2years on the ICU & in trouble with the supervisor who started at the beginning of the year. The new boss frequently pulls me into her office to talk about "concerns". She said other nurses have witnessed me doing things incorrectly, that my charting is wrong, the MD's are becoming less confident/trusting in me, and that I keep making mistakes. She drills me on why I did this or that on a patient I took care of 2-3 weeks ago (as if I could remember...). She has shouted at me in her office and in the hallways a few times. When I ask her why she is concerned, for more details on the situation she's concerned about, or when I ask to look at my charting with her (so I can see what this problem is, and fix it) her response is that she "does not have time" .. or she just changes the subject. She has told me that I had better fix my faults, however, or we were going to head down the disciplinary action road, and if things do not change: termination.
I was shocked... My previous boss gave me positive reviews, commenting that I was consistently "cool, calm, and collected." He corrected me / pointed out my weaknesses when warranted, but with full explanation, and was always supportive & encouraging. I am certified / trained to care for any patient who walked into the ICU. I precept students and new nurses. I get along with my peers, even go out with the crew after work sometimes. I am on two different ICU unit committees. I am a focused worker. I do not understand what I am doing so terribly wrong.
I tried to handle this on my own for awhile, (stayed late to chart every shift, triple checked everything, pushed myself harder and harder to ensure everything was 100% correct)... but the complaints from my supervisor continued and got worse, and now a couple of the charge nurses are following her lead... I eventually confided to 2 nurse friends I trusted. I asked them to review my charting and even "nit-pick" at my nursing practice / patient care and to help me discover these "faults" ...but they said that they had no concerns, as I am always critcally thinking, asking questions when uncertain. They even chuckled with how I practice things in a very "OCD" like fashion - constantly rechecking everything. One of the girls recommended going to HR. Nurse friend #2 disagreed, arguing that they saying on the side of the hospital, not the nurses, and that these things rarely work out well for the nurse.
Fast forward: its been 4 months. I work tomorrow early morning, but am up @ 0130, unable to sleep again because I am dreading work, am anxious about work, and cannot stop thinking about work. I started applying to other positions...which breaks my heart as I loved this job until now and was good at it. I fear getting fired, and my confidence as a critical care nurse is dwindling. I have nightmares about me accidentally killing patients and wake up in the middle of the night in panic. Work never leaves my mind... it consumes me every single day.. Maybe I am placing too much importance on this - it just a job - I tend to be a worst case scenario thinker.. i would hate to lose this position.. I moved over 1000 miles away from home for this job.
I started going to counseling last week. I am exhausted, sleep deprived.... I feel demoralized and torn down. My counselor actually recommended that I go to HR for this situation... I am afraid (never done it... I hear "HR" and think -> "HR is on company side, not on your side" -> "you're just gonna shoot yourself in the foot or get fired if you go to HR")
I need advice... and would appreciate personal examples / stories, if you have them. I am naive, and something like this has never happened to me. Would you recommend HR? Were you afraid of going to them? Have you had experiences going to HR about something similar? What do I even say / where do I start? How else would you address the situation?
I became a Psych NP after suffering through a number of toxic crazies, narcissists, paranoids, passive-aggressive, and every other type of personality disorder in nursing. Some of whom make it into supervisory roles.
After one of these horrendous experiences, the union called me a few days later. The woman said "you are the 5th or 6th person who has left that position in 2 years. We know something is wrong, and we are hoping you can tell us what it is"
Having been gaslit on more than one occasion, I needed therapy, and took medication for several years.
There are a ton of mentally ill people in this world who look fine on the outside.
I'm adding my 2 cents though I believe you are headed in the right direction. If you are pulled in to another "corrective" meeting, I agree it is probably in-advisable to secretly record it. One possibly acceptable alternative would be for you to say something to the effect of; "I really want to remember your advice, so I am going to be taking notes" and do so in her full view. At the end of the meeting, look at the notes and state (and write) a plan, something like: "Manager Smith expressed concerns about my charting deficits and I agreed to review any specific examples of my deficient charting as well as examples of ideal charting". "Manager Smith stated . (whatever complaint presented) . . and I would like to work on that issue so I asked for a follow up meeting where specific incidents can be reviewed with step-by-step recommendations for improvement"
I mean, if she's a real manager, and following legitimate grievance procedures, she should not be calling you in without a step-by-step mutually agreed upon improvement plan (action plan, whatever it is called at your facility).
Having said all that, be on an intensive look out for a new job because most of the time, the damage is not worth the fight.
Wanted to provide an update. Hopefully sharing this will be helpful.
I ended up leaving ICU several weeks after the last threat of termination.
