maybe its just me, but i get very bothered when someone says "i'm a nurse," and their not, their a cna, or nurse aid, or have no schooling at all and just worked their way up in a clinic. i work at a local emergency clinic 30 hours a week to gain experience in my field, and i just got accepted in ns, and i'v worked darn hard to get here! and i find it bothersome when one of the girls at work say "i'm the nurse" or something along those lines...i feel that when i graduate and pass my nclex that, only then, will i be able to say "i'm a nurse." the other day my doctor said "jamie, will you get a nurse?" i said "im sorry doc, i dont think we have any of those working here." he actually laughed and said "you know what i mean"......but is this just me?????
I never said that I thought someone who wasn't a nurse should call themselves a nurse. I'm not arguing with any laws. My husband was a cop for 15 years, so I don't advocate breaking any laws.
I said that correcting these old patients who call everyone a nurse because the title isn't important to them is just silly. I'm not the only one who feels this way, either.
All together, including in-laws, I have 7 nurses in my family. Everyone of them agrees with me. My aunt, a MSN, said that nothing sounds more insecure than correcting some elderly patient, who couldn't care less, over and over again about what title they can call someone by.
I've been a good MA, a good tech, and I'll be a good nurse. I love the work and I know what it entails. I've talked to all the nurses in my family about their jobs until they are probably ready to hide when they see me coming.
I'm just remembering my grandma's last stay in a hospital. An 87 yr old shouldn't be constantly chastised for calling the CNA a nurse. It's unimportant to her what the differences are. She thought that the CNA was giving her wonderful care, but everytime she mentioned it, her nurse bit her head off about how "that's not a nurse". My grandma didn't learn a lesson. She left the hospital thinking she'd had one sweet nurse and one crabby one.
I will say that I wouldn't have wanted that CNA to tell everyone she was a nurse or try to practice outside her scope. As I said before, I'm not saying non-nurses should bill themselves as nurses. I just get sick of all the childish rushing to "educate" people about everyone else's consequence in life.
no need to correct an elderly person. Correct the "nurse."
Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Except in this case, no one was claiming to be a nurse when they weren't. It was just my grandma calling all her caregivers "nurse". She also referred to the female Doc as a nurse and the Doc only corrected her once and left it alone after that.
this is an age old topic, that will not go away and does irritate.
I usually ask are you an RN or an LPN?
If it is someone talking about this "nurse" I ask the same question. I tell them I am a Registered Nurse.
It makes communication clear. It brings things out in the open in a diplomatic way, without becoming a pi$$ing contest or something else.
Some times (generally when it is a lay person who is describing someone else as a nurse) they do not get it even then. However, generally the person admits the truth and defers to me.
i have 2 girls in my class who work in a pediatric clinic. The patients call them nurses, so they refer to themselves as nurses. Even on their Myspace pages, they have their occupation as "nurse" it drives me crazy! I'm thinking the whole time, "you have to get through school first!!"
Specializes in Med-Surg, Geriatric, Behavioral Health.
