LPN goin beyond scope of practice

  1. 1 LPN was doing assessments and discharges on patients. This is beyond her scope of practice but no patients have been harmed as a result of this so if reported the BON will most likely just "tap her on the hand" right? Nursing Staff development came and told her to stop doing it and she has stopped. I figure as long as she nows realizes she shouldn't be doing it, no harm no foul correct?

    My only issue is that our Nurse Manager knew she would be doing these things and still hired her in the department and knowingly allowed her to do these tasks??? Its like she didn't care that this could potentially get this nurse and herself in trouble? Or maybe she feels like its not that big a deal and no serious actions would ever be taken if it were ever to be reported?

    Should I bother or not?
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  3. Visit  SweetheartRN} profile page

    About SweetheartRN

    Joined Dec '10; Posts: 165; Likes: 196.

    46 Comments so far...

  4. Visit  TheCommuter} profile page
    17
    I do not see where the problem lies. I suppose it is because I live in a state where LPNs/LVNs are permitted to perform assessments if it is cosigned by any staff RN within 24 hours. They are also permitted to discharge patients.

    I also do not see the harm in this practice because I have met way too many RNs with weak assessment skills and an equal number of LPNs with wonderful assessment skills.
    NoAverageLPN, SarahDreams, nurse0520, and 14 others like this.
  5. Visit  Chin up} profile page
    14
    Why do you feel the need to report this? I really don't believe this is in your, "scope of business". Also, I am an LPN and that is what I am paid to do every day. It is within my scope of practice and I am better than most at it. Why, the position was pushed on me along with a hefty raise. Peace!
    egglady, nwootenLPN, frankiebaby, and 11 others like this.
  6. Visit  ladybuglouRN} profile page
    3
    In my state(NY) LPN's are absolutely not allowed to assess or discharge patients. They are allowed to collect data and consult with the RN about what they have collected but the RN has the final say. I'm sure there are a lot of great LPN's out there but if you are in NY and want to assess, have to become an RN!
  7. Visit  *Posh*} profile page
    7
    Quote from Chin up
    Why do you feel the need to report this? I really don't believe this is in your, "scope of business". Also, I am an LPN and that is what I am paid to do every day. It is within my scope of practice and I am better than most at it. Why, the position was pushed on me along with a hefty raise. Peace!
    I agree... Where I'm from, LPN's can do admission assessments with an RN's co-signature and discharges all day long. Are you really considering reporting this nurse to the BON for this? Ridiculous...
    Chin up, nurse0520, cebollita, and 4 others like this.
  8. Visit  nursel56} profile page
    4
    Quote from SweetheartRN
    LPN was doing assessments and discharges on patients. This is beyond her scope of practice but no patients have been harmed as a result of this
    Well, that's a relief! :uhoh21: I suggest if you are that concerned you familiarize yourself with the scope of practice laws for your state which very likely can be located all on your own in a couple of minutes. Facility policy is not the same as scope of practice.

    What do you hope will happen? She'll go to jail and you will get the job?
    Last edit by nursel56 on Mar 25, '11
    Chin up, nurse0520, Anica78, and 1 other like this.
  9. Visit  SweetheartRN} profile page
    0
    Quote from TheCommuter
    I do not see where the problem lies. I suppose it is because I live in a state where LPNs/LVNs are permitted to perform assessments if it is cosigned by any staff RN within 24 hours. They are also permitted to discharge patients.

    I also do not see the harm in this practice because I have met way too many RNs with weak assessment skills and an equal number of LPNs with wonderful assessment skills.
    Thankyou for your objectice post. She was not having RN staff cosign at all. I guess if it really weren't any harm Nusing Staff Development would have told her to continue doing what she was doing but they didn't.
  10. Visit  SweetheartRN} profile page
    2
    Quote from Chin up
    Why do you feel the need to report this? I really don't believe this is in your, "scope of business". Also, I am an LPN and that is what I am paid to do every day. It is within my scope of practice and I am better than most at it. Why, the position was pushed on me along with a hefty raise. Peace!
    Glad you are familiar with the laws in your state. I'm sure you are an amazing nurse.
    IMHO The problem with not following rules however is people only begin interested in doing so when something goes south. No one ever reports anything until something goes horribly wrong and then its too late. Will anything ever go horribly wrong in this situation? More than likely not. But if you become accoustomed to not following laws in an area that will probably not cause patient harm you may continue to go further in that territory and then what if somthing bad happens? When I was an LPN I followed my scope of practice. I'm not holding anybody at a higher standard than I did for myself.

    Posh--Thanks for your opinion.

    Nursel56--I already know the scope of practice which is why I stated in my first post, "This is beyond her scope of practice." I am an RN so no I do not want her job.
    Last edit by SweetheartRN on Mar 25, '11
    CoffeeGeekRN and NurseLoveJoy88 like this.
  11. Visit  caliotter3} profile page
    1
    Stay out of it. Apparently the nurse manager who knew this was going on was ok with it. As long as it is now stopped, no reason for you to bring attention to yourself, possibly jeopardizing your own job.
    Anica78 likes this.
  12. Visit  mehitabela} profile page
    5
    Where I work LPNs not only assess and discharge patients, they also admit them. Do you work LTC because the parameters are different there...at least in my state.
    Chin up, nurse0520, cherryblossom88, and 2 others like this.
  13. Visit  Nascar nurse} profile page
    3
    Quote from SweetheartRN
    Glad you are familiar with the laws in your state. I'm sure you are an amazing nurse.
    IMHO The problem with not following rules however is people only begin interested in doing so when something goes south. No one ever reports anything until something goes horribly wrong and then its too late. Will anything ever go horribly wrong in this situation? More than likely not. But if you become accoustomed to not following laws in an area that will probably not cause patient harm you may continue to go further in that territory and then what if somthing bad happens? When I was an LPN I followed my scope of practice. I'm not holding anybody at a higher standard than I did for myself.

    I could easily spend all day, everyday looking for someone not following the rules and would surely find many many examples of problems. I have learned to pick my battles wisely and mind my own business 99% of the time. I would drive myself (and everyone around me) nuts otherwise.

    I agree with you, it's wrong if it is not allowed within your states scope of practice. Someone has corrected the problem. What would be your motive for notifying the BOM now? It sounds as if you are the playing the part of nurse police..a job you will be very busy with. I can't help but ask...do you have a personal grudge against the nurse or manager?
    Chin up, JacknSweetpea, and Anica78 like this.
  14. Visit  SweetheartRN} profile page
    0
    Quote from ladybuglouRN
    In my state(NY) LPN's are absolutely not allowed to assess or discharge patients. They are allowed to collect data and consult with the RN about what they have collected but the RN has the final say. I'm sure there are a lot of great LPN's out there but if you are in NY and want to assess, have to become an RN!
    Are they allowed to assess and discharge with a cosignature from an RN in NY?
  15. Visit  nursel56} profile page
    1
    Quote from SweetheartRN
    . . .Nursel56--I already know the scope of practice which is why I stated in my first post, "This is beyond her scope of practice." I am an RN so no I do not want her job.
    Oh-- I'm sorry, I thought you were talking about the LPN who was hired for that outpatient peds clinic job that you wanted. Sorry for jumping to conclusions. Who does skilled nursing care in homes in your state? Are RNs in all charge positions in the LTCs in your state?
    Chin up likes this.


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