Should Healthcare Be Funded As A Basic Human Right? - pg.12 | allnurses

Should Healthcare Be Funded As A Basic Human Right? - page 12

The United States of America is a nation known and heralded worldwide for its democracy, freedom, and wealth. Through our commerce, we have become a prosperous nation. Through our commonalities we... Read More

  1. Visit  Fiona59 profile page
    Quote from CountyRat
    Tewdles, it is not a matter of being, "just too bad," The issue is that tradgedy and setbacks are inevitable in this life. My backruptsy five years ago, as a result of the cost of my wife and daughter's medical expenses was one of the worst experiences of my life. The only thing worse was almost loosing my family. However, my troubles are my responsibility, not anyone else's. Facing this hardship (which continues to this day) is my responsibility. It is my job to take care of my family, in good times and bad, and to do so responsibly, without burdenning you or anyone else.

    So, we have not been able to take the vacations we dreamed of, or live in a house as nice as those of others who work as hard as I do. Do I complain or demand that others meet my family's needs? No; that would be childish, selfish, and unrealistic.

    Life throws good and bad at us all. Living well means facing hardship with courage and doing the hard work of building a good life and being as happy as possible in an imperfect world. No law or politician can change that. To imagine that they can is living in a fairy tale, not in the real world. And, looking to others to absorb the pain of life's troubles does not set anyone free, it does the opposite; making us dependent children who never grow up, and so, live the lives or serfs rather than those of free citizens who are able to enjoy our liberty with courage.

    Life can be tragic, I cannot change that; but I can take responsibiliy for my own life and be a free man instead of one who never outgrows the dependancy and restrictions of childhood.

    I wish your friend and you the best.
    So, you think anyone that lives in Canada and Europe are serfs?! That we have no freedom? We have no liberty?!

    I can assure you that we do not live in fairytales or under the yoke of anyone.

    Nobody I know has ever had to declare bankruptcy due to paying for healthcare.

    The mind boggles.
  2. Visit  PRICHARILLAisMISSED profile page
    I guess this is one of those topics that no one will bend on. It doesn't matter what is said to some people, they will pick a stance and defend it no matter what. ONLY IN AMERICA... The land of entitlement.
  3. Visit  Ntheboat2 profile page
    Quote from PRICHARILLAisMISSED
    I guess this is one of those topics that no one will bend on. It doesn't matter what is said to some people, they will pick a stance and defend it no matter what. ONLY IN AMERICA... The land of entitlement.
    This is one of those topics (as demonstrated above, ex: bankruptcy) that everyone has an opinion on until it involves them. It's not okay to get any form of "welfare" until it's YOUR kids who are starving. It's not okay to be a deadbeat regarding your bills until YOU need to file bankruptcy etc, etc.
  4. Visit  Ntheboat2 profile page
    Quote from Fiona59
    So, you think anyone that lives in Canada and Europe are serfs?! That we have no freedom? We have no liberty?!

    I can assure you that we do not live in fairytales or under the yoke of anyone.

    Nobody I know has ever had to declare bankruptcy due to paying for healthcare.

    The mind boggles.
    Canada is way ahead of the US if you ask me. They have more socialized methods (healthcare, education) and still manage not to trample on personal rights like we do here. For example, from what I gather just reading this site, Canada doesn't require drug testing as a condition of employment. Imagine that.
  5. Visit  CountyRat profile page
    What should I have done instead, Ntheboat2? Am I correct in understanding that you believe that the amount of money that I paid to my creditors in the bankruptcy settlement was too low? Is that correct? I am particularly interested in knowing how you handled the financial aspects of keeping your wife and child alive, housed, and fed when you faced this situation. Please respond so that the rest of us can enjoy the hilarity that you find in this kind of situation.
  6. Visit  PRICHARILLAisMISSED profile page
    Quote from Ntheboat2
    This is one of those topics (as demonstrated above, ex: bankruptcy) that everyone has an opinion on until it involves them. It's not okay to get any form of "welfare" until it's YOUR kids who are starving. It's not okay to be a deadbeat regarding your bills until YOU need to file bankruptcy etc, etc.
    Ntheboat2...If an otherwise contributing citizen falls on hard times then I'm ok with helping them out while they are making an honest effort to get back on their feet. But the problem with healthcare funding being automatic is that if people don't even have to feign an effort, then the number of people who choose to utilize the new "Right" will swell. We're in a deficit right now! How are we going to pay for the increase in healthcare spending? Even if it wasn't WRONG to force everyone to pay for others healthcare, where is the money going to come from?

