NY State may require nurses to obtain 4-year degrees - page 2

But some worry that an already severe shortage will become worse. New York is mulling over a requirement that would force all RNs to earn a bachelor's degree in order to keep their RN... Read More

  1. by   subee
    Quote from Jailhouse RN
    It will not come to pass. BSN programs are lacking in hands on. They center on menagement.....We have enough of them already.....
    And they concentrate too much on spelling.
  2. by   PennyLane
    Quote from subee
    And they concentrate too much on spelling.
    Ouch! :uhoh21:
  3. by   Alnamvet
    The good thing, though, is that any bachelor's will do..for those with bachelors in other fields, no problem. Some may want the opportunity to pursue a bachelors in psych, for example, where this major would have more to do with psych nursing than a generic bsn. Social work would be another area for those inclined towards case management. Speaking of management, for those future office weenies, why not a bachelors in business or accounting? Interested in epidimeology? heck, a bachelors in the biological sciences is perfect. Want to be a forensic nurse examiner? Go to John J College of Criminal Justice, and get a bachelors in criminology. As long as it's a bchelors degree that you can use in your practice, I don't think 10 years to obtain it is a burden. Now if you don't plan on staying in NY, your ADN is no different than a bsn...they both accomplish the same thing, except for the addition of community health and an assessment course. Personally, I don't think it will fly, atleast not any time soon. North Dakota just got rid of that requirement.
  4. by   Sheri257
    As long as they don't make it an immediate requirement, it wouldn't be so bad. If they tried to do that in California, it would be a disaster. California has 70 ADN programs versus 20 BSNs. Talk about a nursing shortage.

    I'm not sure why any bachelor's would do. The study they cited examined BSNs, so that would seem to thwart the primary justification for all of this.

    Just about every state university in California has either implemented an online ADN-BSN program or has plans to do so. So, given a 10 year time frame, that hopefully wouldn't be too bad since you have to do continuing education anyway. Those progams are cheaper too, and most employers pay for them.

    I tend to agree with this somewhat, but I think it should probably be a BSN requirement, not any bachelors. Hell, I could go get a bachelor's in home ecomonics and that would supposedly make me a better nurse?

  5. by   Alnamvet
    [QUOTE=lizz]As long as they don't make it an immediate requirement, it wouldn't be so bad. If they tried to do that in California, it would be a disaster. California has 70 ADN programs versus 20 BSNs. Talk about a nursing shortage.

    I'm not sure why any bachelor's would do. The study they cited examined BSNs, so that would seem to thwart the primary justification for all of this.

    Just about every state university in California has either implemented an online ADN-BSN program or has plans to do so. So, given a 10 year time frame, that hopefully wouldn't be too bad since you have to do continuing education anyway. Those progams are cheaper too, and most employers pay for them.

    I tend to agree with this somewhat, but I think it should probably be a BSN requirement, not any bachelors. Hell, I could go get a bachelor's in home ecomonics and that would supposedly make me a better nurse?

    [/



    It might help if you aspire to being a diabetes educator, or a home health nurse. BTW, it is any bachelors...all graduate nursing schools in NYS require a bachelors degree, and if not a bsn, they ask that you have a course in health assessment and community health, both waiverable through testing out or experience. New York is not so anal as to think that the bsn is the only valid preparation for graduate nursing studies.
    Last edit by Alnamvet on Apr 14, '04
  6. by   Sheri257
    Quote from Alnamvet
    New York is not so anal as to think that the bsn is the only valid preparation for graduate nursing studies.
    Yes, but the study they cite in the article concerned BSNs. I read it. Isn't that the reason for this requirement?

    It seems contradictory, to say the least, to allow some other bachelor's degree, when the primary justification is a study based on BSNs.

    Not to mention, the whole argument has always been about ADN versus BSN, not ADN and some other bachelor's degree.

