Attitudes towards LPN's - page 6

Hi, I am a nursing student, and after year 1 of my RN, Ive realized I can't afford to finish RN so I'm doing the 2 year LPN course instead. One day I do hope to upgrade but for now it will just be... Read More

  1. Visit  Circejane} profile page
    6
    I'm speaking of a US ADN RN (lots of letters there!) vs. an LPN. I can only assume, as I'm not there yet, that the theory and research courses that make up so much of the upper level BSN coursework help enhance a nurse's expertise, but I'm talking about the BIG jump in the amount of clinical knowledge between the LPN and ADN.

    My personal experience and opinion might have to do with my school--the ADN program here is pretty tough, with more prereqs than many other schools. Pathophysiology is a prereq for the RN level, as well as two semesters of advanced A&P (vs. the Essentials of A&P needed for the LPN certificate program). Our school also has many more clinical hours than are required by the state (MI), and it really makes a difference. Grads of our school have a reputation for being able to hit the ground running much better than some other schools with fewer clinical hours.

    Most of the nurses that I'm speaking of in clinicals are ADNs, but some are BSNs, and one is an MSN. I loved the LPNs that I worked with, but if I asked them "what exactly are the implications of a low serum albumin?" or "why are patients with leg fractures so much more prone to DVT and PE than, say, arm fractures?" or "how exactly do corticosteroids raise the WBC, and how long does that last once meds are discontinued?" I would get answers that I would later find out were either incomplete or incorrect, while the RNs just had more knowledge of the hows and whys and whats of everything.

    I hear a lot of LPNs stating that the ADN is just the same coursework over again for another year, but I have to disagree. I see it like this--when I was a CNA, I knew that the LPNs at my LTC knew a lot, but I really didn't realize how MUCH they had to learn to be LPNs until I got into the nursing program myself. Now that I'm in the RN program, it's the same thing--I knew that RNs knew more, but I didn't realize how MUCH more until I really got into it. I'm sure that this travels all the way up through DNP, and of course common sense and other nursing skills play a huge role. We all know someone who is excellent in the classroom and not so great on the floor, and vice versa.

    I guess I'm just saying that I'd like to see respect on both sides of the issue--respect towards LPNs for how much they have learned and all that they can do, and respect from LPNs for RNs for the additional knowledge and responsibilities that they have. We've all worked hard to be nurses.
    ns lpn, dishes, andreaskyeLVN, and 3 others like this.
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  3. Visit  Fiona59} profile page
    1
    Dear Mods:

    Could we please move this thread to the CANADIAN forum where it belongs?
    linzz likes this.
  4. Visit  linzz} profile page
    0
    Thank you for clarifying your position, sometimes it gets blurred between Canadian and US nursing requirements as there seems to be some differences there.

    Like yourself, I am also an advocate of respect and teamwork among all levels and I intend to keep this attitude even after I comlete my BSN, which will be my second degree, sigh!

    I wish you the best in your career.
  5. Visit  pagandeva2000} profile page
    2
    I would HOPE that the RN has a higher level of education that goes along with the pay and additional responsibility. No one is saying that the level of education between LPNs and RNs is identical-it would not make sense. What I am saying is not to disrespect the title and give the attitude that we do not belong, have nothing to contribute or are lazy and unambitious people. There is a big difference, I think.

    Also, it does not mean that an LPN that does NOT want that additional responsibility or stress deserves to feel that she does not belong in the health care setting at all. Again, I often see that it is easy for many to say that a good CNA is worth their weight in gold, but (at least from what I see), many say that it is too much trouble or inconvienent to work with an LPN. Now, if one wants to say that a lazy, careless employee of ANY title is too much trouble, I am sure everyone can agree.
    Fiona59 and andreaskyeLVN like this.
  6. Visit  JDCitizen} profile page
    1
    Regrettably this thread only goes to show that its not a just US problem or just a Canadian problem:
    - Nurses spend a lot of time eating their own.
    - Nurses spend a lot of time looking down at other nurses with different levels of education.

    Here in the US it is more than just RN vs LPN, it’s also RN vs RN (ADN/BSN), in the past it was almost any nurse vs diploma nurses... Its also BSN vs MSN and now with the doctorate level of training we add a new level of argument....

    My experience in the past as a floor nurse: If the unit secretary, the orderly, the CNA, the LPN and/or RN did not show up/did not pull their load my night usually went worse than necessary. Unfortunately when my night went bad I was not the only one suffering.

    When we all get along and do our jobs the patient benefits.
    pagandeva2000 likes this.
  7. Visit  andreaskyeLVN} profile page
    1
    You know I was really excited to find this forum until I started reading this thread. Granted, not all of you are negative, but some are. Ack, I am done.
    Let me just say, at the facility I am at, I train RNs trying to come in on the floor.
    I will agree that the biology, A and P, etc are there in the RN's education, and that is great and I have the due respect for them.
    But ask me in the hospital if I want a new RN to administer a med or insert a cath, or an experienced LVN, give me the LVN.

    We were trained in the skills. That was our focus and most of us are pretty darn good at it. Geez. Arrogance.
    pagandeva2000 likes this.
  8. Visit  TheCommuter} profile page
    1
    Quote from Fiona59
    Dear Mods:

    Could we please move this thread to the CANADIAN forum where it belongs?
    Your request has been granted.
    Fiona59 likes this.
  9. Visit  pagandeva2000} profile page
    0
    Quote from JDCitizen
    Regrettably this thread only goes to show that its not a just US problem or just a Canadian problem:
    - Nurses spend a lot of time eating their own.
    - Nurses spend a lot of time looking down at other nurses with different levels of education.

    Here in the US it is more than just RN vs LPN, it's also RN vs RN (ADN/BSN), in the past it was almost any nurse vs diploma nurses... Its also BSN vs MSN and now with the doctorate level of training we add a new level of argument....

    My experience in the past as a floor nurse: If the unit secretary, the orderly, the CNA, the LPN and/or RN did not show up/did not pull their load my night usually went worse than necessary. Unfortunately when my night went bad I was not the only one suffering.

    When we all get along and do our jobs the patient benefits.
    I have to agree there. I don't think this rift will ever heal 'globally' between different levels of nurses. There are many that can appreciate the differences, but then, there are some that will always feel that they can do without the other. I guess my attitude is that if we can't come together, then, don't interrupt my groove for making an honest living.
  10. Visit  pagandeva2000} profile page
    1
    Quote from andreaskyeLVN
    You know I was really excited to find this forum until I started reading this thread. Granted, not all of you are negative, but some are. Ack, I am done.
    Let me just say, at the facility I am at, I train RNs trying to come in on the floor.
    I will agree that the biology, A and P, etc are there in the RN's education, and that is great and I have the due respect for them.
    But ask me in the hospital if I want a new RN to administer a med or insert a cath, or an experienced LVN, give me the LVN.

    We were trained in the skills. That was our focus and most of us are pretty darn good at it. Geez. Arrogance.
    I agree with you. I have found that no matter what the education is...may it be LPN or above, the new grad is just that...a new grad that needs experience. And, we can learn from everyone.
    Moogie likes this.

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