The unfortunate thing that contributes to the confusion, especially with the elderly...is the old image of long ago of what a nurse looked like and did....white uniform, nursing cap, all female, et cetera. One had a very good idea back then who the nurse was and who the doc was. Old image of the doc...all male, white lab coat. Now, juxtapose those images to our current day and age. Nurses and docs are both male and female now. Some docs wear lab coats, some do not, some come in scrubs, some all business attire, some in street clothes. Nurses are both male and female with assorted mix and colors of scrub attire or uniform. Now throw into that mix...PCAs, MAs, NAs, CNAs, SNAs, STNAs...with their mix and blend, male and female, assisting in patient ADLs which many elderly attribute to the nurse. The elderly have a heck of a time sorting it out. The best thing, seriously, in all kindness for any patient is at the change of shift....introduce the team of new members, by name, by role. Put the names up on the board for the patient. If there is any initial confusion between the nurse and the unlicensed personnel...simply state that the unlicensed person "assists the nurses" in providing the nursing care that he/she may need during the hospital stay. Simple, to the point, and is the most correct response to give to any patient....because that is their legal role. The hospital/health care environment is incredibly confusing for patients...young and elderly. Consider your title like your last name..."Hi, I'm Thunderwolf, a RN, your Nurse. Hi, I'm Jean, a PCA, your Aide." Which brings me to another confusing piece for the elderly...we change the titles left and right for the unlicensed personnel...the new flavor/title for the year or the new name trend (depending upon where one works). The elderly most likely understand what an Aide is as a title and role, it's been around for a very long time (just like nurse and doctor)....but "what in the heck is a PCA?"...when an elderly patient is given a nebulous title which means "what?" to them....it does need clarified to some degree. But, in the end, it does all boil down to care given....nursing care, which we all provide....RN, LPN, and PCA/MA/NA/CNA/SNA/STNA/Aide alike. And agreed, providing care which appears like nursing, by law, does not make one "a nurse"...it is a protected title by the law and is illegal if used incorrectly by personnel at any level...for it undermines public trust....the very reason why Medical and Nursing Boards exist in the first place...to protect the public from fraud....yes, fraud. So...if an elderly member refers to an Aide/PCA/MA/NA/CNA/SNA/STNA as his/her nurse...tis a nice compliment....and I agree...there is no need to forceably educate him/her regarding it. All one needs to say is....."Thanks, Mrs. Jones. I'm your PCA...ready to "assist you" if you need me. If I can't, I will get the nurse."
Specializes in Med-Surg, Geriatric, Behavioral Health.
i have 2 girls in my class who work in a pediatric clinic. The patients call them nurses, so they refer to themselves as nurses. Even on their Myspace pages, they have their occupation as "nurse" it drives me crazy! I'm thinking the whole time, "you have to get through school first!!"
This is a good case of public fraud...and is illegal.
If any unlicensed person holds himself/herself out as a licensed person (MD/DO/RN/LPN), it is a reportable offense to the appropriate board for that state. In this case, the Nursing Board.
Side note: This is why our board, allnurses.com, insists on correct title. If you do not have it, you cannot use it here and fraud our members and public alike.
no need to correct an elderly person. Correct the "nurse."
correct the "nurse" for what? if she hasnt billed herself as a nurse but the patient bills her as one - do you correct the "nurse" for not correcting the elderly person ( which means your statement of no need to correct the elderly is wrong) or correct her for the elderly person thinking she was a "nurse" even though she didnt say she was? ( which means you are correcting her for somone elses mistake - which sorry but i dont see the good ratioanal to reprimand someone for another persons mistake )
Some are saying if an elderly confused patient wants to call everyone who cares for her a nurse then maybe better to just let it go than to upset the patient by constantly telling her something that she may not ever understand.
Correcting the nurse I think may apply to the nurse understanding all this and letting the patient go on calling all those caring for her nurses, even in the case of her doctor.
It's confusing to me but that the best I can make of it. I understand what is being said. An elderly confused pt would become even more confused if she is constantly told "no this person is a CNA, no this person is a nurse, no this person is a lab tech", in order to pull her into reality, etc.... I would have to agree.
It's not the same as a non licensed person purposely calling themselves a nurse and misleading patients to believe they are something they are not. We're talking alert and orientated patients who deserve the truth.
Specializes in Med/Surg/Ortho/HH/Radiology-Now Retired.
Leave the elderly ALONE!!!! LOL
But... on a serious note: what the heck does it matter WHAT an elderly pt calls his/her carer? I'd probably bop someone who tried to forcefully and repeatedly "educate" me about something I couldn't give two hoots about! As we grow older, believe me when I tell you; we couldn't care LESS about things which really are unimportant. Getting older brings other, more serious things to consider, than someone's title!
What really matters is that the carer knows who he/she is. Is confident and secure in who he/she is. That he/she practises within their LEGAL scope and is HONEST.
If a person portrays themself to be other than they are, they will soon be caught out.
The law will deal with them.
Part of the problem is because nurses and nursing has changed so much over the past 20-30 years. I know. I've been part of that evolution.
Why anyone would want to blatently present themself as something they are not, is unlawful, dishonest, foolish and reeks of insecurity.
There will always be people who embellish what/who/how they are. Both personally and professionally. They're more to be pitied rather than scorned. I say this because if they felt better about who they really are, they'd have no need to claim to be anything other than what they truly are.
