ADVICE for Students in Ontario RPN vs RN

[NUNurse007]

I have seen many threads, students asking advice/opinion on weather they should take the RPN or RN program.

I just wanted to share my experience and opinion on this subject as a RPN. I completed the 2 year full-time Diploma in Southwest Ontario, but if I could go back I would have definitely opted for the BScN program instead. I would like to share why.

When I decided on this route I never expected that my nursing ambitions and skills would supersede the opportunities that are available for RPN's in this part of Ontario. They are AGES behind when it comes to utilization of the RPN to their full scope of practice.

At the time I couldn't attend a 4-year full-time program because of the demands of my home life. Plus I thought, especially as I went through the program, that I would have a variety of choices as to what areas of nursing I would work in once I gained more experience. I have since learned that this is not the case, at least not in my area.

There are still many RN's (and general public) who do not understand the skills and education that RPN have received in nursing school and many facilities who are still not allowing RPNs to work to their full scope. RPN's are an autonomous profession who work under the EXACT same standards of nursing as RN's. There is no hierarchal system; it is simply based on experience and skill set. Which, most NEW GRAD RN's, can never have the skills set, experience and knowledge I do after this many years of actually working on busy acute floors as a nurse. And of course management opportunities are usually only available to RN's.

Because of this I have since decided to enroll in a part-time bridging program through Ryerson University to obtain my RN. I have also found that the pay difference is very unfair, and should also be based on experience and skill set. For example why should I get paid $25/hr verses $35/hr to start the exact same IV and push the exact same meds! I also have the same patient load as the RN for less money, I find this very unfair.

So if I had to advice anyone who is debating what route to take, I would say if you plan to work in this area (Ontario), just go for your BScN. Had I done this out of the gate, I would have been done by now and would not have to suffer through so much frustration and dissatisfaction with nursing.

I do not want to take any credit away from the RN (especially since I'm going to become one ) I give credit where credit is due, and if I received the respect I deserve as an RPN than I would have been happy keeping my designation.

So if you can and have the opportunity to do a full-time 4 year program, than MY ADVICE ... DO IT!! And what ever you choose remember we are ALL still NURSES!!!

Btw, RPN is the same as LPN in the rest of Canada ... And the RPN/LPN scope of practice in the USA, is not anything like the training in Canada.

[burberry]

I understand that rpns are getting paid less for doing generally the same tasks but it is also significant to consider the education difference, tuition fee and also the difference in knowledge. If the difference between pay is based on just the task then it would not be fair that we are getting paid less than physicians as nurses work more physically. These days the pay is usually based on the education and the degree. Rpns are skillfully but they don't have enough theory and research to help them guide their practice.

[Silverdragon102, BSN]

Rpns are skillfully but they don't have enough theory and research to help them guide their practice.

What do you base this on? They too have a scope of practice and they too can do their theory and research but just because they are not a RN doesn't mean they can't do their job. I have met many LPN's whether it is in Canada or in the UK and they could run rings round some of the RN's that they worked with. For many they didn't want to do bridge to RN or go straight for RN due to a few things like finance, family or it didn't fit in their lifestyle at that particular moment

[burberry]

I never said rpns don't have any knowledge but it is significant to note that year 3 and 4 RNs mostly build on their theory and research. My friends who were in the RPN program did know their skills maybe even better than RNs but they lacked the critical thinking skills and reasoning behind it. As my professor says 'she can teach even a monkey to learn a skill'

[burberry]

I am also surprised how Lotta people say that new RN grads are less prepared than rpns new grad in terms of skills because Rn students spend 3 years of clinical placements and also spend more time in one placement for usually about 14 weeks. Rpns spend only few weeks and they just bump around not actually getting to examine the floor and understand what goes on the floor. But I am not saying rpns are not nurses or any of that sort. I believe they are in their own respect have enough competency.I just feel the pay is fair

[Trishrpn80]

I am also surprised how Lotta people say that new RN grads are less prepared than rpns new grad in terms of skills because Rn students spend 3 years of clinical placements and also spend more time in one placement for usually about 14 weeks. Rpns spend only few weeks and they just bump around not actually getting to examine the floor and understand what goes on the floor. But I am not saying rpns are not nurses or any of that sort. I believe they are in their own respect have enough competency.I just feel the pay is fair

Hahaha we bump around the floor for a couple of weeks. You really have NO clue. Seeing as you have 3 posts under your belt and all three are against RPN's I am not going to even get frustrated as you are a TROLL.