    Even trying to pull this off will simply lower the quality of healthcare for all, as the first attempt to finance this will be a wave of cuts. Surely it will lead to a drop in pay for healthcare workers. How would you-or any of the posters, actually,- like to see a significant increase of federal taxes along with a substantial drop in your pay. Because it will happen!
    Last edit by PRICHARILLAisMISSED on Dec 10, '12
  7. Visit  Ntheboat2 profile page
    Quote from CountyRat
    What should I have done instead, Ntheboat2? Am I correct in understanding that you believe that the amount of money that I paid to my creditors in the bankruptcy settlement was too low? Is that correct? I am particularly interested in knowing how you handled the financial aspects of keeping your wife and child alive, housed, and fed when you faced this situation. Please respond so that the rest of us can enjoy the hilarity that you find in this kind of situation.
    I'm not the one judging others who are asking for help. The fact that you are is what makes it hilarious.

    Yes, it is hilarious that you make statements like this:

    It is my job to take care of my family, in good times and bad, and to do so responsibly, without burdenning you or anyone else.

    Do I complain or demand that others meet my family's needs? No; that would be childish, selfish, and unrealistic.
    When you so obviously weren't responsible with your own money.

    So, you don't think you were a burden to all the companies whose debt you wrote off? You think filing bankruptcy is being RESPONSIBLE?

    Someone who isn't financially capable of providing healthcare for their family is no more irresponsible than someone who isn't capable of paying for TVs or entertainment so they swipe a card and then leave the bill on the creditor's back.

    It's rather ironic...don't ya' think?
  8. Visit  Ntheboat2 profile page
    Quote from PRICHARILLAisMISSED
    But the problem with healthcare funding being automatic is that if people don't even have to feign an effort, !
    We already went over this. People who don't even have to make an effort already get Medicaid and have been getting it for a LONG time. The healthcare bill is designed to help those people who ARE making an effort (aka working) that don't fall into the Medicaid category, but can't afford what their employer offers. It's a pretty simple concept.
  9. Visit  CountyRat profile page
    Quote from Fiona59
    So, you think anyone that lives in Canada and Europe are serfs?! That we have no freedom? We have no liberty?!

    I can assure you that we do not live in fairytales or under the yoke of anyone.

    Nobody I know has ever had to declare bankruptcy due to paying for healthcare.

    The mind boggles.
    I have no quarrel with you or your fellow citizens, Fiona59. I am glad that the people in your circle of acquaintences have never had to file for banlruptcy, and I wish you all continued happyness.

    I shared my point of view without insulting anyone, and never criticised your country in any way. Why does my having a different opinion than you make you so angry?
  10. Visit  MunoRN profile page
    I sympathize with your plight CountryRat and certainly don't think you have any character flaw because you fell on hard times. I had sort of given up on the idea of convincing you that not everyone who needs the help of others is lazy, irresponsible or feels entitled, they just have a rough life. Having experienced that first hand, I would think you'd be easier to convince. Bankruptcy by definition is when you are unable to pay your debts fully, you pay what you can, but the rest of what you owe falls to the rest of us. Personally I'm ok with that, you're a well meaning, responsible person who had some bad luck, just like most people who need some help.
  11. Visit  PRICHARILLAisMISSED profile page
    Quote from Ntheboat2
    We already went over this. People who don't even have to make an effort already get Medicaid and have been getting it for a LONG time. The healthcare bill is designed to help those people who ARE making an effort (aka working) that don't fall into the Medicaid category, but can't afford what their employer offers. It's a pretty simple concept.
    All the while making the employer responsible for making this happen while also making the employer provide insurance or face significant fines. So again, making someone else responsible for cleaning up a mess that they had no part of.

    And as for the first part of your quote (bolded), You already know how I feel about the abusers. But I don't want to get into that and have Admin erase my post for going off topic.
  12. Visit  CountyRat profile page
    Quote from Ntheboat2
    I'm not the one judging others who are asking for help. The fact that you are is what makes it hilarious.

    Yes, it is hilarious that you make statements like this:

    When you so obviously weren't responsible with your own money.

    So, you don't think you were a burden to all the companies whose debt you wrote off? You think filing bankruptcy is being RESPONSIBLE?

    Someone who isn't financially capable of providing healthcare for their family is no more irresponsible than someone who isn't capable of paying for TVs or entertainment so they swipe a card and then leave the bill on the creditor's back.

    It's rather ironic...don't ya' think?
    I obviously did not express myself clearly, since your reply does not answer my questions, so please let me try to pose my questions more clearly. What I asked you was, how much more should I have paid my credtors than the amount that I did pay when my wife and daughter were in danger of dying, and how did you handle this kind of situation when you had to make these decissions?

    As for judging others, what did I write in my post that was judgemental of others?
  13. Visit  wooh profile page
    Quote from CountyRat
    I obviously did not express myself clearly, since your reply does not answer my questions, so please let me try to pose my questions more clearly. What I asked you was, how much more should I have paid my credtors than I did when my wife and daughter were in danger of dying, and how did you handle this kind of situation when you had to make these decissions?
    I think what he's saying is YOU are awful judgmental of others that can't afford their medical bills when you couldn't pay all of your bills yourself.
    Why is bankruptcy, which makes others pay for what you couldn't pay for yourself, such a morally superior option to accepting government assistance, where others pay for what you can't pay for yourself?

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