Had my first doctor scream at me today - page 6
I am a new grad. This is my last week on orientation.. Well today was horrible! Nothing went right! I was crazy busy.. I couldn't find any of my charts because they tend to "float around." Meaning... Read More
Apr 15, '07I find the problem to be one of large ego in small hospital unit (this applies no matter how any beds your unit is in the hospital). I have one Doctor that has been in my face since the start of my senior rotation. Our teacher made 2 hard and fast rules for the rotation. NO IV push, and NO taking doctors orders. When I explained this to one doctor who was insisting on giving me orders, she gave me a very hard time. I smiled at her, fished a hershey kiss out of my pocket and offered it to her in the palm of my outstreached hand without saying another word. I was trying to say "Here is something I can do for you - even though I am not allowed to do other things". Now I have an issue - every time she sees me - she calls me "teachers pet" and tells me she can't wait until I graduate because she has some "orders" for me involving "pushing". I suppose this is simply a matter of "forbiden fruit" and her trying to excersise power over a subordinate that is presently out of her reach. I know it is more than freindly banter because of the frequency and level of persistance on her part. Last wed she noticed I was losing my voice and kindly invited me down to her office for some "special medicine" - mentioned some medicinal throat cream that only she had available. I politley declined the generous offer for "special treatment". I guess power corrupts - but I will continue to hold my ground and follow the rules - they are for my safety. I am very aware that I am at the bottom of the food chain as a nursing student and just want to make it through to get my degree. Trouble I don't need.Last edit by royr on Apr 15, '07
Apr 15, '07Sorry to hear that. I was working in an office and gave the standard 2 weeks notice. I was snubbed by one of the doctors totally, another one yelled at me, and then dismissed my children form the practice. And she had the nerve to say I was being petty and vendictive.
Apr 15, '07Unfortunately the facility that I work in recommends to the nurses to keep their mouth shut to doctors that dog them in public. We are to just take it then write the doctor up on ethical issues. Then the PR person is to deal with the proper channels through the chief of staff. Problem is, the chief of staff is one of the worst. If we would stand up for ourselves and talk back to the doctor like they talk to us we would be wrote up and disciplined. We have on cardiologist that is very rude on the phone at night. I hung up on him one night when he was yelling at me and called the primary physician instead. I explained to him why I called. He, in turn, called the cardiologist and I got my orders. Three days later I got called into my manager's office and got a verbal warning for hanging up on the cardiologist! This is in a facility where the attitude is "if you don't like the way things are, go somewhere else".
Apr 15, '07I had time when I was a new grad and was out of orientation for 2 days. Those two days on my own was bad. Now on the third day I was at the desk when I overhead a PA not a Doctor complain that the surgical patient didn't get up to walk on his 1st postop day- which was the day before. I intervene the conversation and told the PA that the patient got up to the chair but refused to walk during my shift. Being that day we were CNAs short and two nurses called out. So this PA in front of other MDs and PAs starts giving me the riot act basically talking down to me in front of everyone. I guess he was boosting his ego in front of everyone. I even noticed one MD holding his head down trying not to laugh as the PA was tearing into me. I wanted to cry and put my foot up the PA's ass. Then I started noticing that they would start "finding" something wrong with my patients. So I decided to started documenting the times that I had problems with them. When I had enough of evidence....off to human resource I go. Well the PA and MD got a whiff of what I was doing and guess what... it all stopped. They wouldn't speak to me unless it was truely about patient care needs, not what they thought I "should have done" with my patients. Them not speaking to me was a blessing. I don't need for you to speak to me as a means to enjoy my job but YOU will respect me. To this very day (it was 5 years ago) I wished I spoke with my DON about how they were treating me but I was a young nurse with very little experience on how to become a strong nurse. If I were to work with those particular MD and PA NOW, They would be in for a ride.
No job is worth being talked down to. No matter the level of education.. you are still a human being.
Apr 15, '07Hi.
My first post on here. Not my favourite topic but one in which I feel I've got some experience.
I've worked almost ten years in orthopaedics and musculoskeletal trauma theatres. As an operating room nurse in England I circulate, scrub in, act as what I think you would call an instrument tech and assist the surgeons. Yes our theatres are rarely adequaely staffed. So, I spend a lot of time working closely with senior surgeons etc.
Firstly I've noticed there's a period beginning a few months after a surgeon is promoted to a consultant. The responsibilities of his, or her, own lists of patients begins to elevate the stress levels and the surgeon is no longer the pleasant carefree person I used to while away the hours with in theatre, discussing soccer or politics or whatever during surgery.Suddenly the weight of the world is on their shoulders, they don't have time to be pleasant to anyone and don't expect anyone to waste a moment before leaping to their assistance. After a year or two this period normally passes and they return to being civilised people once more.