This is a good case of public fraud...and is illegal.
If any unlicensed person holds himself/herself out as a licensed person (MD/DO/RN/LPN), it is a reportable offense to the appropriate board for that state. In this case, the Nursing Board.
Side note: This is why our board, allnurses.com, insists on correct title. If you do not have it, you cannot use it here and fraud our members and public alike.
Excellent post, jorlsu.
Thank you.
Thunderwolf, Thank you for your great responses and suggestions for clarification to the public. As for the personnel....here in Michigan we do not have an actual nurse practice act. We have a "public health code". So I'm not sure to whom I'd report this exact behavior. Additionally there is not anything in that code that states it is illegal to represent oneself as a nurse who is not licensed. We are behind the times I guess. And it is an extremely common tactic in doctor's offices everywhere for the MA to be the "doctor's nurse". I had gotten extremely upset when I left my last position because they were training MA's to do phone triage. How would an MA's training qualify them to give medical advice over the phone? How would they know the questions to ask, or when to decipher if that person is having (for example an exacerbation of CHF or an asthma attack? Would they know to give the rescue inhaler first....for example....I could think of many....)? I just have to believe this practice cannot be legal, let alone safe.
Specializes in Med-Surg, Geriatric, Behavioral Health.
Thunderwolf, Thank you for your great responses and suggestions for clarification to the public. As for the personnel....here in Michigan we do not have an actual nurse practice act. We have a "public health code". So I'm not sure to whom I'd report this exact behavior. Additionally there is not anything in that code that states it is illegal to represent oneself as a nurse who is not licensed. We are behind the times I guess. And it is an extremely common tactic in doctor's offices everywhere for the MA to be the "doctor's nurse". I had gotten extremely upset when I left my last position because they were training MA's to do phone triage. How would an MA's training qualify them to give medical advice over the phone? How would they know the questions to ask, or when to decipher if that person is having (for example an exacerbation of CHF or an asthma attack? Would they know to give the rescue inhaler first....for example....I could think of many....)? I just have to believe this practice cannot be legal, let alone safe.
Emma
I feel your concern, if not angst over this..for it opens the door quite large for charlatans in your area. By the way, the definition for charlatan is this, so my use of this term is very correct: a person who pretends to have more knowledge or skill than he or she possesses; quack. I would suggest contacting your State Nursing Board and/or your State Representative regarding issues such as you have...to protect your public against medical, legal, or nursing fraud. I would even dare say that if any unlicensed person holds himself/herself as a "licensed nurse" and touches/intervenes upon that patient, while giving the appearance of being a licensed nurse, places himself/herself in great risk of commiting Battery...which is also illegal. It smells of law suit...especially if something goes wrong or missed.
jackson145
598 Posts
I never said that I thought someone who wasn't a nurse should call themselves a nurse. I'm not arguing with any laws. My husband was a cop for 15 years, so I don't advocate breaking any laws.
I said that correcting these old patients who call everyone a nurse because the title isn't important to them is just silly. I'm not the only one who feels this way, either.
All together, including in-laws, I have 7 nurses in my family. Everyone of them agrees with me. My aunt, a MSN, said that nothing sounds more insecure than correcting some elderly patient, who couldn't care less, over and over again about what title they can call someone by.
I've been a good MA, a good tech, and I'll be a good nurse. I love the work and I know what it entails. I've talked to all the nurses in my family about their jobs until they are probably ready to hide when they see me coming.
I'm just remembering my grandma's last stay in a hospital. An 87 yr old shouldn't be constantly chastised for calling the CNA a nurse. It's unimportant to her what the differences are. She thought that the CNA was giving her wonderful care, but everytime she mentioned it, her nurse bit her head off about how "that's not a nurse". My grandma didn't learn a lesson. She left the hospital thinking she'd had one sweet nurse and one crabby one.
I will say that I wouldn't have wanted that CNA to tell everyone she was a nurse or try to practice outside her scope. As I said before, I'm not saying non-nurses should bill themselves as nurses. I just get sick of all the childish rushing to "educate" people about everyone else's consequence in life.