    Last edit by Sheri257 on Apr 15, '04
  7. by   pama
    Just another attempt to eliminate the ADN program. In all the recommendations for BSN as the entry level they fail to inform the public and legislators the ADN program is the only one based on research. The research behind the implementation of the ADN is the reason the programs have been extremely successful for 50+ years and will continue to be successful!

    I will be surprised if this occurs in NY. Especially since ND no longer requires the BSN as entry.
  8. by   kathc
    Another one that thinks this is a bad idea. Right now I'm attending LPN school in NY, but I plan on getting my RN in the next few years. I agree that it will only hurt the nursing shortage. From the article I read they based looking at this due to a study that many feel is flawed. This type of requirement will really make a lot of people think twice about getting their RN - especially those looking at nursing as a new career after working for 10 or 20 years.
    I figure by the time the state gets around to looking at it and maybe implementing it, I will hopefully have my RN. At that point I can work on the extra two years they require.
  9. by   trent
    Nurses in the province on Ontario now have only the choice of BSN to obtain their RN licence. The major reasons that have been cited for this change are:
    1. professionalism (Other professionals have Bachelor degrees and if nurses want to be treated as professional equals it makes sense that they should too)
    2. keeping pace with the technological side of nursing (nurses need to know more now than ever before, so they should understand what they are doing and why)
    3. there was a study done (I don't know where or by who, it just keeps being mentioned at school) that found that patients had fewer complications if they were treated by BSN RNs
    4. critical thinking skills are emphasized more at the university level.
    There are not MY reasons, these are the reasons cited by the Ontario government and the faculty in my program. I'd be interested to hear your opinions.

    trent

    Edited to add: If you got your RN licence before June 2004 you don't NEED to do the RN-BSN classes, although it is recommended. You can't lose your job for not having a BSN.
    Last edit by trent on Apr 15, '04
  10. by   OC_An Khe
    I think it is a good idea and about time. It should have no impact on the shortage and in fact may help releive the shortage in the long run.
  11. by   beth07
    Quote from Jailhouse RN
    It will not come to pass. BSN programs are lacking in hands on. They center on menagement.....We have enough of them already.....
    Hi everyone, i'm a first time user here and I'd just like to give my opinion on this. I know this is a common misconception among a lot of individuals, and it really at times, gets on my nerves. We have one management class yes, but we also have a lot more clinical time required than other nursing degrees. Right now, I'm in my last semester and I have 24-32 hours of clinical a week and they have ranged from critical care to going along and doing medical assessments on CPS cases. A good BSN program is NOT lacking in hands on. We actually have more clinical hours than other programs. I'm not at all trying to put down people who have worked hard for their degree, but two more years is nothing to sneeze at. It is hard work. Glad to be here!
  12. by   VivaLasViejas
    I can't imagine any self-respecting ADN taking this one lying down. I know this for sure, if anyone tried to "downgrade" me to LPN after years of experience as an RN, they'd have one hell of a fight on their hands!! :angryfire I don't care how many good reasons there are to make a BSN the entry level degree for registered nurses: you don't deprive someone of their title or their livelihood because they're too old, don't have the time, have been out of school too long, or can't afford to pursue a four-year degree.

    Frankly, I'd be happy to go back for a bachelor's if someone would a) finance the extra two years, b) support my family while I do it, and c) explain to me why I need statistics and calculus to function at the bedside as a staff RN.

    'Nuff said. :stone
  13. by   oramar
    This is what I am thinking, it is the implied insult to non BSN nurse in the proposed law that gets everyone upset. Why in the world do they have to insist that existing RNs need futher schooling. If they must pass a law like this it they need to set a date in the future like 20 years. Write a law that states after that date every one coming out of nursing school has to be coming out of BSN program. Under no circumstances should they tamper with the livelyhood of anyone that graduates from non BSN program before that date. You just can't go retro
    and try to force people that have been out of the school for many years back into college, it just won't fly. They have been trying to do this in PA for years and years and it just never happens because the people who try to write these laws are not realistic. None of this affects me in anyway, I have maybe 5 years left to work and that is on a very casual basis and none of these laws have a chance of passing for years and years.

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