Secondly. I've noticed, just like everyone else, relationship breakups and divorce hurt surgeons too. On so many occassions, long periods of grumpiness and nastiness and generally mooching around the hospital like a bear with a sore head coincide with marital breakups and expensive divorce settlements. I think surgeons have more than most. And sure enough when it's over, all is calm again. And, goodness me when a new relationship blooms, it's like the sun comes out and spring has sprung. The grouchy old bear is skipping around the hospital smiling at everyone and regularly ( ok, occaisionaly) bringing donuts and cakes for the nurses he works with.
Then one day the surgeon may become a professor. Which means they spend the remainder of their career in a fairly chilled state and nobody gets shouted at anymore.
In my hospital there is a zero tolerance policy toward agressive behaviour, printed notices are strategically placed. I saw one nurse brandishing this notice at a doctor one time, he backed down, walked away.
In the operating room, surgeons learn early that aggressive behaviour is not big and not clever. Since such discretions by their colleagues are often discussed and critiscised by staff during surgery.
When I later discover the reason for bad behaviour, I am understanding but my level of respect for them is diminshed. What's more, I don't expect other staff to have to be so understanding or make any special allowances, that's up to them. I'm pleased to say that I know a handful of surgeons who have ALWAYS remained respectful of others and are genuinely nice people that it is a pleasure to know.
Apr 15, '07Sorry about the screaming. You will have that from some Doctors. You will learn with experience how to handle them. If he was the one who ordered the x-ray I would have reminded him of that or who ordered it tell him, let him know when she is due back, show him where the Drs lounge is or coffee, and go back to work. I had a Dr once ( I worked as a Phone Triage Nurse for several Dr's, about 30 of them) and She said (I have found most of the ones in my neck of the woods most likely to yell are the female Dr's) she would take a few patient's needed to be seen by another Dr who was on Vacation. She was the Dr on call till 2PM. Well I had a patient she said she would see at around 1:30PM. They had a sore throat. At 2:00PM she was on the phone screaming that she needs to leave and catch a flight back to India at 6PM! And why she had a Patient in her exam room! I reminded her she ok'd it. She said but I got behind I can't see her I need to catch my flight! After ranting and raving for about 3 mins (my supervisor and administrator was listening in on the call) She finally said what do I Do! You will make me late to have to catch my flight! I said well I would see the Patient and go. She mumbled something in Indian and slammed the phone down. My Super and Admin. laughed!
I did have another Dr tell me fresh out of Nursing school that he wanted me to follow behind him 5 paces behind him and follow him on his rounds! I looked at him and said I don't walk 5 paces behind my husband I'm sure not starting now! He gave me a glare and I looked right back at him. And he said fine then come on. The other nurses cringed. They said he was one of the meanest Drs at this hospital. He in fact became a nice Dr to me and respected me. He was still snotty to the other nurses. This does not work with all Drs. tho. However, as hard as it may be, I would hold up my head, be proud to be a nurse and do what you were trained to do with all your heart and passion. Learn to roll with those punches. If you do need to cry, find a empty room or bathroom and let it out. Take a few deep breaths, Gather your composer and get back in there.
Apr 15, '07Speaking as one of the people who don't handle confrontation very well, I always have a hard time when anyone yells at me, or is rude to me. I have dealt with docs like this from time to time, and I have gotten a little better at it over the years. But it has taken 8 freakin' years to get to this point! I do this when anyone is rude or yells. I picture my 11 y/o talking to me that way, and deal with the person, more or less, as I would my 11y/o ds. Like this, say the doc comes in the nursery (where I work), and grabs a chart, looking for the lab report for say, a bili. Starts yelling, "where the he!! is the bili, they drew it an hour ago, why haven't you called them, blah, blah, blah." I will take a breath, say "Dr. so and so, I'm sure the lab will send the report, as they always do, as soon as the test is finished. If I haven't received it in a reasonable amt of time I will call them. and I would thank you not to raise your voice or use language like that when talking with me." That does make them stop and think usually. and defuses the situation. We have a couple of nurses that will yell back, and I have noticed that it always makes it worse.
Apr 15, '07Doctors Are The Jerks From High School Days, But Now Have The Title Doctor Jerk. My Response Is Would You Want Me To Talk To You That Way -- Then Don't Think You Have The Right To Talk To Me Like That. My Respect Is Gained And The Next Time He Or She Approaches You Will Be In A Total Different Manner.