I am an RPN. I graduated from a school that provided me with education that helped me to develop critical thinking skills, conduct research, and apply my knowledge to provide high quality evidenced based nursing care to my patients. I have helped plenty of new grad RN's in their knowledge and likewise they have helped me. We work TOGETHER. Unfortunately, the pay disparity is a real issue and has been for years. Not everyone wants to be an RN. They still have the knowledge and skill and should be paid appropriately.

[loriangel14, RN]

I never said rpns don't have any knowledge but it is significant to note that year 3 and 4 RNs mostly build on their theory and research. My friends who were in the RPN program did know their skills maybe even better than RNs but they lacked the critical thinking skills and reasoning behind it. As my professor says 'she can teach even a monkey to learn a skill'

Are you calling us monkeys?

[Fiona59]

Troll got free from under the bridge.

Either that or a very insecure university student who needs to put down others in order to feel good.

[Trishrpn80]

Lori - the above troll ahem i mean poster is also stating that RPN's lack critical thinking skills.

Oh well this lowly RPN is now leaving this thread until someone else actually wants to provide useful comments or has a valid question.

I abide by what the zoo tells me so i am no longer feeding the troll

[FutureRPN]

Very inappropriate by comparing RPNs with monkeys

[JerryPollard]

Well I graduated from the pn program about a year and a half ago. I got hired right out of school in a hospital setting on my temp.lic. I can tell you I have had RPN students and rn students in 3 rd yr and consolidation and you can't tell them apart by way of skills or critical thinking. Critical thinking comes with time on the floor as a bedside nurse. It is developed with experience. First the students usually are more task orientated until experience sets in....now some people have better initial critical thinking skills than others dispute their educational avenue. That being said I am currently upgrading my RPN to bscn as I have any to get into more advanced nursing and later teaching at a university as a professor.

[iwanabeanurse]

I dont get why so many Rpns are so buthurt? Do you guys really expect to get paid more even though you didnt get the same education? Its a university degree for a reason, you cant just get paid the same as an RN because youve been working for a long time, it may look like rns and Rpns are doing the same thing but theyre not, or they legally shouldnt be. For example, rpns are not supposed to take care of unstable patients, and imo thats enough to pay rpns less. The unstable patient is where the real critical thinking happens, its life or death not just skills like hanging meds and giving pills. An Rpn most likely doesnt deal with code blues, which can be very stressful. It only looks like RNs and Rpns do the same thing until an emergency happens and recognizing how to pick up on signs of approaching emergency. Most of the jobs of Rpns dont compare to critical care Rns, like a nursing home does not compare to an RN working in ICU, ER or med surg, on my floor we do have Rpns which are probably the most skilled an Rpn can get but their assignments are the easier ones, they dont deal with the serious stuff and if they do its unexpected and the rpns assignment would be changed and the unstable pt would be given to the RN.

[iwanabeanurse]

If you are an Rpn and youre getting unstable patients then go complain to your union because its not in your scope of practise to care for unstable pts. Some one also commented saying theyre an rpn and can start IVs and push meds??? Not sure where youre working but thats not allowed, RNs are allowed to do these skills because theyve been taught more in depth about these procedures nad know what can go wrong if done incorectly, its not just skills, its the science behind it. I think the frustration comes from employers letting their rpns do more than they were intended to do. An RN and RPN are not the same job, one is more stressful and deals with more critical patients. Even the courses are way different, the anatomy they Rpns do is nothing like what the Rns do, I did a condensed anatomy college ourse before going into uni and that course was 1 semester and the rpns take it over the span of 2 semesters, that college anatomy class only covered probably only half of one of the THREE anatomy courses that RNs take in 1st yr, and what it did cover was very on the surface, I was familiar with a lot of the concepts of my 1st uni anatomy course but the no where near as detailed as the uni class went into. Its like in college they told you what a kidney is and what its for, in uni you know what it is, what it does, how it does it and all the things that can go wrong with it.