The morning of my last shift on the ICU, my boss pulled me into her office again to “chat." I had just finished my last back to back night shift for the week and was very tired, but she wanted to talk before I left for the day and she said it could not wait. I followed her to her office, sat down and listened as she bombarded me with all the reasons she felt that critical care was not for me. She towered over me and then would pace back and forth as she shared her very many feelings. I was very confused, felt small and pathetic. I was fed up with hearing all of this very unhelpful and generalized “criticism” and “feedback.”
Despite my hard work and hoop jumping, it was not enough. Prior to going into the office for this “chat” that morning, I was in my patient room listening to my patient as he thanked me for taking such great care of him. My second patient next was in septic shock. I busted my butt that night, and the end of my shift, he was sedated, intubated, with blood cultures obtained, ABX started, electrolytes replaced, CXR done, EKG done, follow up blood work done, 6 continuous infusions all running at appropriate rates/labeled/bagsFULL!, tube feeds initiated…the patient alive … sick but stable.. and care handed off. Both on-coming nurses were set up for success. To-do list was done. Everything documented. Rooms were stocked and clean. My neighbor nurse thanked me for helping her take care of some things that had come up with her own patient that night. It was a good night.
And yet, there I was in the office being told once again that I was “not cut out” for this kind of nursing… instead, she said things such as “we gotta do something”, “change something,” and my “nursing practice is under increased scrutiny,”… she has “reasons to be concerned about my practice,” she told me that I am "under disciplinary action," and it "will result in termination if continued"..
When she finally stopped talking I asked to go home. When she tried to stop me from leaving, I calmly but sternly said I was happy to discuss this further if she insisted, but needed sleep. We could talk later.
I gave myself a couple days to rest, think, and receive advice before going to HR. When I went to HR, I explained the situation very matter of fact. I told HR about the chats / meetings about my "poor performance", the frequency, that the supervisor would request to talk before work, during work, after shift, even called or texted me sometimes on my off days. I showed HR the texts and phone call history. I shared the things I have done to improve my practice and examples of attempts to resolve the issue. I expressed confusion and stress. I pointed out the contrast to how I was doing before and where I stand now. HR reviewed my certifications, committee involvement, progression, and positive performance evals submitted by previous unit supervisors. I asked questions about the hospital’s disciplinary action / termination process. HR confirmed that I had nothing on my record - the only negative performance evaluation received was the one from the current supervisor. They had no active warnings, actions, nor anything that pointed to termination. HR asked me what I wanted to do. I asked what my options were. HR escalated the issue. I was internally transferred to another unit. It was not a unit I chose, but it would allow me to continue working and get me out of the other unit right away. On the new unit the people are nice and my schedule is amazing - no more rotating shifts, weekends, nights, etc. I see old co-workers often at the hospital on my way in or out of work, and will stop to chat, give a hug, etc. I hang out with a couple work friends when our schedules line up. Many have left the unit and others plan to leave. They say the unit has changed. I have been told that the supervisor got in trouble. I've been told there's a lot of drama on the unit. I do not ask for details as it's probably best to know little, let go, leave it all behind... just focus on doing well and fitting into the new unit.
I am still in counseling. I miss ICU but am relieved that there will be no more chats... I can handle sick and dying patients, the fast pace, the MDs demanding things and staring at me as I carry out their orders as efficiently as possible while still being safe. I know drips and advanced therapies and protocols by heart. I can deal with the "depressing and hopeless cases." I can spend days caring for a patient, get to know them, earn their trust, offer hope to them and their families and then face it head on when that patient has died, console the family, prepare the body for the morgue, and leave my shift with a sense of peace. I have had difficult shifts, long shifts, heart breaking shifts and shifts that nearly broke me.
I still have a hard time articulating exactly what happened and moving on from it. It was slow, persistent, tricky, ruthless, and occurred over a 5-6th month period of time. At the end I felt torn down, misguided, and set up for failure. Before all of this I had showed up to my job with discipline, certain habits / practices (safeguards) that allowed me confidently in the ICU (with a healthy dose of questioning & alertness), and leave work at work. This situation with my boss involved tearing me away from those practices, constantly. The practices and foundation my preceptors had drilled into me were constantly questioned and picked apart by my supervisor, leaving me highly anxious, stressed, and uncertain. I could not shake the stress, my health was impacted, and realized that the longer I tried to grit and bear through the situation like I was, the more it would just hurt me. I was also increasing the risk that I would make a mistake / patient care would suffer if I continued to just push through. I hope that counseling, working day shifts in a new environment + some extra self care will help to rebuild my confidence, learn, move on, and grow stronger.
