every person in each occupation is simply different. I can't stand it when LPNs thinks that way (that RNs are better than LPNs) of RNs just because we have BSN or ADN.

[jackson145]

A better question is, "why do they ask this type of question in nursing school?". It's just plain confusing!

[totoro]

seriously!

[SKM-NURSIEPOOH, BSN, RN]

"i've had my seat in a regular rn program since i started my lpn program. i'm done in dec with my lpn, and begin the rn in jan. i purposely don't tell people i'm starting the rn program."

you don't really know that rn students look down on lpns because you are not in rn school yet. we had some lpns when i went to nursing school (bsn) and we thought they had advantage because they had some knowledge. people shouldn't assume that bsn, rn, or whatever thinks that they are "better" or is "against" the other profession based on what you think they think, or what you might think if you were in their shoes. every person in each occupation is simply different. i can't stand it when lpns thinks that way (that rns are better than lpns) of rns just because we have bsn or adn.

hiya totoro!

the problem oftem steams from rn instructors telling rn students the on going *myth* that lpns just act/react without thinking critically. they often will interchange lpns with uaps & not even refer lpns *as* nurses! while i was in my bsn program, one of the ob instructors had the gull to state that any monkey could be trained to do what lpns do! needless to say, i told her that she wouldn't appreciate it if doctors state the same thing of rns...why the disrespect? it turns out that many of the rn instructors themselves where taught this so-called *myth* while they were in school. many have no clue/idea what the lpn curriculum even consist of. sadly, they just here this *myth* & run with it.

that being said, their rn students go away with this superior attitude because it's being taught to them in their respective rn programs without just cause.

of course lpns are taught the critical thinking, delegating, care plans, patho, etc. the biggest difference is that each area of instruction isn't as long or in as much in-depth. the same subject matter (with the exception of bsn courses like community nursing, leadership courses, nursing informatics, nursing research writing, nursing stats, & critical care) are taught to both lpns & adn/diploma nurses...just that adn/diploma courses are spread-out much more over time. yet adn/diploma nurses sit for the same entry level nclex-rn that the bsn students sit for...even with six to nine months of the "other above mentioned courses" not taught to adn/diploma students. that doesn't mean they aren't able to think, function, & react in the same manner that rn-bsns...right.

so again, why the quickness to discredit the educational levels of lpns?

cheers :cheers:,

moe

[TheCommuter, BSN, RN]

since you are an rn-bsn who started your nursing career as an lpn, your articulate answer carries the most credibility with me. thanks for the enlightenment. :)

hiya totoro!

the problem oftem steams from rn instructors telling rn students the on going *myth* that lpns just act/react without thinking critically. they often will interchange lpns with uaps & not even refer lpns *as* nurses! while i was in my bsn program, one of the ob instructors had the gull to state that any monkey could be trained to do what lpns do! needless to say, i told her that she wouldn't appreciate it if doctors state the same thing of rns...why the disrespect? it turns out that many of the rn instructors themselves where taught this so-called *myth* while they were in school. many have no clue/idea what the lpn curriculum even consist of. sadly, they just here this *myth* & run with it.

that being said, their rn students go away with this superior attitude because it's being taught to them in their respective rn programs without just cause.

of course lpns are taught the critical thinking, delegating, care plans, patho, etc. the biggest difference is that each area of instruction isn't as long or in as much in-depth. the same subject matter (with the exception of bsn courses like community nursing, leadership courses, nursing informatics, nursing research writing, nursing stats, & critical care) are taught to both lpns & adn/diploma nurses...just that adn/diploma courses are spread-out much more over time. yet adn/diploma nurses sit for the same entry level nclex-rn that the bsn students sit for...even with six to nine months of the "other above mentioned courses" not taught to adn/diploma students. that doesn't mean they aren't able to think, function, & react in the same manner that rn-bsns...right.

so again, why the quickness to discredit the educational levels of lpns?

cheers :cheers:,

moe

[Woodenpug, BSN]

I'm not sure. This is total opinion.

The educational level of LPN/LVN is exceptional. The legal status is somewhat less. We took one step forward with delegation authority and two steps back at the same time. My responsibility in delegating to an LPN is no different than my responsibility in delegating to a UAP. You can't assign patient care responsibilities to LPN/LVN's, you may only legally delegate.

Please correct me. I know this is true only in CA an MI and only if my perceptions of the legalities are correct.

[mama_d, BSN, RN]

my responsibility in delegating to an lpn is no different than my responsibility in delegating to a uap. you can't assign patient care responsibilities to lpn/lvn's, you may only legally delegate.

i'm not sure i understand what you're saying here...do you mean that lpns cannot take their own assignments and be responsible for their own patients, and that they are limited to doing whatever tasks you need to have them do? if so, i don't know that i'd be able to function in that kind of setting! i'm too darn independent and would balk at the limitations.

i was surprised when i added up the hours spent in clinicals when i was a lpn and compared it to the entire adn course where i'm going to bridge...i actually had >100 hrs more clinicals as a lpn than the adn students get. honestly, i was expecting the reverse. it is a higher degree, it seems like it should require more contact hours with patients. between the two, by the time i get my adn, i'll have significantly more clinical hours than the bsn programs in the area require!

this thread kind of spiked my curiousity so i grabbed a saunders review book for the nclex-rn from my school library. i was actually surprised that i was able to answer >80% of the questions correctly already, even though i haven't even started any bridge courses yet (still doing pre-req's b/c my credits didn't transfer). my biggest hang up were ob questions, which isn't surprising since it's been over eight years since i had any classes in that area. it just makes me wonder, if there's supposed to be such a gulf in the knowledge and theory taught, why am i able to do so well on the questions in the review book without having even started my nursing classes yet?

[Woodenpug, BSN]

I'm saying, that as I see it, you may delegate duties to an LPN, but may not assign duties to an LPN.

[Guy84RN]

There is a big difference in RN and LPN where I went to school. Out of The lpn's that bridged over to RN, everyone of them had to repeat a semester because it was too hard and they failed. Delegation is only a small portion of the difference, way more in depth physiology, completely different way of thinking, and just way more difficult than expected. Only thing i can say is see for yourself and do your best.

[kcochrane]

I am a practicing LPN and will finish my RN next semester. There are nurses at every level who can think or who can't think. What I mean is some nurses are robots and don't past the task at hand. Others think critically about the task they are performing. As a LPN I am still expected to know what I am doing and why. As far as bedside nursing/patient care, there is probably not a lot of difference between LPNs and RNs.

Further education trains you to go beyond bedside nursing - if you desire that. It trains you to think at a higher level and look at the total picture of the floor you are running. It trains you to be a leader, a supervisor, a charge nurse, a community health nurse, etc. It trains you to antipate what may be done next, to offer suggestions to the doctor and prepare for what may happen. It trains you to assess, not just gather data.

Give me a year as a RN and I can probably be a little more specific.