I'm an atheist. I am uncomfortable around religious situations. I haven't started nursing school yet (14 weeks to go). I'm concerned with being confronted with people that would ask me to "Pray for them" and stuff. I don't know if this is a common occurrence among patients, etc. Aside from not wanting to be included in religious sentiments, I also am very uncomfortable with lying. I think I would find moral difficulty with saying "Okay" to someone that would ask me to pray for them.
I'd prefer to hear from atheists how they deal with situations like that. I'd rather not get into a religion discussion, if it can be avoided.
I was trying to search for old threads, but the links from the search engine are not going to the correct pages.
I just had to jump on this. I have seen quite few studies conducted showing that people don't tend to stray from their beliefs. This means that those that tend to become religious were already religious. Those that are atheists tend to stay so until the end. They also did a large study about 'Atheists in Foxholes' among the US Military after during and after WW2 and in following conflicts.
There are INDEED atheists in foxholes.
the statement those who tend to become religious were already religious does not make sense. people become religious because they have reached a point in their lives when they need something bigger than themselves. people who are religious don't tend to be religious, they are religious. maybe you meant people who have been exposed to a religion as part of their day to day lives as children tend towards participating in that religion out of choice as an adult.
hmm, i would question these studies based on this thought, when are these beliefs set?
the person i am now is not the person i was when i was 20. the beliefs i had when i was 25 are different from those mine as a 40 year old. many people who were brought up in the church as children, left it as teens. some found a different path and some returned. there are plenty of examples of people who were brought up in an atheistic household find belief in a system that they never knew growing up.
most people i have encountered who were very sick or dying, have turned to a belief system to help them cope. the point is that people change as their needs change. i was raised a catholic, i left the church and now i don't go. will i return to catholicism? depends on my needs and how i change as person through life.
I meant that those that believe in god almost always tend to. You might not go to church but I bet you still believe in God. If you are pushed to the limit you will ask for God's help.
Those of us that are truly Atheist rarely turn to asking for God.
The assumption that we do is just the arrogance of religion. People DON'T change that much. Someone that say lost achild and rejects God still believes in God.
In essence you have changed your behavior but have you changed your thinking. If you went to India and were dying would you suddenly pray to Shiva?
The answer you just gave answers the question of whether a true atheist would pray to God. It wouldn't happen. If they did pray then deep down they ALREADY believed.
I just had to jump on this. I have seen quite few studies conducted showing that people don't tend to stray from their beliefs. This means that those that tend to become religious were already religious. Those that are atheists tend to stay so until the end. They also did a large study about 'Atheists in Foxholes' among the US Military after during and after WW2 and in following conflicts.
the thing to consider, as we as a culture have advanced, we have become more and more hostile towards the idea of something greater than ourselves. it has become more acceptable to be atheistic over the last 40 years as we have moved away from the influence of religious leaders toward the hedonistic tendencies of modern western civilization. think about when you were a child, there was no issue, it was merry christmas. now it is seasons greetings. we have moved from tolerence to hostility towards those that hold christian beliefs. now before i upset everyone one, i will provide an example: in england and canada there is a movement that is gaining acceptance to use shiara (islamic) law. if christians tried to have canon law used in day to day interactions, the backlash would be swift and strong. we as a culture have created a separation of church and state that applies only to christianity.
the question will be not "how do i handle someone who is religious" but "how do i deal with those whose religious beliefs are so different from what i know". if you don't feel comfortable with someone quoting scripture, try dealing with someone praying in a language you don't understand, wearing clothes unfamiliar to you and actively treating you in a manner that could be construed as sexist or biased because of religious teaching.
i think as nurses we need to understand that many people who use our hospitals are new to our country. most from s. america, asia and africa are religious and we need to respect and understand these beliefs.
I meant that those that believe in god almost always tend to. You might not go to church but I bet you still believe in God. If you are pushed to the limit you will ask for God's help.
Those of us that are truly Atheist rarely turn to asking for God.
The assumption that we do is just the arrogance of religion. People DON'T change that much. Someone that say lost achild and rejects God still believes in God.
In essence you have changed your behavior but have you changed your thinking. If you went to India and were dying would you suddenly pray to Shiva?
The answer you just gave answers the question of whether a true atheist would pray to God. It wouldn't happen. If they did pray then deep down they ALREADY believed.