@BeatsPerMinute You have gone through so much and come out the other end. The usual thing that happens with such toxic managers is that their staff simply flees (and I think that was my advice). I can only hope I would be as brave as you were and address the issue with HR. Sadly, I don't think your old supervisor is done damaging good nurses; sad that hospitals are often too slow to recognize things like this. The fact that you made an official report may be helpful in the end but in the meanwhile good for you for moving on with a rather positive attitude.
Specializes in Psych, Corrections, Med-Surg, Ambulatory.
I'm so glad you've landed on your feet and had a productive chat with HR. Use this time to recoup and regroup without a toxic ***** dogging you for her own sick purposes.
I have a sneaking suspicion you'll find yourself back in ICU at some point, after HR has had a chance to delouse the house. It would be a bummer for the ICU patients not to have someone like you around.
Specializes in icu,prime care,mri,ct, cardiology, pacu,.
Continue with the counseling and you may need meds too. You’re going through a ptsd situation from the old manager. Similar situation with me, I got out. My manager cleaned house, then was told to pick up the slack at the bedside. She couldn’t/wouldn’t do it and left. Unfortunately a lot of good nurses left. Karma comes around. Continue to heal, take care of yourself. You may find a new Joy in your new role. Good luck.?
Sounds like HR worked the way it should for once ?
Good for you! Despite all the stress, you took care of you (keep up the counseling), made a proactive move and ended up in a good place. Whether or not it is permanent, it is what you need at this point in time. Kudos.
I had one manager who would pull me aside; she came to the dept. long after me, didn't like my being in charge, and when she moved up the ladder (which I have consistently refused to do): took the opportunity to tell me on many occasions just what was wrong with me, and even pulling political comments in. (Just how did Bush and Obama have anything to do with anything in the dept?). I'm still there, she's long gone. But oh my the stress. I'm happy things are working out for you {{hug}}
The old manager has been let go. I feel mostly peace and occasional bitterness. I still do not understand the motivation behind everything.
I am settling into my role ok - each week that goes by I get a litte bit better. The new leader accepted me with awareness of my situation (to what extent I do not know). I am extremely grateful for her patience, kindness and encouragement. She shared with my that she observes my patient care and that she has no concerns about that - just that it would be good to relax a bit, though she says it'll take some time... considering everything...
Some days are difficult and I walk into the hospital with severe anxiety for absolutely no reason. I just feel fearful and anxious and think about what I was told by my old supervisor. I still think about my old supervisor's accusations and believing that I was going to miss something / make a mistake that would lead to permanent injury or death of a patient... threats of how everything "could lead to this or that... that we could go to court" (all for hypothetical things.. things that never actually happened). My old supervisor just feared it and was focused on it, and I listened. I thought I should listen to the old supervisor considering the many more years of experience compared to me... I am a baby nurse with only a few years under my belt. Old manager got me to believe that I should be afraid, too. Being driven by fear is miserable.
I still have flashbacks of patients dying and am tempted to think to mysef "DID I miss something or make a mistake? What if I did?" But those thoughts are not as frequent as before, and I am able to return back to the situations with a more factual / realistic point of view, and am growing a little more confident and calmer each day.
I am still in counseling and on medications to help me relax.
I recently learned of another who was in a similar situation as me - they had been there for 20+ years - and were forced out. I looked up to this person. The public story was "looking for a change". In private, I heard the entire story. It was helpful to exchange experiences - it was validating for me. I did my best to be encouraging, positive and hopeful for him in reminding him of all the good he did.
Well, it sounds like things went way better than I would have anticipated but I'm a "crusty old bat" who expects little from upper management.
Seriously though, I am glad you are continuing with therapy. It is completely possible for us to have PTSD from job situations and unfortunately sometimes it is our coworkers who wound us. Give it time and continue to take care of yourself. I wish you peace?️
Well, it sounds like things went way better than I would have anticipated but I'm a "crusty old bat" who expects little from upper management.
Seriously though, I am glad you are continuing with therapy. It is completely possible for us to have PTSD from job situations and unfortunately sometimes it is our coworkers who wound us. Give it time and continue to take care of yourself. I wish you peace?️
Will do ❤️ thank you
I also did not expect much help, nor for things to play out this way. The whole experience was unfortunate, however could have been way, way worse.
Oldmahubbard
1,487 Posts
I became a Psych NP after suffering through a number of toxic crazies, narcissists, paranoids, passive-aggressive, and every other type of personality disorder in nursing. Some of whom make it into supervisory roles.
After one of these horrendous experiences, the union called me a few days later. The woman said "you are the 5th or 6th person who has left that position in 2 years. We know something is wrong, and we are hoping you can tell us what it is"
Having been gaslit on more than one occasion, I needed therapy, and took medication for several years.
There are a ton of mentally ill people in this world who look fine on the outside.