Apr 15, '07i am a student and witnessed a surgeon yell at a case manager in the icu dept, i was shocked to say the least. when i heard the other nurses talking about how "he brings so much money into this hopital, he has a right to yell", i was in more shock! what year is this. nobody will ever get 2 secs of my time if they yell at me.
bless your heart, i feel for you. i can't imagine how it would really hit me when it happens to me. i just know i'd walk away. good thing the doc didn't see it get to you.
Apr 16, '07I Have Workled At The State School Since 1974 And I Will Never Forget My First Experience With An Irate Doctor Here. We Had A Mentally Challenged Individual Come Up The The Health Center To See This Doctor Because His Mother Thought He Had Been Sexually Abused Which Was Not The Case But When He Got There And We Were Going To Examine Him He Had Defacated On Himself. He Threw A Chart And Started Berateding Me In Front Of Everyone. All I Could Do Is Walk Away. When I Got Back To The Home I Told My Boss That I Did Not Want To Work With This Doctor Anymore And Cried. Later That Day He Asked My Boss For Me To Come To The Health Center To See Him. He Apologized And We Worked Together Very Well After That Till He Left.
Apr 16, '07This will not be the last you will encounter sadly, and typically I get this glazed over look on my face now when the MD starts getting uppity at me. Sure they are stressed, but so am I....get over yourself MD!
Oh man I had this one time where I was working agency at a hospital I truely never wanted to go back to. They needed help badly, so I said okay to an 8 hour shift. I get on floor and couldn't find a chart or anyone to help me...this was my first time to this floor...I knew nothing, and they were so short staffed no one was there for assistance. I was truly on my own in a world going nuts around me!
Well...I went to assess my first patient...heck, this I can do with no assistance! An MD was in the room along with the pt and his intern. He rudely asked for the pts chart, and I told him "I believe it is out of the rack at this time, I will try to find it Sir". He looked at me and said "well if you can't even find a chart you can't treat a patient...who are you...*noticed my name tag being agency*...oh great, a rent a nurse, I work with incompetance all day as is..now rent a nurses?".
I stood high, no emotion on my face but pure logic..and said calmly "well then Sir, I believe that the critial nurse shortage situation that employed my services at this fine hospital was a lie, and you indeed don't need my help. I will not shadow your doorstep any further". And I left! The patient and intern looked shocked but got a grin!
I left! I am a professional that was just doing a good thing...don't need that stuff! I felt bad for the other RN's, but if they wish to put up with that and continue..fine, me...nope, I am worth more than that!
Another time, much earlier someone called me a trained monkey at that facility...but I have that funny story on here already! It is a great one!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OH that poor MD suffered for so long for that comment from all departments! LOL!!!!! Best get back in the history of that hospital!
Learn to take it in stride dear, you know you are better than that, so you choose your battles well...take it and move on, or leave...that choice is yours and only yours!
Apr 16, '07Wow that bites....but you handled yourself very well...!
Some advice I have been given..."Don't cry, get angry instead...never let them see you cry! and a good response to being yelled at is when they are done....Just say "Are you finished?" and walk away. Hope that helps....remember it is their problem not urs
Apr 16, '07I have to admire those of you who can either think up snappy retorts quickly or at least assertively tell the MDs not to speak to you that way. I'm more likely to sit there, listen to what they have to say, and then when they leave, go cry in the bathroom.
A few months ago, I had a doctor chew me out because I couldn't draw blood from a patient's arterial line or central line. I had no reason to attempt to draw blood earlier in my shift, and the night shift had not reported any problems drawing blood. When it was time for my blood gas and I found I couldn't draw blood, I asked the RT to do a cap. gas (they do them at my facility, not the nurses), so that the gas would be done on time. I was very busy, and didn't have a chance to go speak to the doctor at that instant.
He came up to me and started telling me that if I can't handle a simple problem like that, then I need to get a "higher level" than myself involved and not bother him with things like this because he's too busy to attempt to draw blood from every patient's line. Then he said to me, "Didn't they teach you this stuff in nursing school?" He said this stuff in front of my patient, the family, another nurse, a student RT, and the RT himself. I just stood there and nodded, and when the doctor finally left, I ran to the bathroom and cried.
My nurse manager saw me afterwards, noticed I had been crying, and asked what was wrong. I told her, and she said, "God, I'm so sick of Dr.Yells-a-lot." She went, pulled him into a conference room, and chewed him out, telling him that he was not going to treat her nurses like that. He then apologized to me.
I think it sucks that so many doctors think it's okay to treat nurses that way. If a nurse treated a doctor like that, I'm sure the judgment and punishment would be swift and decisive. Not so for doctors, and I'm not quite sure why.