Think about it.
ahh but there is a difference between being religious and spiritual. the difference is that religious people follow a specific dogma and set of beliefs. you can be spiritual and not religious and vice versa.
as far as the indian example, it does not hold up. most people don't understand but all of the gods in hinduism really represent various manifestations of one supreme reality. now, if i were religious, i would not pray shiva if i were not a hindu but a spiritual person may understand and embrace the idea of shiva being a manifestation of the supreme reality.
i don't believe any of the dogma of conventional religions but do believe there is something greater than me. until someone can explain how the universe got here and i have yet to find an atheist who can cite an example that disproves the first law of thermodynamics, since energy can be neither created or destroyed but changed into another form, how did all this get here? beats me but i quote shakespeare's hamlet:
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy"
I am not a Christian, Wiccan, Athiest, or Pagan but.....I have friends from all the mentioned categories. They are bright, articulate, caring folks. The only one that annoys me is the Christian ( have been friends since childhood and she converted along the way). Am always threatening to steal her sign with the Ten Commandments out of her yard and put it up on the courthouse lawn. The only thing that deters me is I am afraid I'd end up before one particular magistrate and boy would I get a lecture. Probably community service also. She would'nt me sit in jail though. She loves me.:kiss
As a nurse we need to comfort our patients and provide supportive care to families..if a patient asked me to pray in Hindu(which I am not) for example..I most certainly would not brush them off and get someone else to do it unless their need was not immediate..if they were in a moment of distress and in great need to pray, then I would do it right then and there. My job is beyond just medicine. I do not discuss politics or religion. period...if a patient ever asked me , I would answer by saying that I dont discuss politics or religion and I am here for THEM and support them in what they believe. If they were a dying patient, I just might lie and say that I did believe in God..who are you hurting?? no one..but the idea that my patient would feel more at peace is all I need to know.. "when in Rome....."
Specializes in Public Health/Underserved Populations.
First let me say that I am an agnostic. When someone asks me to pray for them or with them what I do is to concentrate on sending them healing and positive thoughts. This is my form of prayer. I do not consider it a lie that I am not praying to their God. I am performing good nursing when I am able to allow a patient to express their spiritual needs. I do not have to believe what the patient believes. I only have to respect their beliefs. I do not get into discussions with patients about religious beliefs, the hospital is not the time or place. Besides the chaplain can handle that. I just try to focus on the positive and let the patient say what they need to say.
Actually there is a very simple way to handle it. You can tell the person that you will find a chaplin or a religous person to take care of their spiritual needs. Patients actually have a right to receive a chaplin or someone spiritual if they request it. You can simply state that I do not have the same religious beliefs that you have, but I will get someone for you. Maybe it is not that simple, but never lie to a patient and NEVER compromise your religious beliefs to please someone else because you want to make them feel better or happy. I believe that you can stay true to your beliefs while providing care for your patients with different religious beliefs from your own. Personally, I don't even argue with my peers, relatives or family members. I will listen to what they believe in, but I will never tell someone that they are wrong. Also, I will not allow ANYONE to disrespect me by telling me that I'm wrong to have my beliefs. I will choose to walk away or discontinue the discussion.
I am not an atheist, but rather a Christian. I am not responding to your post to engage in a religious debate, because I certainly believe in free will and the right to your own beliefs.
In my experience, I cannot recall being asked even once to pray with someone. I can't imagine this happens very often, if at all. If it does, you can always put in a chaplain consult. Most people who want prayer will contact their own clergy or ask you to have a priest come visit them.
If it were to happen and you don't feel comfortable lying, there is no reason you would have to say okay. Just ask if they would like to speak with a chaplain, since prayer is their specialty. I would not be comfortable being asked to participate in a Hmong chicken sacrifice ceremony (yes, people actually sacrifice live chickens in patient rooms), so I would just contact the right staff member to arrange it and otherwise stay out of it. If it were left up to me, I'd just want to get a bucket of KFC and call it a day, so I know I can't be very supportive in that situation, and that's okay.
Hope this helps, even though I'm not an atheist. :wink2::wink2:
Oddly enough, my alias came from an experience during my nursing training. A stroke patient who by all accounts had been unable to speak since his stroke, gripped my hand and said that I was "heaven sent" following a difficult and painful procedure which I had coaxed him through.
That was almost 15 years ago, and in the meantime I have become atheist. It's one thing for patients to ask me to pray for them - I'll usually say that I'm "out of practice" but I'm happy to sit with them while they pray. Some will say "God bless you" when they appreciate the care I provide, and my response is as though they have paid me a compliment, which is usually the spirit in which those words were said: "Thank you" or "That's very kind of you."
It's entirely another thing when a colleague starts spewing religious rhetoric. For instance, I'd had a stretch where things weren't going well in my life - the kids were sick, I'd been sick, the car was broken down and money was tight, I felt depressed, etc. etc. etc.... my philosophy is that sometimes $h!t happens and you just cope until things get better. It works for me. Well, one of my colleagues heard about it and got all righteous about it. She proclaimed - in front of other colleagues, no less - that my run of bad luck was because The Devil was testing me because I was atheist. My response was something to the effect that "Why would the devil need to test me if I'm already on his team? Isn't that what you believe?" She got more righteous and superior (still in front of colleagues) and started telling me that these bad things happened because I had abandoned god. "Oh, so now you're saying that it's god who's punishing me? And you wonder why I want nothing to do with god or religion? It's way too confusing for me." Of course, that got her really ticked off, so the righteousness ramped up even more.
Apparently I am going straight to hell for the crime of being a smart ass. She finished up by saying that she would pray for me.
I told her that I would be documenting the conversation and that if she ever spoke to me that way again or otherwise abused me with her religious rhetoric, that I would file a harassment complaint against her with my boss and human resources.
This is just my opinion, but when someone starts preaching at me, knowing full well that I am atheist or criticizing me for being atheist, it's a violation of my right to religious freedom (or freedom from religion if you want to be specific about it). I don't go anywhere and force atheism on anyone, and I don't challenge religious belief unless and until someone starts trying to shove their religious beliefs on me. I don't complain about working on religious holidays (Christmas or Easter) and I don't call in "sick" on those holidays like some of my god-fearing colleagues have done.
I do find it very interesting to talk with patients about what they believe and how it comforts them and helps them cope with adversity or illness. It helps me deliver individualized care that honours them and their beliefs. It does not take anything away from me, or diminish my personal lack of belief. If a patient asked me about my beliefs, I'd tell them that I don't practice any religion, but I do believe in love and kindness and beauty and truth.
Specializes in home health, flu clinic, private duty.
I like a lot of the answers in this thread.
Mine is a little different. I have found in working with spiritually diverse populations, no one is offended by me holding their hand and me saying, "May you receive the healing that you so desire. May you find comfort and rest this evening. May your fears be lifted."....etc. Whatever is appropriate.... I have even been asked by agnostics and athiests to sometimes sit with them and say something. They have not been offended by this. It is simply stating an intention or desire for their wellness, happiness, health, etc.
IMHO, As for keeping my spiritual beliefs to myself, I would choose to do so. I am pretty eclectic spiritually, and even though the nursing profession is physically large, it's a "small world." I would not want to have ANY of my personal info. come back to bite me in the hiney. I am not ashamed of anything that might be found out about me. After a gazillion years, I just learned that it isn't important for me to share all those bits of info indiscriminately. (Yeah, slow learner...it took me a while!)
"May you find the solution for you and your patients that doesn't diminish who either of you are!" (
horus2001
68 Posts
the statement those who tend to become religious were already religious does not make sense. people become religious because they have reached a point in their lives when they need something bigger than themselves. people who are religious don't tend to be religious, they are religious. maybe you meant people who have been exposed to a religion as part of their day to day lives as children tend towards participating in that religion out of choice as an adult.
hmm, i would question these studies based on this thought, when are these beliefs set?
the person i am now is not the person i was when i was 20. the beliefs i had when i was 25 are different from those mine as a 40 year old. many people who were brought up in the church as children, left it as teens. some found a different path and some returned. there are plenty of examples of people who were brought up in an atheistic household find belief in a system that they never knew growing up.
most people i have encountered who were very sick or dying, have turned to a belief system to help them cope. the point is that people change as their needs change. i was raised a catholic, i left the church and now i don't go. will i return to catholicism? depends on my needs and how i change as person through life.